jmd
A number of weeks ago, Le_Pendu and I were conversing privately about a number of Tarot issues, with specific careful attention being paid to especially various early Marseille decks, images for which are either online, on re-published decks (and a huge thankyou and acknowledgement to both Kenji for earlier finding copies of the Dodal, and to J-C Flornoy for taking the precious time to make both the Dodal and the Noblet in such wonderful renditions).
One of the quite obvious factors is that there are three decks that are so similar as to be copies of each other: the Jean Payen, the Jean-Pierre Payen... and the Dodal.
If one also looks at the dates of the Payen (possibly father and son?), they seem to occur just prior to and just after the Dodal, with much overlap. In detail, the Dodal appears to also have elements of each... but there is also a really telling sign that the Dodal hides something in plain view (and obviously noted, though not mentioned anywhere that I can see, by J-C Flornoy).
The first is that the Dodal is specifically made for the export market - so perhaps the same craftsman (or woman) woodcarver could have worked on the Payen and the Dodal, without loss of 'face'. The second is that their location has both proximity to each other, yet located under different rulerships: Lyons and Avignon.
But the last is the giveaway, for, upon the Dodal, beneath the tail of the right-hand 'dog' on the Moon card are the initials of Jean Payen.
This would fit with an earlier than a later carving of the woodblock for the Dodal as a deck closer to 1701 than to 1713 (as currently generally thought), with the carving perhaps even dating from a decade earlier (though this is taking it further than really warranted).
Perhaps, too, there may have been some financial agreement made between Dodal and Payen as to markets to which the former was permitted to supply, with Payen 'hiding' his initials as a safeguard. After all... how many have up till now noticed it?
One of the quite obvious factors is that there are three decks that are so similar as to be copies of each other: the Jean Payen, the Jean-Pierre Payen... and the Dodal.
If one also looks at the dates of the Payen (possibly father and son?), they seem to occur just prior to and just after the Dodal, with much overlap. In detail, the Dodal appears to also have elements of each... but there is also a really telling sign that the Dodal hides something in plain view (and obviously noted, though not mentioned anywhere that I can see, by J-C Flornoy).
The first is that the Dodal is specifically made for the export market - so perhaps the same craftsman (or woman) woodcarver could have worked on the Payen and the Dodal, without loss of 'face'. The second is that their location has both proximity to each other, yet located under different rulerships: Lyons and Avignon.
But the last is the giveaway, for, upon the Dodal, beneath the tail of the right-hand 'dog' on the Moon card are the initials of Jean Payen.
This would fit with an earlier than a later carving of the woodblock for the Dodal as a deck closer to 1701 than to 1713 (as currently generally thought), with the carving perhaps even dating from a decade earlier (though this is taking it further than really warranted).
Perhaps, too, there may have been some financial agreement made between Dodal and Payen as to markets to which the former was permitted to supply, with Payen 'hiding' his initials as a safeguard. After all... how many have up till now noticed it?