How do you interpret's Thoth's Devil in a reading?

TenOfSwords said:

The animal side of man. Most people attribute this to something sinful, but in itself, it's beautifull!! it's the basic human (and animal obviously) urge...

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Good point. We have to remember we are animals (but not just animals). When we forget that, for some reason, we behave worse than animals, we get all spiritually superior over other species, then the environment, then each other. So in a way, perhaps the devil is also "Dancing Animal Master" (that famous neolithic cave painting of the upright animal with horns), he is the lord and master of all animals, and we, being animals, are included.

Crowley never ever taught to supress the animal urges but to strengthen, contol and use them wisely.

I've always associated this Devil with the Bacchanal because of that wreath on the goat's head, and fit it into the reading from that perspective. Essentially the same as what everyone else has come up with, although the biology tie-in was new to me.

Check this Out:

i did a 3 card reading yesterday with my thoth deck. It was about my ex (not the one i talked about in my PoW thread if anybody is following my posts, but my ex ex gf)

she did a dirty thing to me. she borrowed money, try to pass it off as a christmas gift, and dump me 2days after i give her the money.

a real "devil" huh?

that''s when the devil card started representing her. everytime the devil came up, she came up.

yesterday, three card spread

ace of wands, the devil, 8 of swords-swiftness

.........

she called me told me she was coming to give me the money

she showed up

gave me the money and left quickly

..........

good reading...

Now whoever said magic doesn't work.....? "I wonder"

...I interpret it roughly the same as any other devil card, The goat is Capricorn (think about that sign, especially from the point of view of someone like Crowely) the people trapped in those cells are analogous to the chained up devils in the RWS.

Gov said:

...I interpret it roughly the same as any other devil card, The goat is Capricorn (think about that sign, especially from the point of view of someone like Crowely) the people trapped in those cells are analogous to the chained up devils in the RWS.

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I see the Devil of the Thoth Tarot as a good barometer of someones understanding of the concepts in the deck. To apply a Rider-Waite, Judeo-Christian, Good and Evil style interpretation to the Thoth's Devil misses the point entirely.

The Book of Thoth:

This card represents creative energy in its most material form

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Every single living being on this planet is a product of the "creative energy" symbolised by the Devil card. So, according to St.Paul's vile doctrine of Original Sin, everyone was created through an act of supreme filth and evil represented by the Devil. But this interpretation only applies to those who subscribe to Christian dogma and see sex, and thus themselves, as evil and dirty.

The Devil represents the force of life itself. It doesn't have a rational reason for being. It's not good or evil. It just IS. It doesn't conform to our limited concepts and ideas of what we think it should be. Nor is it bound by social convention or religious dogma. It is the blind and powerful force of creation and evolution. When this is realised the Devil transforms into the god PAN.

Gov said:

...I interpret it roughly the same as any other devil card, The goat is Capricorn (think about that sign, especially from the point of view of someone like Crowely) the people trapped in those cells are analogous to the chained up devils in the RWS.

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I'll defend this in my own way.

I too interpret the card _roughly_ the same as any other devil card. The concept is enslavement. Are you, or aren't you? Well, if i invoke the Devil in your presence and you decide "the devil with that! I'm leaving" then maybe you who do not understand true liberation from the grossest matter should leave.

Baccus93 said:

then maybe you who do not understand true liberation from the grossest matter should leave.

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True liberation from the grossest matter? I always thought that the Spirit and the Flesh were two sides of the same coin - see the very earthy Ace of Disks.

From The Book of Thoth:

The sign of Capricornus is rough, harsh, dark, even blind; the impulse to create takes no account of reason, custom, or foresight. It is divinely unscrupulous, sublimely careless of result. "thou hast no right but to do thy will. Do that, and no other shall say nay. For pure will, unassuaged of purpose, delivered from the lust of result, is every way perfect." AL. I, 42-4.

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The formula of this card is then the complete appreciation of all existing things. He rejoices in the rugged and the barren no less than in the smooth and the fertile. All things equally exalt him. He represents the finding of ecstasy in every phenomenon, however naturally repugnant; he transcends all limitations; he is Pan; he is All.

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The fundamental heresy of the Black Lodge is contempt for "the world, the flesh, and the devil", all which are essential to the plan of the Universe; it is cardinal to the Great Work for the Adept so to order affairs that "even the evil germs of Matter shall alike become useful and good".

The error of Christian Mystics on this point has been responsible for more cruelty, misery, and collective insanity than all others put together; its poison can be traced even in the teaching of Freud, who assumed that the Unconscious was "the devil", whereas in fact it is the instinct which expresses, beneath a veil, the inherent Point-of-View of each, and, properly understood, is the key to Initiation, and a hint of what seed may blossom and fructify as the "Knowledge and Conversation of the Holy Guardian Angel". For "Every man and every woman is a star".

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Aeon418 said:

True liberation from the grossest matter? I always thought that the Spirit and the Flesh were two sides of the same coin - see the very earthy Ace of Disks.

From The Book of Thoth:

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"true liberation"

What does this mean when I say it? If we are going to quote Crowley and Aiwass, let's be sure to get it as complete as possible without spending too much time on incidentals... so lets go ahead a paragraph.

"The formula of this card is then the complete appreciation of all existing things." ... "All things equally exalt him." [as you also quoted]

So where has this been contradicted in this thread? Not by me, nor the poster I defended.

Also remember that liberations should lead you to "argue not".

Baccus93 said:

true liberation from the grossest matter

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If "All things equally exalt him" and "The formula of this card is then the complete appreciation of all existing things", where does this leave the grossest matter that you are supposedly liberated from? You can cast it off and call it evil like the Christian mystic. Or you can accept it and integrate it into the unified Self as represented by the Devil. That's a very different idea altogether.