Why do people see The World negatively?

GotH

Amanda_04 said:
the World has more of a growth aspect, or like, "...to be continued..." that the Wheel doesn't have.
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Just like the old soap opera... As the World Turns. :D
 

ravenest

Amanda_04 said:
Ah, must just be something unique to me then. :)
The Wheel on the end of a spread has been a "..and that's the way the cookie crumbles, folks..." kind of card... you know, fate or destiny has spoken, it's out of your control, and there you go, the end... the dinosaurs are extinct.
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Yes ... if you are on the rim of the Wheel (one of the 3 characters) - fate or destiny - but the 'other unseen' 'character' sits on the axle. From that perspective the Wheel moves forward (or onward) and one can control ones 'fate' or 'destiny'.

For this perspective, again, I recommend

http://hermetic.com/crowley/the-rites-of-eleusis/jupiter.html
Amanda_04 said:
I guess I see the Wheel as the mechanical dial that starts or stops the evolution possible in the World... to me, the World has more of a growth aspect, or like, "...to be continued..." that the Wheel doesn't have.
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Yes, I see all of that - I think we are just looking into the crystal from slightly differnt angles :) ... the growth aspect continues within the manifestation - because it is 'alive'.

I suppose one way of explaining my view is that the Wheel is the process; from the rim things just appear to be revolving. The view of one at the axle, aware of forward movement sees the World as the destination ... but it isnt a stagnant final destination, it is the 'destination' that creates matter, life and 'resolution'.
 

re-pete-a

It all depends on what information one has on that card...It is a definite cross road ...a point that could lead one in any of the 4 directions for one that's on the path of the fool...It is a RUE..a vagina, a birthing..of the new Fool that has attained that point in it's progress...Back to the start or on to the higher paths...

It is also associated with the "dark night of the soul." A birthing process of a new or reborn Fool...
 

caridwen

etherealtarot said:
Rarely have I heard people speaking well of this card. A lot of people say it's about the end of a cycle.... but wouldn't that be Death? I really don't see The World as an end. I don't at all. I know every card has two sides and not all cards can be either good or bad. But it really disappoints me that people see The World this way.

I see The World as a beautiful card, especially one to get as an outcome. I would say they will literally feel like they are on top of the world. I see this as a card of confidence and being able to persevere through all struggles. In the Universal Fantasy, a giant, naked woman, with a smile walks on the land. She looks content like finally all is well in the world.

If you see it in a negative way, how come?
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Death is the end. There is no going back once the energy of Death has played out and we often struggle with these endings.

The World is the end of a phase or cycle that normally leads onto something new. As others have pointed out it is a culmination and you are right that it can sometimes be a wonderful card. The 'woman' is an hermaphrodite who has incorporated both female and male into herself so is a wonderful balance of the feminine and masculine or androgyny. It also relates (imo) to Plato's idea of soul mates in the Symposium. Like a culmination found after the missing piece of a jigsaw is slotted into the right place. The actual myth of Hermaphroditus as told by Ovid is a bit weird and points to co dependence. A nymph wants to be with a youth so much that she calls to the gods to make them one and they become conjoined into one body.

The way Death and the World differ is that Death is the end so for example, a physical end. Your dog dies. People can say with an end comes new beginnings but that doesn't help. Your dog, something you loved,is gone. We often fight against Death like the end of a relationship with all our might because we fear Death.

The World is the culmination of something and readiness to move onto a new phase. It's perhaps how you feel when you get your degree certificate, a promotion or even married. Marriage is a great metaphor for the World in that your old life is over and a new one is beginning but your old life isn't dead as in Death. Your life continues on a trajectory. If you are promoted you remain within your field of work and all that work has paid off which is represented by the World.
 

re-pete-a

If death were that final then why is it 13 and not 21...13 is another transition point...as all Major cards indicate...

There are many deaths in this life . Spermatozoa, egg, fetus, child, toddler etc...right through to 21 WORLD...Where the spermatozoa starts all over again.

Do we remember any of these transition points?

Are we regretting being any one of these life forms?

13 is where it is because some that were well versed in knowledge placed them where they are... for a reason.
 

caridwen

re-pete-a said:
If death were that final then why is it 13 and not 21...13 is another transition point...as all Major cards indicate...

There are many deaths in this life . Spermatozoa, egg, fetus, child, toddler etc...right through to 21 WORLD...Where the spermatozoa starts all over again.

Do we remember any of these transition points?

Are we regretting being any one of these life forms?

13 is where it is because some that were well versed in knowledge placed them where they are... for a reason.
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Perhaps you could start a thread on the Death card and enlighten us with what "those well versed in knowledge" said. I for one would be very interested:)
 

ravenest

As Carridwen points out death is the end of that life in that physical form. An egg turning into a chicken is not a death, nor is a zygote turning into a fetus; it is a continuance and development of that life in that physical form. To see the egg dying is only to look at its shell. The continuance and development of form, in this (thread's) context is The Wheel, the continuing revolution and development by trial, error and success.

'The culmination and readiness to move to a new form' is a great way of putting it. It is a manifestation, but an 'alive', growing and evolving one. And within its 'singular' manifestation it holds potential for duality (the hermaphrodite).

(I should REALLY read that Symposium section again ... Ovid, after all, was Roman ;) )
 

re-pete-a

From outside the egg it is a continuum..

From within the observing and limited vision egg culture it is death...

it is no more an egg ..it has been destroyed ...it is DEATH.13.

The egg escapist isn't interested in squeezing back into that shell and becoming it's original content...It does not consider that point DEATH, 13, but rather THE WORLD,21...

Those left behind are in fear of this Death because it holds an UNKNOWN and that causes fears of changing...

This participating fluffy happy chicken is happy that it happened...The World. 21.

As usual, the Majors and the cards are dependent on , "how you look at it."
 

re-pete-a

etherealtarot said:
Rarely have I heard people speaking well of this card. A lot of people say it's about the end of a cycle.... but wouldn't that be Death? I really don't see The World as an end. I don't at all. I know every card has two sides and not all cards can be either good or bad. But it really disappoints me that people see The World this way.

I see The World as a beautiful card, especially one to get as an outcome. I would say they will literally feel like they are on top of the world. I see this as a card of confidence and being able to persevere through all struggles. In the Universal Fantasy, a giant, naked woman, with a smile walks on the land. She looks content like finally all is well in the world.

If you see it in a negative way, how come?
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perhaps, just perhaps they intuitively are afraid of change...it can be a very scary business for some...EG: giving up smoking...dieting, etc...
 
6 of Wands in the context of relationships? all the things PENTACLES can represent