Two of Swords (RWS) and a door onto bigger questions

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 11 Mar 2005, and now archived in the Forum Library.

graylensman	11 Mar 2005
I'm working on a color-it-yourself RWS deck, and it is helping me make closer connections to the cards. I am also following Umbrae's direction, in that as I work on each card, I record impressions and interpretations in a journal. I then cross-reference with info available on AT. His comment is that I'll be surprised at how close my interpretations are with those "of books". So-- I'm working on the Two of Swords and the first thing that pops into my mind is "ethics". Having learned that the Twos are working from the potential of the Aces, and that the Twos are also influenced by the High Priestess (revelation of knowledge), what the Two of Swords says to me is "be careful about what you do with the knowledge you now have. Don't blind yourself to the impact your decisions may have." I must admit that I have been reading some writings regarding ethics, particularly how it applies to science. So that may have some impact on my interpretation. Anyway, I then go to check out Thirteen's wonderful synopses on the cards, and I find that nowhere does the concept of ethical choices comes up. In other threads I investigate, again I seem to have missed the mark. This is not the first time it has happened, either. Now, the issue is this. I read many postings by people (more knowledgeable in tarot than I) who recommend that you go with your intuition; that what the card says to you, is the meaning you work with. But I personally believe that there is a basic system or infrastructure that must be learned or else things simply become arbitrary. My analogy is learning an instrument - one must have at least a very basic knowledge of scales, notes, etc. in order to create sounds generally considered to be music. So am I hopeless because I'm not grasping the general, accepted meanings of the cards? Am I doomed to simple memorization? I haven't even begun to do readings yet!

tarotbear	11 Mar 2005
Dear Gray, When I teach my basic tarot class, I tell my students to think for themselves, and even invite them to disagree with me! Just because I wrote a book on the subject does not mean my personal interpretations will never change, nor did they not change while the book went into print. I sometimes look at what I wrote and think some of it is 'corny' compared to what I think about it now. Remember, (quoting Shreck) Tarot is like an onion - it has layers. Today you see one thing; tomorrow you see another. You will read six books that all say 'the sky is blue - the grass is green' - but you see the sky as tourquoise and the grass as peridot. Don't doom yourself to any one interpretation - the world already has a Bunning and a Greer and a MacGregor - come up with your own stuff. You may say 'But I see the Tower as sweetness-and-light-with-sugar-on-top!' Go ahead - why not? You will probably find several readings in the course of your life where that exact interpretation for the card will be right on target. There are no right or wrong answers in Tarot ~ only learning.

Chronata	11 Mar 2005
hey graylensman... Don't sweat it... It sounds to me as if you ARE learning the basic infrastructure of the tarot as you go...and just because you see something in a card that speaks differently than what others say, don't discredit your own feelings! You make the meanings that work for you. That's one of the great ways the tarot works as an intuitive tool. Sure there are basics...but after taking many classes in tarot in my early career...I discovered that even tarot" experts" will disagree about basic meanings! (And I happen to be a person who...more often than not...ascribes the negitive attributes to the Lovers and the positive to the Tower!) I also have to add that the idea behind ethics and morality actually comes up quite often for me in regards to the two of Swords. Often it comes because it reminds me more of justice than the actual Justice card, and when I read for clients, the flash of balancing right and wrong... good intentions vs. negative actions is what comes to my head. Keep doing what you are doing! And you can always add and revise meanings at a later time. I have been reading for 20 something years and I am still learning...and revising!

Sinner	11 Mar 2005
What I usually do, is look at a card and interpret it by myself, then I compare it with traditional meanings of the cards that are written up. In order to introduce some measure of regularity, I usually attemmpt to merge the two meanings together in the context of the situation.

graylensman	11 Mar 2005
Thanks for everyone's generous and encouraging responses. I know this may sound plaintive, but if tarot is open to everyone's potentially differing interpretations, what value does it have then as a tool for personal exploration and/or divination? How can one be certain one isn't just making things up to satisfy a particular wish? Part of what i'm trying to say is, I have experienced tarot in the past as a connection to a greater spirit, cosmic intelligence, manifestation of the collective unconscious ... I'm not sure I can put it in words. But i do understand it as a gateway to something larger than myself; and i want to explore that very much. Maybe i'm trying to approach it as a scientist (which is weird, I'm an artist by nature and profession). Maybe I'm trying to get ahead of where I am on the path. So, Tarotbear, when you encourage your students to think for themselves and to disagree with you, what are you pushing them towards? Thanks again to everyone who's put in time to answer my fractured ramblings!

tarotbear	12 Mar 2005
graylensman wrote: So, Tarotbear, when you encourage your students to think for themselves and to disagree with you, what are you pushing them towards? I am pushing them towrds the realization that when you are dealing with the subjective~ and tarot is purely subjective~ that no ONE opinion is right or wrong. You ask - if tarot is so open to everyone's personal whims and etc then how can it be justified and how does it have value as a tool for personal exploration. It goes back to that horribly trite but completely true statement that 'Tarot Is Not Written In Stone.' Tarot is fluid; it changes with the times, changes with the spread, even changes when the same cards appear in two consecutive threads. Yes, there are 'basic' meanings for the cards ... but the cards don't stop there, since they are based in archetypes. We may all use the phrase 'the conquering hero' in any culture that we come from, but you see him as a knight on a horse, a city dweller sees him as a man in a large shiny car, the Masai see him as a warrior who killed a lion, and someone else sees him as something else. When all these people see the seven of wands - the man seemingly outnumbered by unseen foes - they all have ideas that kick in immediately and transcend whatever they may have just read in a book.

psychic sue	12 Mar 2005
tarotbear wrote: I am pushing them towrds the realization that when you are dealing with the subjective~ and tarot is purely subjective~ that no ONE opinion is right or wrong. You ask - if tarot is so open to everyone's personal whims and etc then how can it be justified and how does it have value as a tool for personal exploration. It goes back to that horribly trite but completely true statement that 'Tarot Is Not Written In Stone.' Tarot is fluid; it changes with the times, changes with the spread, even changes when the same cards appear in two consecutive threads. Yes, there are 'basic' meanings for the cards ... but the cards don't stop there, since they are based in archetypes. We may all use the phrase 'the conquering hero' in any culture that we come from, but you see him as a knight on a horse, a city dweller sees him as a man in a large shiny car, the Masai see him as a warrior who killed a lion, and someone else sees him as something else. When all these people see the seven of wands - the man seemingly outnumbered by unseen foes - they all have ideas that kick in immediately and transcend whatever they may have just read in a book. TB I TOTALLY agree with you. You can't "get it wrong" - like I have said before I may see The Ace of Cups in someones reading and pick up sadness from it. It is such and individual thing, because we are ALL individuals. The reader and the querant. That doesn't mean we or the tarot are not justified.

graylensman	12 Mar 2005
Okay, the light begins to dawn a bit on my dim brain... I'll relax some, and allow the cards to speak to me without worrying that I'm hearing the right language. I understand now that I'm tapping into those archetypes with my own interpretation. Thanks again for your clarification. I promise not to whine so much in the future. (Goes off to find a copy of "Hero With A Thousand Faces"...)

Elven	12 Mar 2005
I can see your dilemma Greylensman, I have come across this as well, seemingly feeling I have jumped ahead of the wagon and have gone off on my own merry path. But, I can see the connection you are making, and I feel that you have shined a light on the two of swords for me. Sometimes I find it difficult to expand on a card and my interpretations seem to fall flat and feel monotinous. This issue of ethics with this card rings a bell for me, (and Im not into science either at the present), but I can see the moral decision which is woven into it. I am interested in which colours and which part of the card you are transfering them to. Your interpretation can certainly be embedded into this card without loosing any of the traditional meanings it holds. Lets us know how its going. Take care Elven x

contradiction	13 Mar 2005
I usually see the 2/sw, as finding a balance, so your interp. of ethics would fit right into that. So you are not as for off as you think. The blindfold, the balanced swords, go along way to pointing toward ethicial situations.

Fudugazi	13 Mar 2005
graylensman wrote: I know this may sound plaintive, but if tarot is open to everyone's potentially differing interpretations, what value does it have then as a tool for personal exploration and/or divination? How can one be certain one isn't just making things up to satisfy a particular wish? You're right, and something I still struggle with, in my 8th year of my study of the Tarot. I think writing down your insights in a notebook will help you - either during study or when you are reading the cards. That way you can verify them over time and see the patterns as they emerge. Tarot is a layered system - any one card can have a multiplicity of meanings, which might be drawn at the moment we need them - often in a reading. It's not fool-proof, however: and it can be used as easily to kid ourselves as to know ourselves better. By the way - I like your discussion of the 2 of Swords as ethical decisions delayed, suspended - and I would add: in gestation. Swords represent the mental realm, and thought without a consideration of ethics do not make much sense. So one way of seeing the card is that it represents thought and ethics cristallising, before the person is ready to make the decision based on this meeting of intellect and ethics - which can lead to suspended action. The way I look at this card has evolved over time, because of family history: my mother has been progressively loosing her eyesight for the past few years, and as she has, her capacity to "see" beyond the ordinary has grown. So in a reading, I often ask myself - what is this character in the card seeing thanks to her blindness? What is she missing because of it?

Major Tom	13 Mar 2005
Helvetica wrote: Tarot is a layered system - any one card can have a multiplicity of meanings, which might be drawn at the moment we need them - often in a reading. It's not fool-proof, however: and it can be used as easily to kid ourselves as to know ourselves better. This is what everyone runs into - just like they were chasing cars. :joke: It's down to belief in the end. Do you believe in yourself? ;) But a scalawag will say to sway your opinion. :laugh:

graylensman	16 Mar 2005
Elven wrote: I am interested in which colours and which part of the card you are transfering them to. Your interpretation can certainly be embedded into this card without loosing any of the traditional meanings it holds. Lets us know how its going. Take care Elven x Elven, here's a quick link I uploaded to the web to display this card: http://home.earthlink.net/~tacallender/graylensmanTwoSwords.htm It's turning out to be one of the cards that has really captured my imagination, and I'm very pleaed with how it turned out. Let me know what you think!

The Two of Swords (RWS) and a door onto bigger questions thread was originally posted on 11 Mar 2005 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.