Minor cards that define a deck

Babalon Jones

Responding to Tanga, forgot to use quotes but see, my issue with the idea of the 7 of Disks bring done the way you describe it in that deck, is why? Was it just like, oh 7 circles, 7 chakras, a cool coincidence, somewhat esoteric looking lets use it. Though that deck claims to be based on Crowley's work in no way does that speak to me about the Lord of Failure.

Tanga

Babalon Jones said:
Responding to Tanga, forgot to use quotes but see, my issue with the idea of the 7 of Disks bring done the way you describe it in that deck, is why? Was it just like, oh 7 circles, 7 chakras, a cool coincidence, somewhat esoteric looking lets use it. But that deck claims to be based on Crowley's work but in no way does that speak to me about the Lord of Failure.

Well, I didn't say that I liked all of Crowley's labels. And - I don't actually know much about him or really follow his work. So - I cannot comment on that, or engage you in debate on the subject.

But I do like looking at the 7 of Disks as "your life's work as a project" - cycles of 7 years through one's life and the idea that you develop or delve into each of those Chakra's every 7th cycle, from root Chakra upwards (not that it's TRUE - it's an idea of how things could be). I went to a workshop on this once (nothing to do with Crowley) - it was Zero Balancing (a therapeutic modality) and the Chakra's.
In this context the card wouldn't be a "cool coincidence" for me - even if in actuality it was for the artist to use it like this.

.

Zephyros

Babalon Jones said:
Responding to Tanga, forgot to use quotes but see, my issue with the idea of the 7 of Disks bring done the way you describe it in that deck, is why? Was it just like, oh 7 circles, 7 chakras, a cool coincidence, somewhat esoteric looking lets use it. But that deck claims to be based on Crowley's work but in no way does that speak to me about the Lord of Failure.

I believe the RWS depiction is that of Adam who, after the expulsion from Eden (Tiphareth) was forced to make a living from the sweat of his brow. Gone was the easy life where everything was given to him so long as his Will was identical to that of God. Both Taurus and Saturn imply form and hard work, and together they're just a sticky mess.

Tanga

closrapexa said:
I believe the RWS depiction is that of Adam who, after the expulsion from Eden (Tiphareth) was forced to make a living from the sweat of his brow. Gone was the easy life where everything was given to him so long as his Will was identical to that of God. Both Taurus and Saturn imply form and hard work, and together they're just a sticky mess.

Cool.
Thankyou for this.
And... that could still be seen in the 'cycles of seven'. Who said it was easy to work through the lessons of those Chakra's?.
Cool.

Leo77

I'm not entirely certain I have the question right, but I have noticed a variation between some decks that I've always found interesting:

The Five of Cups

The usual interpretations about appreciating what you have always struck me as perplexing. In the standard RWS version, there are three empty cups and two full ones. So, the caped man has actually lost more than he has left, which could be considered pretty devastating.

In the Golden Tarot of Kat Black (which is not my favorite deck but I'm warming to it), the King has spilled only two cups but still has three.

It seems more optimistic to me that the King has retained more than he's lost. To me, that really drives home the "appreciate what you have" because in his case, he actually DOES have more left.

Tanga

Leo77 said:
I'm not entirely certain I have the question right, but I have noticed a variation between some decks that I've always found interesting:

The Five of Cups

The usual interpretations about appreciating what you have always struck me as perplexing...

In the Golden Tarot of Kat Black (which is not my favorite deck but I'm warming to it), the King has spilled only two cups but still has three.

It seems more optimistic to me that the King has retained more than he's lost. To me, that really drives home the "appreciate what you have" because in his case, he actually DOES have more left.

5 of Cups:
e.g. You found a wonderful tutor who taught you for a year - but they have to leave for
abroad now. So - you are sad they are going. But - you appreciate the year that you've had (when the original intent was to have them for 3 more years say...), and everything that you've learned from them.

Leo77

It's just a weird illustration for me, mathematically speaking. You could take it as a "glass half full/empty" card except that it's NOT half full or half empty, not with an uneven number of cups.

Using your tutor example: let's say said tutor is the ONLY tutor in the world in posession of knowledge that you need/want and you didn't quite get that far in your studies before he left. So, you may look back fondly on your time together, sure, but now you will NEVER have the opportunity to get that knowledge. Could be potentially devastating with regard to your future.

If there are other tutors who can provide that knowledge and they are available to you, the loss is disheartening, but not devastating (even number of cups). If you now have no way to progress in your studies, you're in serious trouble (odd number of cups with most of them being spilled).

Tanga

Leo77 said:
It's just a weird illustration for me, mathematically speaking. You could take it as a "glass half full/empty" card except that it's NOT half full or half empty, not with an uneven number of cups.

Using your tutor example: let's say said tutor is the ONLY tutor in the world in posession of knowledge that you need/want and you didn't quite get that far in your studies before he left. So, you may look back fondly on your time together, sure, but now you will NEVER have the opportunity to get that knowledge. Could be potentially devastating with regard to your future.

If there are other tutors who can provide that knowledge and they are available to you, the loss is disheartening, but not devastating (even number of cups). If you now have no way to progress in your studies, you're in serious trouble (odd number of cups with most of them being spilled).

Agreed. And for me in a way - experienced (3 cups empty). I was devastated... even depressed for a while. But - I have recovered now.
:-D

Leo77

Tanga said:
Agreed. And for me in a way - experienced (3 cups empty). I was devastated... even depressed for a while. But - I have recovered now.
:-D

Good

For me, it's that uneven number of cups that sticks in my craw.

Also, it added a bit of a layer in the Golden Tarot because in that card it's the King's loss, as opposed to some random caped figure we know nothing about. To me it drove home the "Appreciate what you have" angle because he's a King, and far better able to absorb the loss better than others around him who are not as well off, especially since it's a non-devastating loss (he still has 3 cups left.)

I'm still not all that comfortable with the Surprise!Jesus! aspect of the Golden Tarot, but it's still a nice deck.

Tanga

Leo77 said:
I'm still not all that comfortable with the Surprise!Jesus! aspect of the Golden Tarot, but it's still a nice deck.

I like this deck very much. A new Tarot friend read with it recently and I was tempted...
I love the Death card, and the court.
...I have Roman Catholic roots, and I am now Wiccan.

Minor cards that define a deck

Babalon Jones

Tanga

Zephyros

Tanga

Leo77

Tanga

Leo77

Tanga

Leo77

Tanga