Aeclectic Tarot
Tarot Cards & Reviews Free Tarot Readings Tarot Books Tarot Card Meanings Forum Archive

"Ethics" of tarot

  > Aeclectic Tarot Forum > Tarot > Talking Tarot


 
ravenest's Avatar
ravenest  ravenest is offline
ravenator
 
Join Date: 02 Feb 2006
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 13,835
ravenest 
ravenator

ravenest's Avatar

I think SOME art can have. I would not say art can or cannot generally. Depends what one means by moral ... (and 'art' and 'template' too I suppose ) ?

An example? I am thinking of a an old Australian colonial sign nailed to trees around the countryside to show Aboriginals Australian 'law'. There had been massacre and retaliations. The sign shows a picture; one side is an aboriginal spearing a white man and next to it are soldiers hanging the aboriginal. The other part shows a white man shooting aboriginals next to it soldiers are hanging the white man.

To me that is art, moral and a template. It might be easily understood if one knows the background or not if one doesn't.

For me the Thoth deck its ideas philosophy and 'art' do the same.

Also for me, art isn't just the thing there visually, I believe art, by its very nature, is meant to trigger a whole range of associations and understandings ... even if it is the empty space framed by one of Moore's sculptures.

Actually, the more you stimulate me to think about it, the more I see it. Especially in things like the Thoth 4 discs for example.

I see that art as giving a 'moral' lesson via a template.
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #31
The crowned one's Avatar
The crowned one  The crowned one is offline
Moderation
 
Join Date: 12 Mar 2007
Location: Canada.
Posts: 18,448
The crowned one 
Moderation

The crowned one's Avatar

I would say you are applying your morals to the art There is nothing wrong with that it is natural. Some morals are universal, so those we can see in art that demonstrates that: A piece of art showing a murder of a child would get a universal reaction from all people who are in thier right mind.. (the thoth does not in my mind have any universal morals painted in it, but I do like the deck) most are cultural or social influenced.

Another way of putting it: art does not judge, you judge art. Your art is a visual representation of crime and punishment, A law. The moral is added by the observer.
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #32
ravenest's Avatar
ravenest  ravenest is offline
ravenator
 
Join Date: 02 Feb 2006
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 13,835
ravenest 
ravenator

ravenest's Avatar

Of course it is , that is my point. Does 'art' as such even exist if there is no observer to consider that it IS art other than arrangements of objects, forms, colours, etc. ?

Every one who looks at the sign puts their moral perspective into it. But I am not applying my morals to the Thoth deck ... it is meant to represent certain morals it's creator thought relevant in symbolic representation. It demonstrates various modes of applying that associated ethical system; Do what thou wilt, love is the Law, every man and every woman is a star, etc.

An 'intuitive' reader might not get it but if one studies the associated writings one sees it clearly; the art (form, colour, symbolism) in that deck is meant to portray certain moral and ethical developments and solutions to various issues.

Isn't that the whole point of a reading; to figure out a correct course of action? I understand most readers may associate their OWN moral and ethical stance into a reading but surely a deck can have its own 'stance' on that, especially the Thoth?
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #33
carr4562  carr4562 is offline
Resident
 
Join Date: 03 Nov 2012
Location: Denver, Colorado, USA
Posts: 19
carr4562 
Resident

Regarding the original concern of the thread (the disapproving bf), there does seem to be a lot of good advice already offered. Personally, I've dealt with this and similar issues in my marriage. My wife's family is much more conservative (for lack of a better term) than I am, probably bordering on what most people would consider religious fundamentalism. It's not hard to see that my interests (tarot included) make them uncomfortable, but it's also not hard to see that their discomfort is based on ignorance. People do tend to equate the unknown or unfamiliar with evil. My wife was very leery of my interest in tarot at first, until I did a reading for her at a time when she was facing a tough decision in her career. Now she requests them regularly and acknowledges that there does seem to be something meaningful in tarot. My mother in law is the most conservative person I know but I wouldn't hesitate to do a reading for her if she ever wanted one.

So, my advice is just to see what happens. Be brave and be an example of all the good and wisdom that tarot/astrology has to offer. Sometimes that does mean walking away from a toxic relationship. But sometimes it also means being patient with a loved one who just doesn't know any better and needs someone to show them the wonderful things they are overlooking.
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #34
ravenest's Avatar
ravenest  ravenest is offline
ravenator
 
Join Date: 02 Feb 2006
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 13,835
ravenest 
ravenator

ravenest's Avatar

Yes very good points. I wonder what the source of the morals/ethics were that the bf has?

Perhaps meltedobsidian could start by gently opening a conversation with him about that and explore the sources of their morals and ethics; how they rejected some and accepted some in their upbringings and later individual developments and see where they can agree or not and WHY (if it that sort of relationship)? That could help develop their relationship and acceptance of each others differences.

Its a tricky issue; I have it experienced many times when the bf has reacted badly to the gf having a reading from me; either through the confidence issue or the 'unfair advantage' issue (especially if the reading subject is about the relationship or the other person).

Perhaps more so if the non-reader in the couple sees an 'unfair advantage'. In this cases it is a matter of explaining that we all use tools and different senses and un/conscious processes to access a situation and act on that. The non-tarot reader might have a VAST set of other skills that the tarot reader doesn't.

But still, it is in the realm of the 'occult' and usage of any perception skill in that area just isn't right for some that don't have it. That skill may be open to unfair advantage, misuse, dangerous to self and others ... but so might a muscular strong right arm.
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #35
carr4562  carr4562 is offline
Resident
 
Join Date: 03 Nov 2012
Location: Denver, Colorado, USA
Posts: 19
carr4562 
Resident

Yes, all very true. I think you really hit the nail on the head, as it were, when you mention discussing the sources and selection of ethical/moral beliefs. If the relationship is strong enough and of the right type, that could not only encourage acceptance between two people but could also be the beginning of a lot of individual growth for each person involved.

You also make an important point about the "strong right arm." If ever disapproval turns into violence/abuse then the right answer would be to value one's self enough to leave the unsafe relationship.
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #36
meltedobsidian  meltedobsidian is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 04 May 2013
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 303
meltedobsidian 
Citizen

So I know it's been over a year since I started this thread and then abandoned it, but this was one of my first postings on AT and for some reason I couldn't resist looking it up, and now I also can't really resist commenting.. Thank you to everyone who gave me advice on not tolerating or staying with someone who is disrespectful of my beliefs and interests, you were all 100% right. The last two posts are especially chilling because after posting this things went from bad to worse and there was violence involved at one point... And just as a dramatic gesture he actually ripped up some of the cards from my first tarot deck

Anyway to clarify about the title, I should've phrased it differently but used the word ethics because yes he literally would tell me tarot is not only "wrong" in a moral sense (evil), but also a scam similar to how he believes magicians or fake psychics use their "powers" to get money from customers. Did he actually believe this? I don't think so, I actually did readings for and even with him, so I know he saw the validity in it but was clearly threatened by that. And I realize now as someone mentioned he had plenty of his own doubts and was basically just was trying to make me feel inferior to mask his own insecurity. Not surprisingly we both grew up in an extremely religious background, except I had openly broken away from Christianity in my teenage years and he hadn't yet completely... Although yes I suppose playing out some of my own lingering guilt was a big part of this relationship.

Sooo I'm not sure what else to even say since my views on this subject along with a lot of other things have changed drastically since I first wrote this. On the one hand knowing him was a terrible and dark time in my life, but on the other hand going through all of that has actually forced me to become more confident in my own beliefs. So thanks again for all the responses and sorry I didn't take the advice in the first place!
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #37
Rhapsodin  Rhapsodin is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 18 Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 298
Rhapsodin 
Citizen

Quote:
Originally Posted by meltedobsidian View Post
The person I'm dating (has been a bit tumultuous lol) highly disapproves of my interest in astrology, tarot, etc. and basically tells me it's a "cheap trick", and those who do tarot readings are "playing God", have no right to give advice to people they know nothing about, etc...
Playing God? Fine. It's alleged that God made man in His own image (not that I can reckon God was a He particularly) which included the ability to create/procreate etc. Besides, if God created all, then he gave us the powers to divine. Was this another of His slip-ups?

Quote:
Honestly as far as astrology goes I've become pretty confident in my knowledge, and I would not feel at all "unethical" looking at someone's chart and giving them advice based on upcoming transits. But I have to admit with tarot (still very new to learning about how tarot and astrology actually relate) sometimes if when doing readings for others the outcome is especially negative, I hesitate to explain it to the querent because I don't want to make too much of an impact on their actions and perceptions (especially if the cards are actually "wrong"??)

So I'm sorry I'm still a beginner and questioning my "faith" a bit lol but I guess I'm just wondering what other more experienced tarot reader's responses are to these types of opinions... Seems to be the general consensus and I don't have much evidence to justify my experiences or beliefs in it
I don't think you have to be an experienced tarot reader to opine on this. There have been many devout believers who have taken up the tarot for meditation or divining. People were given the power to do these things no less, than, say, a planner diving what'll happen with immigration, say, or traffic, and working out how best to deal with the infrastructure to cover 50 years' time. One could accuse the medical profession of playing God many times over so I don't think that a sound argument.

Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #38
meltedobsidian  meltedobsidian is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 04 May 2013
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 303
meltedobsidian 
Citizen

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhapsodin View Post
Playing God? Fine. It's alleged that God made man in His own image (not that I can reckon God was a He particularly) which included the ability to create/procreate etc. Besides, if God created all, then he gave us the powers to divine. Was this another of His slip-ups?



I don't think you have to be an experienced tarot reader to opine on this. There have been many devout believers who have taken up the tarot for meditation or divining. People were given the power to do these things no less, than, say, a planner diving what'll happen with immigration, say, or traffic, and working out how best to deal with the infrastructure to cover 50 years' time. One could accuse the medical profession of playing God many times over so I don't think that a sound argument.

Hey well I agree with you Although many devout Christians also believe tarot is a satanic form of witchcraft lol. I guess I was just not yet at the point where I could argue against the completely irrational, extremist religious views I grew up around, and then also defend a spiritual interest like tarot that in their eyes is equally "illogical". I thought I had moved past all the Christianity drama in my life, but this guy brought everything unresolved to the surface and made me feel like I still had something to prove. It was a terrible experience lol but now a year later I at least see things completely differently..
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #39
Morwenna's Avatar
Morwenna  Morwenna is offline
Oversized hobbit
 
Join Date: 04 May 2008
Location: Connecticut, USA
Posts: 4,843
Morwenna 
Oversized hobbit

Morwenna's Avatar

I think it's sad that so many intolerant people who fly the Christian banner make it hard for other Christians who aren't like that at all.

But I am very glad that you are out of that relationship and have a better idea of and more confidence in your own abilities and interests, and what you want from relationships.
Need answers now? Get 50% off your first live Tarot session!     Top   #40


 


Tarot Cards & Reviews Free Tarot Readings Tarot Books Tarot Card Meanings Forum Archive
Aeclectic Tarot Forum Links
· Tarot
· Tarot Special Interest
· Beyond Tarot
· Forum Library

Aeclectic Tarot Categories
· Angel Decks
· Dark & Gothic Decks
· Goddess Decks
· Fairy Decks
· Doreen Virtue Decks
· Beginner Decks
· Cat Decks
· Pagan & Wiccan Decks
· Ancient Egyptian Decks
· Celtic Decks
· Lenormand Decks
· Rider-Waite Decks
· Marseilles Decks
· Thoth Decks
· Oracle Decks
· List All Decks
· Popular Tarot Decks
· Available Decks
· Tarot Books
· What's New

Copyright © 1996 - 2017 Aeclectic Tarot. All rights reserved. Privacy Policy. Contact us.