old school fool or new school?

Nemia

I'd say - if you read with the RWS, interpret the RWS. Once you start keeping in your head all the different interpretations of other decks, it only confuses you. There are different takes on the Fool - that's a good topic for study. But when you're doing a reading, read the cards in front of you.

Only if you decide to take out another deck and compare the cards to find new nuances, other interpretations really play a role.

I teach art history and have one iron principle: I NEVER speak about a work of art that I don't have in front of me (or projected on the wall). No matter how well I know it or how well the students know it. In order to speak about a picture without mis-reading, mis-remembering or mis-interpreting it, you need it before your eyes.

IMO the same is true for tarot cards in a reading. If I want to understand the messages the cards give me, it's best to have them before me. Only then, the card itself can speak, and not my memories or ideas of it.

myrrhmyrrh

I'm so sorry!

Hello
All of these lovely answers and I didn't see any except jnett's - I will answer each and every one of you but with a little time.

I had this thread on watch but only just now got a notification

Thank you so much!

Ace

myrrhmyrrh: you are falling into the problem many readers have: what is the card SUPPOSED to mean? instead, open your intuition and say what the card makes you think of. Do you see this Fool as ridiculous? maybe (painful as it is to say) you think your friend is ridiculous too. Let go of any obligation to your friend or the cards and think about what it makes you think of. And say it. It may hurt, but that may be what she needs to hear.

I think your original interpretation was a good one: she IS being a bit silly and immature and she needs to cool off (find balance--Temperance) to stay with this person.

barb

myrrhmyrrh

euripides said:
On the one hand, this is a classic theatrical fool - donkey's ears and a chain of bells. But on the other hand, while the top half of the character is clothed, the bare legs suggest genuine madness.

This card is based on the Charles VI deck; the Este deck depicts an even more undressed fool. In both cases, being taunted and having his clothes pulled off by children. I would say the common theme with children and animals in the fool cards is that neither have any respect for social mores - they reveal the true foolishness of the human condition, for all we frantically try to cover our embarrassment and show off our status.

The fool in literature most often is the innocent who sees the truth of things. Not fettered by normal rules, they'll speak simply what they see. As the fool, they have dispensation to do so: we can't punish them for their honesty.

So I'm tending to read this card as a call to see the situation clearly. Recognize the true nature of the humans involved: bodies, hormones, emotional baggage, social convention. Try to take a step back and examine your feelings. Is this a good relationship on every level, or driven by physical desire? Or perhaps by the need to be 'a couple' to feel fulfilled? I'm not saying that either of these are the case, but rather suggesting that this is the kind of open-eyed examination that is called for.

Imagine you are characters in Shakespeare. What will the fool whisper to the Queen about your romance?

I find this very useful, euripides, thank you. I did note the undressed fool, but not the donkey ears precisely - and then the fact that we see very clearly the outline of the sex and the pubic hair - at least that caught my eye and I thought about that in relation to this person whose life themes also include a lot about social convention and naivete in flauting it. Also, last line on Shakespeare there is genius!

myrrhmyrrh

barefootlife said:
As I see it, it could be both. Sometimes the beginnings of relationships have missteps and embarrassments, but that doesn't stop them from being the beginning of something good. Maybe she's going to hit a time of feeling foolish and naive before things fall into place.

That said, I'd look carefully at which cups you pulled, and whether his mature KoH nature and Temperance might be that he's a figure who balances out her Fool and Star, which is bright and hopeful but may also be a dream out of her grasp.

I do hope it is both, and I can see it happening that way as it does so often. At the same time I hadn't thought of your last point, as that's a bit above my level yet, so I thank you for that insight particularly

myrrhmyrrh

Rachx said:
Hi there I see the fool as the court jester -the court jester historically taking on the role of being the joker in the court. But I don't think the jester is foolhardy- quite the opposite. The jester was always in court and had the ear of everyone in the court he could come and go as he pleased and had the direct line to the ear of the king.
i think it takes intelligence to be a joker. I see the fool here as having the ear of the king and she is just "acting out" I agree with barefoot that the beginnings of relationships have us all acting like a fool but there is nothing intrinsically wrong with that. I think she is young a bit naive because she is in love - with a mature man who may feel beneficent toward her xx

That's true too - and she is very youthful in spirit with the wisdom that comes from the mouths of babes and court jesters. This is another take I hadn't thought of, and fits as this is a man who is somewhat older than she and a lot more circumspect. Thank you Rachx

myrrhmyrrh

Ruby Jewel said:
Take a chance and be the Fool, but she will have to "Temper" it a bit for this guy....keep a lid on the "crazies."

Ruby Jewel, if you only knew how well that fits, but that would be indiscreet. thank you

myrrhmyrrh

Barleywine said:
The Fool is sometimes described as a "tabula rasa," a blank slate upon which any conceivable future can be written. But the problem with "writing our own script" is that we frequently have a fool for an editor. A sense of perspective can be missing that allows for a distorted view of the road ahead. If every journey starts with a single step, care should be taken that the first one doesn't land on thin air. So there is a cautionary note as well as a hopeful one with the Fool.

Well said, Barleywine, and I guess that's why we have the tarot, to counsel us in editing, and give us that missing perspective.

myrrhmyrrh

Nemia said:
I'd say - if you read with the RWS, interpret the RWS. Once you start keeping in your head all the different interpretations of other decks, it only confuses you. There are different takes on the Fool - that's a good topic for study. But when you're doing a reading, read the cards in front of you.

Only if you decide to take out another deck and compare the cards to find new nuances, other interpretations really play a role.

I teach art history and have one iron principle: I NEVER speak about a work of art that I don't have in front of me (or projected on the wall). No matter how well I know it or how well the students know it. In order to speak about a picture without mis-reading, mis-remembering or mis-interpreting it, you need it before your eyes.

IMO the same is true for tarot cards in a reading. If I want to understand the messages the cards give me, it's best to have them before me. Only then, the card itself can speak, and not my memories or ideas of it.

Nemia, as another art history professor, this speaks to me particularly, thank you for the wise reminder. I will tuck that away for any reading.

I get confused with this deck and I really probably should not have started out with it, but the art historian in me was delighted with the historically based deck and the Schifanoia frescoes and the tarot friendly Aby Warburg somewhere in the background as a tutelary figure.... so I look at the cards but as a begiinner feel like I'm missing something if I don't use the RWS interps, which work partially with some cards, not at all with so many others. But I much appreciate your good counsel.

myrrhmyrrh

Ace said:
myrrhmyrrh: you are falling into the problem many readers have: what is the card SUPPOSED to mean? instead, open your intuition and say what the card makes you think of. Do you see this Fool as ridiculous? maybe (painful as it is to say) you think your friend is ridiculous too. Let go of any obligation to your friend or the cards and think about what it makes you think of. And say it. It may hurt, but that may be what she needs to hear.

I think your original interpretation was a good one: she IS being a bit silly and immature and she needs to cool off (find balance--Temperance) to stay with this person.

barb

Hi Barb

Yes, it's true I'm always thinking of what the cards are "supposed" to mean and have a hard time freeing myself from that. I'm working through some of Mary Greer's workbooks which should be helpful for that as far as I can see. I mentioned earlier that I'm an art historian, which is a boon on one hand because I'm an old hand at interpreting images, but a negative on the other because I want to source and footnote everything, and it seems that just about everything goes back to the RWS.

I like your last point though and I think that the truth is much in the midst of all of these different given readings