Who is the Mother?

Thread originally posted on the Aeclectic Tarot Forum on 17 Mar 2005, and now archived in the Forum Library.

jumptothemoonyea	17 Mar 2005
Who is the Mother? Primordial, Cosmic, Earthy, Of Creation? High Priestess, Empress or another tarot card? Though this or similar topics were/are discussed in other threads, fresh opinions would be appreciated. Fool could be a good mother too - being a source for many?

Thirteen	17 Mar 2005
I would say the Empress, first, as she is the gardener, the queen, etc. After that, I'd say The World, as the Yoni, if not the dancer spinning within, is emblematic of the cervix, the birthing of all things. Certainly, the World (or universe) is the greatest "mother" of all--including primordial, cosmic, earthly AND creation. All are covered by this card. Leave us remember that the word "Mother" implies a feminine that gives or has given birth and/or that nurtures and cares for off-spring. In the most relaxed term, someone (sex unimportant) who creates and/or cares for something or someone. I don't know that the Fool fits this definition or any variety of it; he is usually seen as the child, new, fresh and full of potential; but at the point when we see him, he is all just potential--infinate potiential yes, but unrealized as yet. While he MAY give birth to something, he has not as yet given birth to anything. And has, at the point where we see him, as likely a chance to NOT create as he does to create. So I don't think I could relax the term "Mother" enough to see the Fool as a Mom.

Fulgour	17 Mar 2005
Allowing the concept of Trinity as Cosmic All and thus Mother, in the Tarot there is a Triadic Unity of Elements formed thus: The Magician (Aleph) Air-Will Death (Mem) Water-Body The World (Shin) Fire-Soul Rather than a collection of 22 archetypes, Tarot is truly organic. No one part can exist by itself, but together they live and grow.

huredriel	17 Mar 2005
Just tiptoeing in, around all you learned people, how about Queen of Cups? She always strikes me as a very caring motherly type?

rainwolf	17 Mar 2005
I'd say The Empress archetypically, and the queen of cups-person specific. The high priestess seems more of the virgin/temptress/mystic woman, and the world strikes me as synergy, so all the above combined. Huredriel-you are learned!!

WalesWoman	17 Mar 2005
I would say the Empress, she is all about nurturing, reproduction, growth and family, she is the bringer of life. I'd go with the Queen Pentacles to a lesser degree, she is warm, caring, practical and protective, enjoying everything that comes her way, so she'd be a great mother. The Queen of Cups is loving but just really spacey and artsy...sort of a butterfly. Queen Wands would be a good mom...always there in a pinch, if you ever get to see her. I think she's the Super Mom lady, juggling a job, the house, the kids, the carpool, PTA and community civic activities. Seems like she'd be a blur. Queen Swords...great if you plan on a higher education and enjoy talking philosophy, but I don't get a whole lot of warmth from her. I can't think of any other cards that would represent the Mother better than the Empress...

Thirteen	17 Mar 2005
WalesWoman wrote: Queen Wands would be a good mom...always there in a pinch, if you ever get to see her. I think she's the Super Mom lady, juggling a job, the house, the kids, the carpool, PTA and community civic activities. LOL! You hit the nail on the head WalesWoman; Queen Wands is the ultimate soccer mom. But I don't think, unlike the Queen Pentacles or Queen Cups that she slows down enough to really tell the kids that she loves 'em.

rainwolf	17 Mar 2005
i agree waleswoman, analytical mom=friend LOL, not very much warmth there. If you add all the queens together, you end up with the empress.

psychic sue	18 Mar 2005
I think the Empress and the High Priestess are two sides of the same coin. For me the Empress is the Mother side - loving, caring, nurturing - putting her intuitiveness to practical use - a bit like the Queen of Cups. The High Priestess is the darker, "moon" side of woman. The deep subconscious side, and also linking with mestruation (something which a lot of men are still afraid of) and moon cycles. So I suppose the mother side would be the Empress, for me anyway. Sue x

satinangel	18 Mar 2005
rainwolf wrote: If you add all the queens together, you end up with the empress. I had never given this any thought, but now that I've read this post. I agree...the four Queens represent the 4 personality sides of the Empress. Thank you for sharing your insight rainwolf.

WalesWoman	18 Mar 2005
psychic sue wrote: I think the Empress and the High Priestess are two sides of the same coin. I just flashed on what the HP as mother could be, moms (or mine anyway) always seem to have eyes on the back of their head. You can never get anything past them...totally mystified me as a kid that she knew everything, and didn't even need to be in the room to know we were up to no good. It must run in the family, sounds like her mom was psychic as well as intuitive. She told me of the time Grandma sent her into the kitchen to do the dishes and then swatted her with a hair brush for talking back. When my mom said she hadn't said anything, Grandma just looked at her and said, "Well, that was for thinking it!" LOL

Moongold	18 Mar 2005
psychic sue wrote: I think the Empress and the High Priestess are two sides of the same coin.Sue x Ha --- all us ex-Catholics see the High Priestess as being the Mother Rectress.

Fudugazi	19 Mar 2005
To me, the High Priestess/Papess is the primordial, cosmic mother - and she is the grandmother wise and cunning. She is numbered 2, the number of gestation and a feminine number. The Empress, numbered 3, a masculine number, is the creator, the doer. Mothers can be that too :)

psychic sue	19 Mar 2005
WalesWoman wrote: I just flashed on what the HP as mother could be, moms (or mine anyway) always seem to have eyes on the back of their head. You can never get anything past them...totally mystified me as a kid that she knew everything, and didn't even need to be in the room to know we were up to no good. It must run in the family, sounds like her mom was psychic as well as intuitive. She told me of the time Grandma sent her into the kitchen to do the dishes and then swatted her with a hair brush for talking back. When my mom said she hadn't said anything, Grandma just looked at her and said, "Well, that was for thinking it!" LOL My poor sons! They live with me and MY mother. Nothing gets past either of us. She will say to me "there's something up with James" and I will say "I know" - the poor lad! My youngest doesn't bother trying to pull the wool over our eyes now. His friend recently had to have an operation on his foot. He asked if he could go and see him in hospital with another friend "and his mother". I said fine, it was ok if the mom was going (the hospital is in central Birmingham - not a nice place to be in the early evening when visiting time is). I knew something was not right but I said nothing. 10 minutes later he came in and said "mom, I can't lie to you. You always find out. We are going on our own". I praised him for being such a good lad, and as a compromise (because I couldn't go that evening) I let him phone the lad instead. So I think that is an example of the Empress and the High Priestess working in tandem!!! By the way, I'm not unique. When you have that special mother-child bond, I believe you are connected in a very special, spiritual way. That's why it seems we have eyes in the backs of our head!

kwaw	19 Mar 2005
The image of the Popesse may be seen as a conflation of the figures of Ecclessia and Mary, that is Mother Church and the Bride and Mother of God, so there are clear connotations of the 'holy mother' and all that may imply. There is also the Empress, 'mother of the empire'. The figure of the TdM world may be a conflation of the anima mundi/holy spirit with Eve, the Mother of Mankind. The conflation of the Eve with Cosmos [il mondo] would indicate hermetic influence, in which the cosmos is also figured as Mother of Mankind. Kwaw

The Hierophant	19 Mar 2005
Being so new to the Tarot ---justed wanted to say that I am stuck on this card in that it is always coming into my mind more than the others. And something keeps telling me that the High Priestess holds the key to theTarot whatever that means if anything and I can't really say at this point why I feel that but maybe in time I will know whether that has any validity or not or at least know why I am feeling that.

The Who is the Mother? thread was originally posted on 17 Mar 2005 in the Using Tarot Cards board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the active threads in Using Tarot Cards, or read more archived threads.