Thread: Horary DIY
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Minderwiz  Minderwiz is offline
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Join Date: 20 Apr 2002
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Originally Posted by SilentBreeze
I started reading through this and I have a few things I'm confused about... The essential dignity chart in Morimus. I can't figure out how your read it. So the two columns do you read it where two of the same planets intersect on both axises? What are all the other planets then? So if you want to find out an essential dignity of a planet, how do you figure it out on the chart since there are to axises where you can correspond two different planet? I hope this makes sense.
The table produced by Morinus is quite large and not presented in the best possible way for the purposes of horary. Both Solar Fire and Janus are much better in this respect but both cost serious money.

I've attached a copy of a section of the Morinus table for Nytebugg's horary and I'll use that for the explanation. The top row and the first column are used for the look ups. They contain the planets in order. Consider the row of planetary symbols at the top the 'header' row, and header column, rather like an Excel spreadsheet'

The first eight non header rows of the full table are the planets, Saturn to Moon and the Point of Fortune. The order is the traditional one of starting with the planet furthest from the Sun and working inwards. Note that Venus Mercury and Moon lie between the Earth and the Sun and therefore the Sun does not come at the end of the list.

To read the table look up the planet that you want to consider in the header column - that is the first column on the left with just the planet symbols. Let's take Venus as an example. Venus is the fifth planet down in this column. The row with Venus at the left gives you the information about Venus. In the first non header column you get it's position in the chart, in this case 8 degrees 39 minutes 25 seconds of Pisces. The second non header column has Saturn in the header row. This column will tell you if Venus is in any of the dignities of Saturn. It's got a '1' in it. This means that Venus is in the lowest dignity of Saturn - the Face or Decan of Saturn. The next column along is headed by Jupiter and has a '5' in it. This tells you that Venus is in the highest dignity of Jupiter - Jupiter is the sign ruler of Pisces. The columns headed Mars and Sun are both blank, so Venus is not in any dignity of Mars or the Sun. The column headed Vanus tells you whether Venus is in any of her own dignities. In this case we have' 4+3+2'. This tells you that Venus is in three of her own dignities. The '4' is exaltation (Venus is exalted in Pisces). The '3' tells you that Venus is in her won Triplicity (Venus rules the Water Triplicity by Day) and the '2' tells you that Venus is in her own Terms. The terms are 5 uneven divisions of a sign but if you want to know the start and finish of Venus' Terms in Pisces you can look at the chart posted for Nytebugg;s horary, where the Terms are the ring just below the degree markers.

What we are looking for is really the cell where the planet's row and column intersect. In the case of Venus the cell containing '4+3+2'. This cell tells you that Venus has essential dignity in the chart - it's in one or more of it's own dignities (in this case 3 of it's own dignities).

By contrast if you look at the row above (for the Sun) and move across to the column headed by the Sun, you will see no score at all in this cell. The Sun is not in any of it's own dignities - so it is Peregrine, a debility which scores -5

As well a planet can be in debility by Detriment (also -5) or Fall (-4). These are a position in the sign opposite its own rulership or exaltation, respectively. Sadly Morinus doesn't give these directly so you need to know not only the signs of rulership and exaltation but also to do a quick check for Detriment or Fall. Again Solar Fire and Janus provide this information directly.

Originally Posted by Silent Breeze
Also is there somewhere I could look up some of these terms? I think I remember seeing a link on this board, but I cant find it any more.
Yes I remember writing about it but can't give you an immediate link. Given that it's quite important to horary I'll put in a separate post on it later today.

Originally Posted by SilentBreeze
Also to figure out which sign a house is in when it's not exactly on that house, do you take the sign that comes first, no matter how much of it falls in the actual house? Is that correct?
You take the sign which contains the House Cusp. So if the House cusp is 29 degrees Pisces, Jupiter rules the House even though the majority of the House may be in Aries or even extend into Taurus. Now one of the considerations for judgement is to avoid charts with very early or late degrees rising for the Ascendant, but even if we do that, there's always a chance of late degrees on other House cusps, including the Tenth (MC) and fourth (IC). The only way to avoid this is to both avoid early or late degrees for the Ascendant and use whole sign houses. In practice whilst this can occur it's not really a major problem, as long as you are consistent in your use of houses - that is keep to one house system for your horaries.

Originally Posted by SilentBreeze
I'm also confused about having co-significators. So when that happens, how do you synthesize the information you get. So as long as one of them has a connection with the planet the represents the question, then it's a good sign? What does it then mean that 2 of the other planets that represent the quarent don't have any connection with the planet that represents the question?
Nyteebugg asked a common question about romance and relationships, one which you will get a lot as a horary Astrologer. This is also the type of question that causes the most confusion with new readers, because it allows for more than one set of significators, according to Lilly.

My method is to go in order as follows:

1. Evaluate the significators for the Querent and Quesited using the Ascendant ruler and the relevant house ruler. And check to see if there is any connection that will lead to the matter concerned being perfected - that is the question receives a 'Yes' answer Remember here to check for Antiscia and or mutual receptions. Also we will later come across other ways of establishing connection as we go on. If it is not a relationship question then go to #3

2. If and only if it is a relationship question and there is no 'Yes' from #1 look at Sun and Venus Again check for condition and connection. You can in this case use Sun or Venus with the original significators at this stage providing you are pairing one 'his' significator with one 'hers' significator. In the Nytebugg horary there is a connection by antiscion between Saturn and Venus but as these are both significators for Nytebugg they say nothing about the quesited and hence the matter being perfected.

3. If there is still no connection or it is not a relationship question check the Moon for a chance of perfection. The Moon too should be evaluated, in Nytebugg's question it's peregrine and in it's own detriment. So whilst the chance is created there's no certainty Nytebugg will see it or will want to take it if she does see it.

Originally Posted by silent Breeze
I know lots of questions...but I'm trying to process all the information...Thanks
There is a lot of information for the beginner. The key issue I face is whether to provide the information before looking at a horary, or do some examples with incomplete information . One carries the risk of just being boring and not really being understood. The other carries the risk of being not completely followed. However I much prefer to do a few horaries and use them for illustrating the learning process, rather than make up partial examples.

However I expect requests for clarification or more information, like this one and it allows me to put in some more information, knowing it happens to be relevant for the current stage of your learning. So keep them coming

Incidentally I did some posts on horary in the Traditional Approaches thread so here's the link
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