Interpreting Minors in Marseilles Decks

Bernice

Oh Mel, you've been hiding your light under a bushel (mound of chocolate cakes?). This is a GREAT spread! I'm waiting now for the next installment.... are you gonna use Witnesses & the Judge? (Geomancy).

HoT, thank you for the cookies. :)

Bee
 

eugim

Dear M...
Seems as you became the Marcello Mastroianni of Aeclectic for the Gaaarrrllllsssss !

Congratuations !

Gryphon E
 

Melanchollic

frelkins said:
I guess my question is about the speed thing, because i tend to associate 8s as the active moving number. So I'd like to hear more about that even-odd thing of yours.

In The Metaphysics, Aristotle writes,

"Other members of this same school (the Pythagoreans) say there are ten principles, which they arrange in two columns of cognates - limit and unlimited, odd and even, one and plurality, right and left, male and female, resting and moving, straight and curved, light and darkness, good and bad, square and oblong. In this way Alcmaeon of Croton seems also to have conceived the matter, and either he got this view from them or they got it from him; for he expressed himself similarly to them. For he says most human affairs go in pairs, meaning not definite contrarieties such as the Pythagoreans speak of, but any chance contrarieties, e.g. white and black, sweet and bitter, good and bad, great and small. He threw out indefinite suggestions about the other contrarieties, but the Pythagoreans declared both how many and which their contraricties are."

*Aristotle's Chart of Opposition*


Limited.............Unlimited

Odd..................Even

One..................Plurality

Right................Left

Male................Female

At Rest............Moving

Straight...........Crooked

Light...............Darkness

Good...............Bad

Square............Oblong



And, my slightly reworded version..




*Melanchollic's Chart of Opposition*


ODD...........................EVEN

indivisible.................divisible

singular....................plural

right...........................left

male......................female

active.....................passive

direct.....................indirect

fluctuating.................stable​


I've switched active (moving) and passive (at rest) from Aristotle.

Due to the associations of the square and solidity with the tetrad (4), the hexad (6) being the first solid number (even if scalene, nevertheless it is three-diminsional because of its means), and symbolic of harmony and order, the Octad being the first actual cube and the eighth sphere being that of the fixed stars, I tend to view the even numbers as being 'at rest' and 'passive', though the position could certainly be argued against. Hopefully Aristotle isn't reading this. :bugeyed:


frelkins said:
Also, what do you do with all these other cards? Ignore 'em?

Yes. Generally, just the relavant houses are looked at, which of course is the same for a horary or geomancy reading. There are certain times when other cards may be considered to play a minor role.

frelkins said:
Is this the actual spread on that you show to the sitter? On this chart-paper?

Pretty much, yes. I arrange the cards a bit tighter, with about 1 cm between them, but without the 'chart-paper'.

frelkins said:
And does it say something that this sitter seems to have so little baton-energy at this time? Only one baton card?

For this type of specific question reading, no. For an 'overview' type reading I look at the overall 'goodness' of the figure by comparing malefic and benefic elements.


frelkins said:
What would the two 7s say to you?

In this particular reading, it would tell me that the University of Kyoto had recently undergone some sort of examination by an institutional accrediting organization, and this event had indirectly had a positive influence on the querent's acceptance to the university.


eugim said:
Dear M...
Seems as you became the Marcello Mastroianni of Aeclectic for the Gaaarrrllllsssss !

Congratuations !

Drats!! I was really shooting to be the John Cusack of Aeclectic. ;)




More to come...

M
 

Bernice

The 2 7s: Yes Mel, I would agree. But would probably have used less eloquent phrasing :)

Loving your system. I've digested your illustrated de-luxe post and eaten the cookies. More please.

Bee
 

eugim

M:
Could we add Funk (Fonk) opposite to Metal Rock ?
So Cameo -Iron Maiden ?

Sorry...
 

Melanchollic

Dee-luxe Illustrated Example Readings - Part 3

Example #2

astro-reading02.jpg


Okay. Let's look at one that's a bit harder, and makes use of more of the cards. The querent has had a fight with his girlfriend and wants to know if there is hope for reconciliation. The card in the first house, the house of the querent, is the Eight of Coins, and in the seventh house, the house of the querent's girlfriend, is the Valet of Baton.

So, following my Rule of Thumb #1, I'll start general, and then beam in to specifics. The quick answer is "Maybe". "Ta-Dah!! That'll be 20 bucks mister... and have a nice day." :D The querent is moderately positive (Coins), and the quesited is moderately negative (Batons). Pretty vague. We're going to have to dip into the ol' toolbox for this one...


Conjunction

Here is another method I've shamelessly stolen from medieval Geomancy. Conjunction is when one of the significators, either by suit or by number, passes to a house next to the house of the other significator. Conjunction is seen as a positive thing (slightly lesser so than occupation), showing a 'connection' between the querent and the quesited. When the querent's significator passes to a conjunction with that of the quesited, as shown in this example, the querent will achieve what he or she wants, but will have to work for it (go to it). When the significator of the quesited passes into a conjunction with that of the querent, on the other hand, no effort by the querent is needed (it comes to them).

So, in our example, the querent is a Coin, and there is a Coin in the house next to the quesited. We have conjunction. This shows that if he makes an effort, and goes to her, a reconciliation is possible. She won't come to him though.


Passing

Passing is just a fancy way Geomancers use to say that the same figure is in more than one place in the chart. The passing of a significator, either by suit or by number, should be examined, even though it may have no direct relationship on the outcome of the question. It may show the motivations of those signified, helping us to determine some of the 'whys'. There are several good examples of passing in this reading.

We've already seen how the passing of the Five of Coins gives us a conjunction with the quesited. We find an eight (of Batons) in the 10th house which relates to the querent. The 10th house rules career. The batons are symbolic of laboring. We can deduce the querent is focused on the demands of his job, and this may have been a source of friction in the relationship. We also find an eight (of Swords) in the twelfth house. The twelfth is the house of secret enemies. The presence of some nasty malefic swords is not good. Someone may be working against our hero in this affair!

Now let's look at the girlfriend, who is signified by the Valet of Batons. There is another Valet (Cups) in the third, and the Two of Batons in the fifth. As these cards relate to the person represented by the 7th house, we have to examine these cards in relationship to the 7th. This is called Turning the Chart. So the 3rd house of the querent becomes the 9th house of the girlfriend, because it is the ninth house from the 7th house. So the 9th house of the querent is not his girlfriend's 9th house. Just start at the significator of the girlfriend, she being 1, and count the houses till you get to the Valet of Cups. There are nine, right? Similarly, the Two of Batons is in the girlfriend's 11th house.

The 9th house represents travel. This may be an indication she is hoping to take a trip. Our hero might suggest a trip in order to win her back.

The eleventh house represents friends. The 'two' card can show something divisive. A divisive friend? This, coupled with our querent's "secret enemy' in his twelfth house, show that one of the girlfriend's friends has been 'bad-mouthing' our hero, and influencing the situation.

So, what would I tell the querent?

"A reconciliation is possible, but it must be initiated by you. She doesn't like the amount of time you spend working, and wants you to devote more time to her. Also, one or more of her friends have been speaking against you. You might suggest the two of you take a holiday somewhere together."

Our first quick impression of "maybe" still holds true, but now we have some of the possible 'whys' and 'hows', so the querent has a little more to work with when considering the best approach to making the reconciliation.


:CL Mel
 

frelkins

Whoa! Mel! Wig me out! Kewl.

Ok just a gazillion questions. If the 2 of Batons is next to the girlfriend's Valet Batons, why doesn't the 10 of Batons also "belong" to the girlfriend? It is next to her or "passing" too, isn't it?

And "turning the chart" -- you are always counting counterclockwise? Just to start. . . :)
 

Melanchollic

frelkins said:
Whoa! Mel! Wig me out! Kewl.

Ok just a gazillion questions. If the 2 of Batons is next to the girlfriend's Valet Batons, why doesn't the 10 of Batons also "belong" to the girlfriend? It is next to her or "passing" too, isn't it?

And "turning the chart" -- you are always counting counterclockwise? Just to start. . . :)

Hi frelkins,

You mean the 8 of Batons (in the 10th) house, right? Yes! :D Well spotted! It would be a card to look at. This might require a little 'grilling' of the querent. This would be the girlfriend's 4th house. The 4th could symbolize her property, or her home life, or her parents in general, any of which may be in a 'labored' state, contributing to the couples friction. A little feedback from the querent might help verify exactly what it means. The card might also simply be showing that his work situation is directly affecting her.

Yes, the turning always moves counterclockwise. The peculiarities of the astrological chart, are of course based on actual astronomical movement, even when they've been commandeered by geomancers and tarot readers.
 

frelkins

thanks Mel. Think I'm getting this. Ok, so what about the "mutation" & "translation?"

Btw, is that deck the big USG Visconti or the LS Gold? :)