Tarocco Di Marsiglia (Svizzera 1804)

Le Fanu

sravana said:
Are there any other fans of the Svizzera 1804 out there?

Yes, me! I adore this deck, though it is definitely the nearest I have to Meneghello lamination (I don´t have their Tarot of Marseilles). But it shuffles wonderfully and, funny, but as soon as I received it, I felt that it offered itself so well to a side by side comparison with the Vieville. Different enough to be interesting to compare.

Id noticed the imprints too, particularly on the Death card, and - like you - I wished there was more info about this deck. I love the way the colours mix. I love the Ace of swords, it´s so florid and - of course - the Hanged Man. I got it out just yesterday to have a look through. I was admiring the Chariot. It´s one of my favourite cards.

Isn´t this the deck which has the signiature on the 2 of Pentacles scratched out?

What Im dying to know is that someone once mentioned here on a thread at AT (was it you sravana?) that there was a weird story about this deck? Something unpleasant which sombody mentioned?

Id love to know what it was...

SolSionnach

Le Fanu said:
Yes, me! I adore this deck, though it is definitely the nearest I have to Meneghello lamination

I'm not sure what you mean by that - because the only version I know of is the Meneghello version. Do you have a different version?

Le Fanu said:
(I don´t have their Tarot of Marseilles). But it shuffles wonderfully and, funny, but as soon as I received it, I felt that it offered itself so well to a side by side comparison with the Vieville. Different enough to be interesting to compare.

Oh, I strongly agree! I know that lots of people (myself included) are huge Vieville fans, but I think that this deck compares very favorably to the Vieville. the colors are nicer - the red of the Vieville is the same tomato-y flavor, but quite a bit brighter, and the Svizzera has some blues, where in the Vieville they are dark to the point of looking black. (or are those supposed to be greens? Confusing.)

Le Fanu said:
Id noticed the imprints too, particularly on the Death card, and - like you - I wished there was more info about this deck. I love the way the colours mix. I love the Ace of swords, it´s so florid and - of course - the Hanged Man. I got it out just yesterday to have a look through. I was admiring the Chariot. It´s one of my favourite cards.

Heh. That was my card of the day yesterday. It's a marvelous card (though I prefer the Vieville with its human-faced horses! Bizarro!)

Le Fanu said:
Isn´t this the deck which has the signiature on the 2 of Pentacles scratched out?

Must be, because I certainly can't make out anything but the 1804 on the 2 Deniers.

Le Fanu said:
What Im dying to know is that someone once mentioned here on a thread at AT (was it you sravana?) that there was a weird story about this deck? Something unpleasant which sombody mentioned? Id love to know what it was...

Yes, it was me, and I haven't figured that out yet. I *swear* I read it somewhere here... but have no idea where, now.

The odd thing is that as recently as 9 months ago I was thinking of selling it, but decided against it because I thought it was "important" to keep! This was before I suddenly became enamored with the TdM and bought my Hadar which I still love for it's natural colors. I can't get over how my tastes in tarot have done a 180! :bugeyed:

Come to think of it, I bet the Hadar's colors are the closest to what the original cards must've looked like, because pigments weren't nearly as bright back then - our modern colors are due to chemistry, before that they were all plant/mineral based (except for some reds from insects and royal purple from shellfish.)

Now if I could just find a Dussere Dodal, my life would be complete lol.

Le Fanu

sravana said:
I'm not sure what you mean by that - because the only version I know of is the Meneghello version

No, what I meant by this was that of all my Meneghello decks, this was the one that had the nearest thing to lamination. The other Meneghello decks are always so superbly matt. I don´t know of another edition either, but there may well be one...

As regards the colouring, I love the colouring of the Svizzera, and although I have some recoloured Marseilles like Hadar, C-Jodorowsky and others, it´s the facsimilie reproductions that get me every time. I also love the way the images really loom and fill the card. There´s a real majesty and up-front-ness about the images.

Im sure I read in a post somewhere, or maybe on another site or maybe a pm from Le Pendu that the signiature on the 2 of Coins was scratched out and another name put on instead (is it Jean Procher? It´s on the side of the Strength card...Don´t have it to hand)

I wish you could remember that eerie story... my imagination is working overtime here...

SolSionnach

Le Fanu said:
No, what I meant by this was that of all my Meneghello decks, this was the one that had the nearest thing to lamination. The other Meneghello decks are always so superbly matt. I don´t know of another edition either, but there may well be one...

Oh, I see what you meant. Actually, my Meneghello Soprafino is much more laminated than my Svizzera - very plastic-y feeling. OTOH, my Corte Dei Tarocchi is very matt and pleasing.

I don't find the Svizzera to be overlaminated... in fact, if I compare it to the Heron Vieville, the lamination feels almost the same - but if you look at it with light coming at an angle, you can see that Vieville's cardstock is textured.

Le Fanu said:
As regards the colouring, I love the colouring of the Svizzera, and although I have some recoloured Marseilles like Hadar, C-Jodorowsky and others, it´s the facsimilie reproductions that get me every time. I also love the way the images really loom and fill the card. There´s a real majesty and up-front-ness about the images.

Oh, I agree! I actually preferred the restorations before I got the Vieville - something about seeing that reproduction changed the way I look at TdM/B style decks. Now I much prefer the reproductions.

Le Fanu said:
I'm sure I read in a post somewhere, or maybe on another site or maybe a pm from Le Pendu that the signiature on the 2 of Coins was scratched out and another name put on instead (is it Jean Procher? It´s on the side of the Strength card...Don´t have it to hand)

I do - and yes, it's Jean Proche.

Le Fanu said:
I wish you could remember that eerie story... my imagination is working overtime here...

Perhaps it's just something about it being engraved by someone other than the Proche dude, and with stolen engravings or something like that!

Abrac

The lamination on the Svizzera is a super-thin thin piece of plastic on each side. When I got mine I decided I wanted to modify the box and in the process curiosity got the better of me. I pulled apart the card that was glued to the lid to see how it was made and voila!

Le Fanu

sravana said:
Actually, my Meneghello Soprafino is much more laminated than my Svizzera - very plastic-y feeling

Now that´s very strange because my Soprafino is definitely NOT laminated at all and my Svizerra definitely is, but - like you say - the lamination could be compared to the Vieville. A very light lamination. But the Soprafino, not at all...

SolSionnach

Abrac said:
The lamination on the Svizzera is a super-thin thin piece of plastic on each side. When I got mine I decided I wanted to modify the box and in the process curiosity got the better of me. I pulled apart the card that was glued to the lid to see how it was made and voila!

That's really interesting, Abrac! I can't imagine how you pulled it apart without removing part of the paperstock...
After feeling it for a while, I can tell that it's plastic. But just barely.

Le Fanu said:
Now that´s very strange because my Soprafino is definitely NOT laminated at all and my Svizerra definitely is, but - like you say - the lamination could be compared to the Vieville. A very light lamination. But the Soprafino, not at all...

Wow. My Soprafino's title page reads:
Tarocco
Soprafino di
F. Gumppenberg
Milano 1835

Ristampa fedelissima
edizioni
"Il Meneghello"
di O. Menegazzi
Milano 1992
Ed. di 2000 es.
No 1540/2000
Made in Italy

You made me get it out to make sure I wasn't imagining it. I wasn't (and mine's in the bookbinder thingy with ties). It's **hideously** plastic. Very glossy, and definitely plastic. I don't know if you've ever held the Maat deck which is very glossy, but that deck is not nearly as plastic as this one. Also, the fronts and backs feel different. Not at all like cards.

Abrac

sravana said:
That's really interesting, Abrac! I can't imagine how you pulled it apart without removing part of the paperstock...
After feeling it for a while, I can tell that it's plastic. But just barely.

It did pretty much trash the card. The lamination is like that commonly found these days on softcover books. If you have one of these books, chances are the lamination is starting to peel around the edges. I had one and I tried to peel it off but it only went so far then started to rip the paper so I stopped. I can imagine that if these cards were used or shuffled very much they might also start peeling.

Astraea

Le Fanu said:
...my Soprafino is definitely NOT laminated at all and my Svizerra definitely is...

Same here. My Svizzera is so heavily laminated that it almost feels slimy to me. The Soprafino doesn't seem to have any lamination whatever, and for that reason I don't handle it a great deal.

SolSionnach

Abrac said:
It did pretty much trash the card. The lamination is like that commonly found these days on softcover books. If you have one of these books, chances are the lamination is starting to peel around the edges. I had one and I tried to peel it off but it only went so far then started to rip the paper so I stopped. I can imagine that if these cards were used or shuffled very much they might also start peeling.

Ouch. I *really* don't like hearing that! I know exactly what you mean re: softcover books. That lamination doesn't work at all. However, after reading both Le Fanu's and Astraea's experience with Meneghello lamination, I'm not sure that the lamination that you have is at all like what Le Fanu and I evidently have. It appears that Meneghello did some major experimenting - especially with the Soprafino.

Astraea said:
Same here. My Svizzera is so heavily laminated that it almost feels slimy to me. The Soprafino doesn't seem to have any lamination whatever, and for that reason I don't handle it a great deal.

That's the way my Soprafino feels!

Okay, it's time to start a thread in tarot decks about this. I don't think that this is the place to discuss Meneghello lamination, right mods?

Tarocco Di Marsiglia (Svizzera 1804)

Le Fanu

SolSionnach

Le Fanu

SolSionnach

Abrac

Le Fanu

SolSionnach

Abrac

Astraea

SolSionnach