Thoth Prince of Swords

Prince of Swords

I must admit when I first read the BoT on the Prince of Swords and later DuQuette's opinion, I was stunned at how accurately it fitted aspects of my personality. It was just like AC knew me. I learned a little bit more about myself. He was "spot on" about my wife too! That convinced me that the Court cards in divination represented real people because of their astrological attributes.

When I started reading the cards that way, a lot of things fell into place. It helped me a lot in readings and made them a lot of fun!

In response to my question of Crowley writing on the Prince of Swords, "Do you think he could be describing himself? - Aeon responds: "

Aeon418 said:

No. Crowley saw himself in the Prince of Wands.

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Crowley could declare he saw himself in the Prince of Wands, without ruling out identification with other cards --- obviously, no court card can describe all the aspects of one person. It would be dangerous and foolish to suppose one tarot card could circumscribe the character of any human being -- limitless as we are, and participating as we do, in all of humanity/animality.

I believe we can understand of others only what we know of ourselves; in the Prince of Swords he would be describing a part of himself, a part of me, of you, --- because it is an aspect of humanity....

To broaden the perspective a little away from "character" -- here is a card which describes "la déchirure" -- the ripping apart--- between God and Man which awareness of existing (as a unique and separate entity) imposes. The card describes the human condition.... of existential crisis.

DuQuette says: "The final version is full of mad, seemingly futile movement." and "The children pull at the chariot "irresponsibly" in any direction that takes their fancy; they are not reined, but perfectly capricious."

I don't know what deck he's looking at, but I see children who are reined in. There is no futile movement. The Prince has his sword & sickle and is moving forward with control and purpose.

Yeah, I don't see "children" - I see green replicas of the same jolly green giant... in miniature. "mini me's"...

But on the other hand... the prince looks just like my father when he wore the green leotard and tights... to be a frog in an opera. Oh, I'm sorry, I mean to say, "a mother frog, in an opera".

Aeon418 said:

On the positive side the "steeds" could also indicate a flexible, curious, and inquisitive mind. Always willing to explore new ideas, and travel along unfamiliar avenues of thought. It could be the kind of mind that likes to seek out knowledge for it's own sake.

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Interesting. I had been contemplating along these lines this morning, about the distinction between commitment to one school of thought and its application, and learning all thoughts (as far as that is possible) to provide a broader perspective - this last would entail much in the way of detachment.

firemaiden said:

To broaden the perspective a little away from "character" -- here is a card which describes "la déchirure" -- the ripping apart--- between God and Man which awareness of existing (as a unique and separate entity) imposes. The card describes the human condition.... of existential crisis.

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Wonderful! Yes, this is a brilliant way to put it. And if I may take it further, I would say that this is because of the "concentrated Tiphareth" here (thankyou, Aeon, as always). Because by channelling all of one's energy into that one facet of existence, as characterised by the element Air and all its attendent associations, one creates the possibility for the existential crisis, the mental breakdowns, the extreme confusion. To sound like a broken record, balance is needed; the Air must be weighed down and provided with an anchor and direction.

\m/ Kat

Abrac said:

DuQuette says: "The final version is full of mad, seemingly futile movement." and "The children pull at the chariot "irresponsibly" in any direction that takes their fancy; they are not reined, but perfectly capricious."

I don't know what deck he's looking at, but I see children who are reined in. There is no futile movement. The Prince has his sword & sickle and is moving forward with control and purpose.

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Hmm, good point. I see them throwing tantrums . . . or perhaps writhing in agony, as though some supersonic wave of energy is torturing their minds, while the "jolly green giant" . . . you can almost hear him screaming, abusing them in frustration and calling down every curse under the Sun to try to get them to do his bidding . . . but they don't know what it is, because not even he knows what he wants. There is great discord here.

\m/ Kat

thorhammer said:

And if I may take it further, I would say that this is because of the "concentrated Tiphareth" here (thankyou, Aeon, as always). Because by channelling all of one's energy into that one facet of existence, as characterised by the element Air and all its attendent associations, one creates the possibility for the existential crisis, the mental breakdowns, the extreme confusion. To sound like a broken record, balance is needed; the Air must be weighed down and provided with an anchor and direction.

\m/ Kat

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What is tiphareth energy?

Aeon explained it pretty well at the top:

Aeon418 said:

All the Princes are associated with Tiphareth by the formula of YHVH.

Yod - Knights - Chokmah
Heh - Queens - Binah
Vav - Princes - Tiphareth
Heh - Princesses - Malkuth

The special thing about the Prince of Swords is that he is not only a Prince and therefore related to the letter Vav and the sephiroth, Tiphareth, but his own element is Air, which also relates to the letter Vav and Tiphareth. Of all the Princes he is the most.... erm.... Vav-ey. If the energy of this card could be focused in one place it would be like concentrated Tiphareth. None of the other Princes have this quality.

It is a quality that is shared by the Knight of Wands, Queen of Cups, and the Princess of Disks, in their respective sephiroth/element combinations.

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Does that help?

\m/ Kat

Crowley's basic premise is one of "mad, seemingly futile movement." DuQuette more or less follows suit. But Frieda Harris' input from the LWB is interesting insofar as it gives an idea of what she was going for: "The Prince conveys two ideas, one is simply hail (not sure what she means here), the other the restriction of the scientific outlook, which uses but limits the imagination which is shown in the harnessed fays." Her premise is one of control rather than anarchy, and the fact that the Prince has reins in his hand seems to support this.

If you start from the premise of control, the sickle then becomes something different than a symbol of death, taking into account that it can be a symbol of life or death. Death is unpredictable and "chaotic," but I don't believe this card represents chaos. Capricorn (to which this card partially corresponds), being the beginning of the winter solstice, is more closely aligned with rebirth than with death. All things considered, the sickle seems to me as simply a symbol for Saturn, of fertility or maybe of time itself, i.e. the (orderly) cycles of time. From the Dictionary of Symbols: "It (the sickle) was an implement which Cronos used to castrate his father Ouranos (Uranus) to prevent untimely creation.

Abrac said:

All things considered, the sickle seems to me as simply a symbol for Saturn, of fertility or maybe of time itself, i.e. the (orderly) cycles of time. From the Dictionary of Symbols: "It (the sickle) was an implement which Cronos used to castrate his father Ouranos (Uranus) to prevent untimely creation.

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That is interesting. Do you think this Jolly Green Giant is a supposed to be Chronos? (That would be cool) (she said, going off to consult Thoth)