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I understood that you weren't selling candles to scam the lady. It makes perfect sense to me that since she was a Christian, lighting candles would appeal to her as a focus for prayers about financial help, now that you've told us about that part. I may start using candles myself in prayers for other things that concern me now and then. But I knew you weren't selling them in the same sense that other readers have done who scam their sitters.

And if the shop you work at wants you to encourage people to buy other things from their store, you were just doing what you're expected to do if you're going to continue to read there.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baroli
So,...you sold her some candles in order for her to what,.......light them and release her desire? Ok wait, I get it,.....it's sort of a ritual? Sorry, I'm trying to understand,......it's just if I have a problem or something like that I don't need a candle I just talk to the Universe and listen for the message. I mean why buy a candle when you can just look up or out or go within yourself and talk? But I guess if you are working in a shop and they need to push candles,....you gotta do what ya gotta do.
Are you serious, Baroli ???? or having a giggle.... ?

Just in case you are serious - I do think that there are times when you have to give someone something - like when the old style doctors used to give sugar pills when they knew only a pill would do. I'd see the candles as a kind placebo here. And to GIVE them to her - well, a) people tend to value what they pay for at these times and b) - debra - if you are rich, can we talk ??? (there's that Spills thing.... )

Quote:
As far as picking numbers for the lottery? Oh man, if I could do that,.....yahoo I would definitely be somewhere else, with my bloody mary in hand (don't forget the celery ) and just in neutral.

I don't get questions like that. I do get financial ones, but they usually pertain to a better job, or what can I do to increase my earning potential, stuff like that. If the questions really gets hardcore as in stock portfolios etc, I ask them when was the last time they saw their broker.
But what would you do if you DID ? It could happen any day now.....

If I were faced with this one - after I'd done the candles bit - which might very well help, sort of a la bringing luck thing - I might tell them ways to pick numbers for themselves and give them some kind of weedy ritual to help.

Because if they come to you with something like that, they want desperately to take SOMETHING away from it. And actually - I think debra's way is more honest than mine .... why does this not surprise me ???

And this woman apparently is very broke - so maybe she NEEDS some kind of calming centring influence in her life. debra has taken this beyond the question I think, and into trying to address her feelings about having no money. Rather good.
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Thanks for the responses--giving me a lot to think about, and I am interested in what others have to say.

Ros, do the numbers you give them actually "work"?--do they win the lottery? Or do they just like getting the numbers?

Griz, I realized that what I wrote tongue in cheek was misleading, so I edited my post above. The shop owner has NOT NEVER EVER said or implied that I should "push" their spiritual supplies, teas, herbs, etc. Never, ever. She'd be appalled at the thought.
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I don't know if anyone has won yet, but they
enjoy the information.

Many of them do play the numbers on the lottery,
just incase it works...we never know but...
there's always the question...what if?
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Luckily I have not yet heard that question. But if I did, I would stop and explain to the person that Tarot does not work in that way. That is is a spiritual tool to better our lives, and to help us grow inside.

If we ask a non-spiritual answer, ie something where the outcome is not going to be spiritually helpful or is based in a non-spriitual place like greed (trying to use Tarot for that purpose is greed-based) the cards just won't give us the answer.

Although I knwo you can't outright tell someone they are being greedy, so I'd need a good euphamism for "greed"

And btw, trying hard to win money (eg doing readings on it) is just not usually going to work, as the law of attraction is always at work in our lives. As soon as we tell ourselves we need to win money, that is based in scarcity thinking...that we don't have enough now. And scarcity thinking attracts more scarcity to us. It's only by believing we have all we need now and that money flows to us to meet all our needs, that it will flow to us.

Barbara
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregory
Are you serious, Baroli ???? or having a giggle.... ?

Just in case you are serious - I do think that there are times when you have to give someone something - like when the old style doctors used to give sugar pills when they knew only a pill would do. I'd see the candles as a kind placebo here. And to GIVE them to her - well, a) people tend to value what they pay for at these times and b) - debra - if you are rich, can we talk ??? (there's that Spills thing.... )
Yes, I am totally serious. I am trying to understand the whole logic of suggesting giving one's power to a placebo (your word and I like it). It smacks of what a lot of religions do, putting faith in something inanimate, like a doll, a stained glass window of the Madonna, or for that matter a cross that is hung in a sanctuary. But that's not what I am questioning either.

If the woman wished to have something to "hold on to" then quite frankly she would be better off pulling her numbers out of the air (I was going to use another "a" word, but decided to be polite) rather than giving her power to a worthless wax candle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baroli
I don't get questions like that. I do get financial ones, but they usually pertain to a better job, or what can I do to increase my earning potential, stuff like that. If the questions really gets hardcore as in stock portfolios etc, I ask them when was the last time they saw their broker.
As far as advice to her broker? I didn't say you did, but my clients do. Nope, my clients don't ask for magic numbers for the lottery, but there is always a first time.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Debra
LOL how funny! (I suppose that's the intent, humor?)
An attempt at humor?? No, I was being very serious in my query, but since you think it's an attempt at humor,.......I would think that one who edits for a living as well would know the difference between humor and honest questioning. Perhaps a misunderstanding and that's quite alright.


ETA: Yeah, being without money sucks, bigtime. I have been there,....several times, almost ended up,....well that's another story. But just when I thought I was all done, the Universe had a surprise for me. I guess I place my trust and faith in the unseen rather than the seen. Heb. 11:1
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Well, lots of us do candles. Haven't you see how often we tell people we'll light a candle for them or their loved ones? Catholics, to name one, light candles all the time when they pray. I don't see anything at all wrong with suggesting the woman use a candle. And she wasn't selling the candles herself, the shop she works at sells them.
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I'm surprised by the idea that lighting a candle as you focus your intent or say a prayer is giving power to a lump of wax. As I said, this is a very old tradition practiced around the world and yes, it is reflected in tarot; it's easy to research with a whole library at one's fingertips.

Baroli, I'd rather not have my question about how readers deal with requests for "lucky numbers" sidetracked, so if you'd like to discuss this further, perhaps you might start another thread in the "Spirituality" forum or we can talk by pm.
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It's called pushing a product Griz. If you are working in a store and you "suggest" a product that the store carries, you are in part pushing a product.

You see, to me, giving a suggestion of using a candle is like what we do for children on their birthdays. We put candles on their cake and say, "Make a wish and blow out the candles." Of course the child delights in this and believes that the wish will come true.

But we as readers are not dealing with children. We are dealing with people with "real" problems and come to us for "real" solutions/advice. To suggest you place your faith and power on a candle is sort of promising that your wish will come true. IMO, that's tantamount to a lie. It also suggests that I, as the reader, don't have an answer for you so, give your question to the candle and hope for the best. All I want is your money for the reading. And btw, it can be 3/100 or $250.00 for a candle, the concept of suggesting the candle will take away your problems is not working for me and is not right.

Now I know that Debra would not do that and I am sure she never thought of it that way, ever. I know Debra to be a caring person.

But we should think about these things when we are out there. You have impressionable people out there who are coming to us sometimes as a last resort, there are no other options. Giving someone a candle and "make a wish" just doesn't work for me.

ETA: Not being side-tracked at all. I am bringing up points that obviously are not what you thought about. It's all good.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baroli
Yes, I am totally serious. I am trying to understand the whole logic of suggesting giving one's power to a placebo (your word and I like it). It smacks of what a lot of religions do, putting faith in something inanimate, like a doll, a stained glass window of the Madonna, or for that matter a cross that is hung in a sanctuary. But that's not what I am questioning either.
Giving one's power to a placebo ? Isn't putting your faith in TAROT putting it in something inanimate ? If the candles helped her - even if only to feel that she might get some money some day - more power to the candles. Anything that makes someone feel empowered is a benefit. To feel empowered is often to be so.

Quote:
If the woman wished to have something to "hold on to" then quite frankly she would be better off pulling her numbers out of the air (I was going to use another "a" word, but decided to be polite) rather than giving her power to a worthless wax candle.
I imagine that is more or less what she would have done in the end - but if the candle made her FEEL more powerful - feelings can give power, tha knows

Quote:
An attempt at humor?? No, I was being very serious in my query, but since you think it's an attempt at humor,.......I would think that one who edits for a living as well would know the difference between humor and honest questioning. Perhaps a misunderstanding and that's quite alright.
I used to edit for a living too, actually. It does not preclude misunderstandings, I assure you.

But surely we ALL know that tone on the internet is almost impossible to gauge; that's one reason for many of the disasters that occur on line. Misunderstanding someone's tone. I wasn't at all sure whether you were serious or not, for instance. And maybe you weren't sure whether some of what I said was. Maybe I'm not even sure.....

I think debra did a good job here. Horses for courses, I suppose. I'd love to know the sequel.

ETA (cross post) I reckon she was just lucky to be in a store that sold something that she felt would help. If I were reading in a drug store and someone said they had a headache, I might well suggest they nick over and get some Advil.....
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