where to start with TdM?

[dawntarot]

Greetings!

I will soon be receiving my first TdM from Wendywu I'm really excited, but I also have no idea where to begin with learning this new system. I've looked in the index here and tried a couple of searches but everything I've found so far has been pretty complex... I really need a sort of 'TdM for Dummies' if such a thing exists?

Thanks for your help!
Dawn

[Wendywu]

This is a useful index by Moonbow* of helpful threads detailing various peoples' methods. I'm afraid there is no written-in-stone method - everyone kind of devises their own using ideas they get from others, books, sudden flashes of inspiration ....

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=141823

This thread is very good for Lee's method of pips as trumps -

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=165645

and this is excellent for intuitive reading

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=172156


My chosen method is Enrique Enriquez' way plus a dab of numerology and a bit of thought to the elemental aspect of the suit, and some wild intuitive leaps. Add in some "this makes me think of so and so" and a look at what the vines and flowers are doing gives me a method that usually works for me .

This forum is the best learning resource - the "how may it be read" threads are brilliant and the discussions over the years have been wonderful. Oh the hours I've spent here - and will spend - digging out gems from past (and present) members!


The best book I've come across is Jean Michel David's "Reading the Marseille Tarot" available cheaply on line from Lulu (which was a huge hassle but worth it in the end) or you can buy it from them but it's not cheap. And I bought a copy of Robert O'Neill's Tarot Symbolism (the reprint)

from jmd's site here http://association.tarotstudies.org/publications.html and think those two will be my study book for quite some time to come.

[dawntarot]

Hi Wendy! Thank you for the pointers!

Somehow I encountered this post which I think I'll use as my starting point, and see where that takes me.

I also need to read up on colours as I'm not sure my own associations will be applicable in such historically-based decks as these... Just as an example, in bygone days pink was a man's colour, and look at how that's changed!

Oh my, I'm so excited...

Dawn

[Sulis]

I read very differently with TdMs than with RWS based decks - I don't use Thoth, all that esoteric stuff just doesn't gel with me at all.

With RWS decks I tend to look at the individual meaning of each card as the first thing, just because that's what how the pictures seem to affect me - I see a card, on it's own and the meaning jumps out then I link the meanings and add in positional meanings.

With TdMs I don't use positional meanings unless in a very fluid way and I look at the spread as a whole without individual card meanings until later...
I look at the patterns, the vines - are they dying or growing. Is there space in the cards - even numbers are usually more stable and there seems to be more space to grow etc there..
The picture cards really do stand out in a spread too.
Do any elements change into different things as the spread goes on? Is The Pope's staff still there in another card but changed into something else for example?

I follow the eye-line of the characters and add more cards to see where they are looking and I don't always read from left to right, I read the way the spread seems to be flowing so that could be left to right, from the centre out, from the outside in or from right to left.

I use numbers, elements and I link the Minors to the Majors but all this comes after the initial looking at the whole thing together. I find it a much more natural and organic way of reading than with the pictures on the RWS.

I think that you should read through some of the TdM circle threads because in those, readers describe how they got what they got and everyone reads these decks differently. It's that freedom that I think makes them much more intuitive (for me anyway) than decks that have scenes on every card.

[Wendywu]

Totally agree - I love reading with TdM's - so much more freedom!

I don't like the layers of additional gubbins that some RWS decks pile on the cards - I just want to work with the very basics and let the intuition run a bit

[dawntarot]

From what I can gather, the difference between RWS and TdM is like the difference between reading a book and going to the theatre respectively... If you want a specific pattern and structure, use RWS... If you want to see some live action, go TdM! Both have merit, just depends on taste and preference...

As far as the trumps go - are they read in a similar way to the RWS ones, ie have fixed meanings? Or are they simply read intuitively as per the pips?

Thank you
Dawn

[Wendywu]

I really recommend the "How may it be read" threads - you get lots of different takes and they're such useful threads

[Sulis]

Originally Posted by dawntarot

As far as the trumps go - are they read in a similar way to the RWS ones, ie have fixed meanings? Or are they simply read intuitively as per the pips?

Thank you
Dawn

Well for the trumps, they're archetypes so they seem to have themes or lessons in them so to an extent they have sort of set meanings.
Then again, I read them intuitively too but I don't think you do just see anything in the trumps because of the universality and archetypal qualities that they have.

[Wendywu]

I see the Empress very differently. I am doing jmd's course and did a study on Empress's back in the days when TdM originated and they weren't earth mothers, and now I don't see her in that light at all. And Popes are much kindlier and yet more authority figures than they were for me. I didn't like RWS popes much but I like the TdM ones

[dawntarot]

So in a way, it's like a halfway point between taking the archetype for what it is (as I tend to do for RWS), and pure intuition... interesting! I really am dying to get my hands on my new deck, I think I will burst if for some reason it doesn't arrive tomorrow! Haven't been this excited for ages, I feel like a little kid on Christmas morning

I'm definitely going to go through as many threads as I can find time for This is all so fascinating. I'm going to go to the library soon and see if I can't get my hands on some history books that deal with the creation of card games generally. They've become such a HUGE thing, almost as revolutionary as the printing press IMO. I played cards constantly with my friends at school but never really considered where they came from. They just Existed, and That Was That.

Dawn