Peeping Tom

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 23 Dec 2004, and now archived in the Forum Library.

Sushi	23 Dec 2004
If you had to pick out a card from the deck to indicate a peeping tom, which one would it be? Or if you needed more than one to indicate it, what would it be?

Fulgour	23 Dec 2004
Sushi wrote: If you had to pick out a card from the deck to indicate a peeping tom, which one would it be? Or if you needed more than one to indicate it, what would it be? Do you mean like the peeping Tom from Lady Godiva, or an invasive predatory criminal stalking s/his victims?

Sushi	23 Dec 2004
I hadn't put that much thought into it really. I just posted it for discussion's sake. You can give your interpretation for both if you'd like.

Fulgour	23 Dec 2004
I hadn't wanted to think of it at all, but you asked. So, why don't you pick a card and tell us about it?

Thirteen	23 Dec 2004
Fulgour's right, there is a difference. I'd go for 7/Swords, perhaps, for a low-grade, lecherous, Lady Godiva Tom, someone who might take pictures of you on the sly; perhaps the Knight of Swords Reversed meaning (as it were) if he's likely to post those pictures on the internet; Devil for a stalker, a danger to your person.

Adjustment	26 Dec 2004
Thirteen wrote: Fulgour's right, there is a difference. I'd go for 7/Swords, perhaps, for a low-grade, lecherous, Lady Godiva Tom, someone who might take pictures of you on the sly; perhaps the Knight of Swords Reversed meaning (as it were) if he's likely to post those pictures on the internet; Devil for a stalker, a danger to your person. This is a good one Thirteen. the 7 of swords would be the one i would say that the page of swords is the female version of a peeping tom

firemaiden	26 Dec 2004
The thoth Seven of Cups is called "debauch" -- the Thoth-based Lo Scarabeo fairy tarot (Lupatelli/Doyle) shows what looks very much like a "peeping Tom" to me.

tmgrl2	26 Dec 2004
Don't ask me why, but the guy with the grin and the nine cups behind him on RWS versions of Nine of Cups, looks all to smug and innocent. (I looked at RWS and Morgan-Greer) I think something like a "peeping Tom" character lurks beneath that smile. terri

Pook	27 Dec 2004
tmgrl2 wrote: Don't ask me why, but the guy with the grin and the nine cups behind him on RWS versions of Nine of Cups, looks all to smug and innocent. (I looked at RWS and Morgan-Greer) I think something like a "peeping Tom" character lurks beneath that smile. terri In the 9 of cups Terri?? really?? I have always interpreted the 9 of cups to mean something like abundance and fullfillment. I call it the 'wish card' at times even. I suppose I am off to dig out my RWS and have another look. Now the 7 of chalices I could see as a peeping tom. Something about that mix of imagination and fantasy and problems with discerning between good and bad choices.

tmgrl2	28 Dec 2004
Pook wrote: In the 9 of cups Terri?? really?? I have always interpreted the 9 of cups to mean something like abundance and fullfillment. I call it the 'wish card' at times even. I suppose I am off to dig out my RWS and have another look. Now the 7 of chalices I could see as a peeping tom. Something about that mix of imagination and fantasy and problems with discerning between good and bad choices. Me, too, Pook...until the question came up about Peeping Tom and then this was the first face I saw! LOL No accounting for my reading abilities here, I guess. Still don't trust that guy. Yet, when I see the Neuf de Coupes in a Tarot de Marseille, I think only wonderful things. Disclaimer::: This does not mean that I saw this before in the RWS, or that I don't love my RWS cards, all clones included! I do! This was just the first thing that came to me when the question was asked. Of course, nines especially of cups, usually mean for me completions are nearing, creativity, the arts, compassion, spiritual intuition. Maybe reversed? I don't know. Does anyone else every think this when they see the Nine of Cups in the RWS Nine of Cups? terri

Pook	28 Dec 2004
You know, last night after I posted my initial shock reaction to your 9 of cups, I did a bit of reading and found one source that reads.... " The astrological correspondence to this card is Jupiter, known as 'greater fortune.' However, like Jupiter, it sometimes indicates too much of a good thing and laziness and overindulgence in sensual pleasures." !! Sure sounds like a peeping tom to me! How 'bout that? And I thought you were crazy Terri! Looks like I'll be finding a corner to pull my foot out of my mouth now!

tmgrl2	28 Dec 2004
Pook wrote: You know, last night after I posted my initial shock reaction to your 9 of cups, I did a bit of reading and found one source that reads.... " The astrological correspondence to this card is Jupiter, known as 'greater fortune.' However, like Jupiter, it sometimes indicates too much of a good thing and laziness and overindulgence in sensual pleasures. " !! Sure sounds like a peeping tom to me! How 'bout that? And I thought you were crazy Terri! Looks like I'll be finding a corner to pull my foot out of my mouth now! Oh, Pook, you made my day!! I love it!! My quick pic of this card for Peeping Tom was strictly done on an intuitive recollection of the RWS cards. I'm "out there" sometimes with what comes to me, but usually I post it anyhow. This was such a fun question, I couldn't resist. ROFLMHO terri

Thirteen	29 Dec 2004
Pook wrote: " However, like Jupiter, it sometimes indicates too much of a good thing and laziness and overindulgence in sensual pleasures. " !! Sure sounds like a peeping tom to me! While I don't question how you interpet the guy in this card, and while I can see how you might get "peeping tom" out of this definition, it does seem to me that the "laziness" disqualifies. A peeping Tom is actually not lazy--he gets a thrill out of being invasive, and he will sneak and peek and put up cameras and exert all kinds of effort--and put himself in danger for that matter--in order to "peep." Window to window, keyhole to keyhole. He is also very close to a stalker--so the pleasure is not overindulgence or even sensual in that lazy, "give-me-a-massage-and-feed-me-grapes" way. It's an obsessive need that's very close to being sinister. In the end, however, what's really missing is the "peep" aspect. Overindulgence and "sensual pleasure" just aren't enough for me. The 7/cups on the other hand.... firemaiden wrote: The thoth Seven of Cups is called "debauch" -- the Thoth-based Lo Scarabeo fairy tarot (Lupatelli/Doyle) shows what looks very much like a "peeping Tom" to me. A good observation. 7/Cups is all about gazing at images, pleasent images in particular. Peering into keyholes, into windows, or just planting hidden cameras in every room. I don't know that I'd see this card by itself as "peeping tom" but depending on the question and other cards, it could certainly imply either a peeping tom or a voyeur.

jmd	29 Dec 2004
In the original, the comment indicates, perhaps, two things: on the one hand, a person (Tom), who engages in an (undesirable) activity: peeping. I suspect that, for myself at least, this would emerge in a reading by a combination of a number of cards, but at least two - probably a court card indicating a person and a propensity to engage in something, and a 'something' card, or activity in the world. As the act is forever getting to 'see', but never to hold and be with, I would see the person more likely to be represented by either Valet or Knight than either King or Queen. The activity, though totally intrusive, is also, presumably, unknown to the 'victim' (another important concept I would presume the peeping Tom holds dear). There is therefore also an element of deception (already implied above) and a sly element. The valour of a knight just doesn't quite seem to do it... unless perhaps reversed, but even so, it seems to be too engaged and upfront to be engaged in an activity that is far more 'behind the scenes' - or at least hopes that it will remain so. I would have to therefore pick a Valet, and one that allows himself to have as much access to as many places from which to engage in the activity. In some ways, the suits of swords and coins seem to be far more upfront also, and thus not adequate. The activity itself, that slyness already mentioned, seems to be of an obsessive and repeated kind, and one that seems to have both the qualities of abundance and wish-fulfilment. I often associate 'wish-fulfilment' with nines, so would perhaps place either the nine of Batons or the nine of Cups with the act - though reversed if Batons - yet even these tend to suggest more active participation then the fantasy realm one expects to find in the individual. This leaves but two cards in combination (for me at any rate) - but only in terms of this discussion... in an actual reading, myriad cards may show signs that indicates the act or the individual. The cards are the Valet and the nine of Cups.

Rosanne	29 Dec 2004
Ooh you got me thinking, so I rushed to find my beloved weird deck... Navigators of the Mystic Sea. I opt for Seven of swords (ambivalence) _: A violation; a thief. Beware, for you are being watched... is the booklet blurb. But Estensi tells me it is nine of cups reversed. I think I am more inclined to believe Estensi Regards Rosanne

tmgrl2	29 Dec 2004
What a great way to "study" a card as a "concept!" See what you started, Sushi. I still feel the Nine of Cups figure has all the potential. Perhaps a Valet added in with the idea of the Valet having so many opportunities to "peep," since one would assume that the "messenger" aspect or "serving" aspect or even "apprenticeship" of a Valet would carry this soul to many locations or homes or places in the kingdom. Also, androgyny, giving the characteristic to either a man or woman. I definitely do not see a "Peeping Tom" either as being "lazy," since the activity often takes great planning and work in order to achieve both results and anonymity. I am reminded of movies, too, where young women have reported landlords having gone to great lengths to "plant" hidden cameras for recording to view later. Of course, wouldn't have to be a landlord or even a "supervisor" which implies the abundance that the Nine of Cups offers. But that "wealth" of cups/emotions/sexual drive suggested by the cups in the Nine along with that "I have all I want smile" still does it for me. In the RWS, the fact that the cups are behind the person lined up like trophies on a high table like the "head table" at a celebration, plus the red cap the figure wears (high physical energy...lots of planning. Then the long-sleeved floor length garment as if to indicate "purity," hiding the body, like a monk or holy person, contributes even more to the hidden activities possible here. For some reason, whenever I see the Nine of Cups, I think of someone who has "almost" everything the world could offer, except for one thing ..(the Tenth) the number 10. Maybe there is all that money can buy, an overabundance on the emotional/level but one "unfulfilled" area. Since cups, though, can be spiritual, as well, perhaps if there were pentacles lined up behind the figure, the whole idea might come together better. Unless....we move to the RWS Nine of Pentacles and our Peeping Tom is a woman who has everything she desires...almost and has earned her place in life by hard work (training a falcon certainly shows that?) and is somewhat "bored" by not "having it all," and so, engages in the extracuricular activity of peeping.... And from one so lovely.... terri This discussion may RUIN me forever with interpreting the Nines in RWS. (Just kidding...the beauty of readings, is the aspects that come forward within a spread...often surprising)

Thirteen	29 Dec 2004
tmgrl2 wrote: RWS Nine of Pentacles and our Peeping Tom is a woman who has everything she desires...almost and has earned her place in life by hard work (training a falcon certainly shows that?) and is somewhat "bored" by not "having it all," and so, engages in the extracuricular activity of peeping.... Ah, but pentacles are PHYSICAL. Cups I can give you because they have to do with "visions" and emotional thrills and such. The woman in that house, however, wants to possess, wants to TOUCH. She's not going to be satisfied with just a look. Ownership is very important to her. If you're going to go in that direction with her, then you're going to end up with a kidnapper, not a mere peeping Tom. This is more the case of those women who steal toddlers, keeping them and raising them as their own.

tmgrl2	29 Dec 2004
Thirteen wrote: Ah, but pentacles are PHYSICAL. Cups I can give you because they have to do with "visions" and emotional thrills and such. The woman in that house, however, wants to possess, wants to TOUCH. She's not going to be satisfied with just a look. Ownership is very important to her. If you're going to go in that direction with her, then you're going to end up with a kidnapper, not a mere peeping Tom. This is more the case of those women who steal toddlers, keeping them and raising them as their own. Thirteen, how I have missed seeing your posts!! Yes...I do have to agree. She would definitely have to touch and own and end up being a kidnapper!! I love it! terri

DarkElectric	29 Dec 2004
I would say 7 of Swords also. And add the Page of Wands in there as well, in the respect of immature energies which are out of control. There is psychological evidence which suggests that Peeping Toms are extremely immature in their concept of what a normal relationship with women should be. Grown men with the sexual maturity of little boys.

Melpomone18	30 Dec 2004
I personally have always associated the Page of Swords with curiosity, spying and an overall sense of cunning or craftiness. I've had this one come up in readings for friends when they were being warned that someone was out to steal their significant other. Since pages represent a certain level of immaturity, and swords are more mental than emotional, this page could definitely stand for the dirty perverted little boy types who just peek at anyone for the sick thrill of it and not necessarily because they're lusting after that particular victim.

krazymayj	05 Jan 2005
page of swords reversed. see waites writing or lwb from rws. probable in vicinity of seven of swords, ten of cups, and possibly ten of pentacles if your trying to trap him. a peeping tom is a reversed emporer. as always, it depends on where the cards fall.

MeeWah	05 Jan 2005
Page-Swords, Page-Wands & possibly other cards that need not be actually reversed to convey a "peeping Tom" & to also apply to the cyber predators. In a few unrelated readings I saw King-Wands & Knight-Wands as internet predators. Those cards were not reversed & their readings were accurate for the querents. Page-Wands reversed was prominent in a date-rape. In any instance of energy distortion or the expression of the energetic pattern, the cards will describe & a matter of interpretation.

The Peeping Tom thread was originally posted on 23 Dec 2004 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.