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Gonna learn Thoth if it kills me - Majors

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ravenest
The 'chakra' that relates (or feeds) the sexual centre is actually three chakras that make up one. The basic difference in the psychic body of men and women (in this area) is that 2 of the the three are are pretty similar but the third is different. Crowley decribed the male one as being full of short active lines or bars, red and black, moving in agitation and they seemed 'angry'. The woman was different but in the centre but had a different extererior or outer zone as well. A type of fuzzy wall that broke down and apart and and allowed outside influences into the middle (during menstruation).

More than likely I'd say that's what AC was hinting at. ... Unless Frieda just decided to add some nice flowers ?
THANKS Ravenest!

Hey Nicky, your thread just learned me somethin' too, so that's good
Top   #11
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Reading The Tarot Handbook by Angeles Arrien last night and she mentioned the flower dealio too... her take " The Fool represents the ecstatic adventure of growing and unfolding in our own journey of the hero and the heroine (the flowers between the legs in their different states of growth and unfoldment)".

Now far be it from me to think I can guess the mind of Uncle AL, but I think Ravenest has hit on the imagery with the chakas. As per the intention I think the unfolding flowers is a nice idea as well.

Nicky
Top   #12
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Hey Nicky,

Eek! Be you ware of Angeles Arrien. If you are getting some value from her book, hats off.. but please know that her grasp of the Thoth and more importantly the "system" she teaches in that book have virtually nothing to do with the Thoth or its structure. Teheuti and I were involved in a long heated discussion about this book a while back, and even she (as a longtime friend & student of Arrien's) admits that Arrien makes mistakes constantly and shamelessly... that most of the value in this book is that it "sets you free" to make up your own approach... that the best source of study is Crowley's Book of Thoth, once you're ready for it. Arrien makes stupid mistakes on almost every page, bizarre assumptions and mushy opinions. Arrien fabricates bales of interpretation without any context or substantive knowledge of the Thoth... and it shows. The trouble is the book seems friendly and accessible, which makes it like an airconditioned tiger trap for your Thoth studies.

Not once in all the tens of thousands of words we wrote in that thread could anyone provide a single example of a useful lesson offered by Arrien... Not one topic that isn't covered elsewhere by someone more competent and knowledgable... Not a single "insight" of Arrien's that added to an understanding of the Thoth... Not even basic information, let alone interpretation. I asked and asked for something, anything, positive people could cite in her defense, but never got answer. Even from her one dogged supporter, a friend and former student. NOT ONE EXAMPLE. Talk about damning with faint praise.

Only my opinion, though I'm sure some others will pop in to agree. If you want to learn to work with the Thoth I highly encourage steering clear of New Age "reinventions" of the Thoth by people who haven't done the basic homework (Wanless, Wagner, etc). It will screw you up in the long run, creating habits and associations that will trip you up later. There's a reason that folks who struggle with the Thoth seem to go to these "friendly" authors, but so too, there is a reason that they wind up abandoning the Thoth as impenetrable when those authors can't hold up their end of the educational bargain. Here's the best part: Arrien has already confused you. Whether you know it or not, Arrien has made mistakes and promoted misreadings about the Thoth on almost every page you have read because she didn't do basic research. And in a book for beginners that's inexcusable. Know that she hasn't done her homework; and that you will repeat her mistakes because you're trusting her to have done something she consciously chose not to do: get her facts straight.

If you want to learn to use the Thoth, then I'd recommend learning the Thoth on its own terms at your own pace, not Arrien's unstudied musings on the Thoth, which she admits from the outset are unsupported by the basic facts. There are tons of resources that will help you take the steps that will build solid base for working with the deck. But Arrien's book is a shanty built on sand. Whatever shelter it seems to be providing, whatever meager comforts it affords, its utility is limited and you will inevitably have to seek a steadier foundation...

Just thought I'd mention it.

Scion
Top   #13
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What he said. This looks like a promising thread
Top   #14
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Thanks gang... I do have DuQuettes book, which I found a lot more informative even before the comments. I have taken the plunge and bid on The Book of Thoth on ebay... I know going to the source is probably the way....although I think DuQuette's book is legit and a hell of a lot easier to grasp from what I have seen of Uncle Al's writing.

The quest continues bwahaha

Nicky
Top   #15
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The Book of Thoth is also available online as a PDF in about a zillion places, if you want to have a digital copy.
Top   #16
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Any thoughts on Gerd Ziegler's Tarot: Mirror of the Soul?

I have the ebooks of Thoth but I have to admit, I love real live paper books.
Top   #17
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I absolutely loathe that book. Oddly enough it came up in another thread today. To have got it free would have been to have paid too much
Top   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicky
Now far be it from me to think I can guess the mind of Uncle AL, but I think Ravenest has hit on the imagery with the chakas. As per the intention I think the unfolding flowers is a nice idea as well.
Nicky
Yeah ...but that's just two ideas. It all depends what you want from it.
A nice simple comfey understanding? A few want that (but not many 'hard-line Thothers'). Some complex qabalistic mathmatical juggling to get to the source of the idea by algebraic formulae ? (No thanks ... although there are a few here that accept 'floatation of their boat' with that one.) Psychic anatomy ... quiet a few interested . Sexual tantra .... numerous heads pop up and ears point forward like meercat feeding time at the zoo .

There is a Sufi teaching that says in order to really understand something you should be able to comprehend it on 7 levels. So, to begin to understand something, search out the meaning on 7 different levels. (Hint use the Qabalistic sephiroth below the abyss ... or if you prefer the model of the trad. 7 planets.) Even if it is just one symbol on one card.

So, its all true ... its all permissible, just different levels ... one just has to make a distinction between the artistic romantic, the buffoon and the mathmatical / image analysis, etc. etc.

The problems arise when the planes are confused ... at first or (as Scion points out above) later.
Top   #19
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Having been to a few OTO events, I know I don't want the whole shebang LOL.

That said I have been knocked over each time I re-pickup this deck. I know it is not the art. LF did a fabulous job etc but this wouldn't be the reason I want so much to work with the Thoth. It is the astounding correspondences and layers of meaning this deck has that is the appeal. If tarot holds keys to opening up new understanding, enlightenment as it were, then this deck has plenty of jumping off points.

Regarding the different takes on the 'flowering plant' I can understand the chakra information, and it will cause me to recall yet another correspondence system that was included in this deck. As per the Arrien suggestion, that too has merit for me in that if I choose this deck to read for others, that may be an additional and easily understood reference if needed for the sitter.

Thus, two different reasons for using the (or any) deck. There are probably as many different reasons to be involved with tarot as there are people involved.

I appreciate everyone's comments.. I am of course the buffoon on a quest.

Ok so next question... the children embracing near the bottom of the card...could they be the future prince/princess who will come later?

big fat thelemic hugs,
Nicky
Top   #20




 


 


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