Book T Minors: Aries

Awww you guys just my month! That is why I'm so excited about this new forum. I find this method such an exciting way to look at tarot, and so useful in practice. I love the idea that more people can get exposed to it from our little conversations, and we can all share that process. I can't wait for us to start laying out our decks side by side, and comparing how different deck creators have used the same fundamental concepts and translated them into different representations of that.

Sticking with the 3 cards we're looking at here for examples, we can start to draw in more details we are familar with also. We have the Emperor as Aries, so that tells us something about these cards. Also the Empress is Venus. So the 4 of Wands is kind of like the meeting of the Emperor and the Empress. Male and femal getting together, and "completing" something. A lot of decks you'll see have that dual symbolism. In the RWS you have the women outside celebrating Spring, in the Thoth you see the Ram (Emperor, Aries) and the Dove (Female, Venus) on the wands. We can pull in other cards as well. The 2 of Wands is Mars, and hence the brutal Tower. The 3 is the Sun (The Sun card obviously). If you lay them out together you can see the relationships. Awesome eh!?

I was playing with a few decks last night, tossing these ideas around, and it struck me that in the RWS deck and most of its clones that I have, the only card in the suit of wands that has female charactes is the 4 of Wands. Every other is a male figure.

The 8 of Wands is Mercury, which is neither male nor female, and the 9 of Wands has the Moon, which is a female planet. But the Fire Signs are all male, and it shows in the characters selected. Interesting!

similia said:

Also the Empress is Venus. So the 4 of Wands is kind of like the meeting of the Emperor and the Empress. Male and female getting together, and "completing" something.

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My Liber T, (that just came in the mail yesterday) 4 of Wands has a man and a woman. Don't know enough about the deck to assume they are the Emperor and the Empress, but it's definitely male female energy going on.

I don't have a RWS deck yet. But I don't think that will last long. I was a one deck reader before I joined this site. But now I am wondering why.

AW

Always Wondering said:

Don't know enough about the deck to assume they are the Emperor and the Empress

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I just checked this in Scion's guide to the Liber T. If you've not already got a copy, you definately should. It seems to imply that the woman is Isis, which would to me, be a definate yes to the Empress as an equivalent.

I recently got the Via Tarot and was looking at its minors yesterday. They are I guess similar to the Liber T, in that they are based on the Thoth, and then expanded with more features. Though they are not the images of the decans as with the Liber T. Each minor card has a little lozenge at the top with an image that relates to the card. The 4 of Wands has a naked woman (Very Venus-ian) riding a Ram. I think you'd find a lot of decks have something like this, and the astrology explains why in this case.

Always Wondering said:

I was a one deck reader before I joined this site. But now I am wondering why.

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I was a two deck reader. I no longer wonder "Why", I now wonder "How". How am I going to pay for another deck.

similia said:

I was a two deck reader. I no longer wonder "Why", I now wonder "How". How am I going to pay for another deck.

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Glad I am not the only one.

We were dealing with such a nice system, then I laid out the nine Wands and applied corresponding Majors. I guess I expected the majors to begin to line up too. Don't want to get ahead of myself, but was wondering if the was a system of the Majors to applied to the 36 minors. You know, in the grander scheme.

I am on the growing list of Liber T info, poor Scion. Thanks.

AW

Always Wondering said:

but was wondering if the was a system of the Majors to applied to the 36 minors. You know, in the grander scheme.

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There are several I think, and probably a whole lot more I've never heard of. Initially there are the types we've been looking at. Matching up the Signs and Planets. Each minor is attributed to both a Sign and a Planet, so have a "matching" Major for each of those.

Also when you come to the qabalah, the Majors get the pathways that join the groups of Minors together. For example the Empress is the pathway between the 2's and the 3's. Without making to much work for Scion, he recently posted about a game that is a great way for a beginner to start making those connections.
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=96184

And of course, the straight numerology I think is very useful also. This is how I started my interest in looking at tarot in groups, by applying the numerology of the Majors to the same numbered Minors.

similia said:

The 4 of Wands is a whole different story. Its Venus in Aries. Soft feminine Venus is the exact opposite of mucho Aries, and so the difference is very striking, as you noticed Always Wondering. You can still see the Aries themes there I think. In decks based on the Rider Waite you see the firey joy of springtime, which is very Aries, perhaps the better side of Aries. Aries' potentially darker competitive-aggressive side is muted by having the planet Venus put into the mix.

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Well, yes thats all good... however, Venus is illdignified in the sign of Aries, and from whatever bit of astrology I know off... Venus is a total biatch in that sign (and an evil one scorpio )... so I never really understood how Venus in Aries could signify - "Completion"

Thinking about the 3 of Wands

I was thinking about the 3 of Wands on the way to work this morning, and had a few ideas regarding the astrology we've been looking at that gave me a new appreciation of the RWS image.

I probably should start by explaining what I said earlier a little better. The 3 of Wands is attributed to Sun in Aries, and as I mentioned, Aries is the sign of the Sun's Exhaltation, and also signifies the start of Spring. I should have explained more what this means, cause I realized its very important.

Every planet has some signs it is very happy in, some it is miserable in. They are known as its "dignities". With tarot we use terms like Elemental Dignities, to say how happy some cards are together. In astrology they have the same thing, it tells us how happy a planet is in a sign, and what it may act like. When a planet is exhalted, this means its at its shining glorious best. Literally "Exhalted" as in above all others. The planet is very strong in the sign it rules, but in the sign it is exhalted in, its in someways better. Its like our new love interest. Perfect in everyway, with no flaws or faults, a truly wonderful and amazing creature that deserves to be on a pedestal. So in Aries the Sun is a damn amazing thing. Wonderful beyond measure. (I'm an Aries myself, so am very qualified to tell you this )

And the Sun is not just any planet. Its the King of the Planets. The heart of the whole solar system. In fact, physically it rules the heart and the brain also. So in Aries, all its best qualities come out. It's "creative, generous, big hearted, showing joie-de-vivre, organizing ability, love of children, affectionate, magnanimous, dignified" etc. (From Parker's Compleat Astrologer)

Aries represents a ruler also, in that its about the physical head. So we have the two seats of ruler-ship in the body, the heart and the head. And they are working together at the very best that is possible, they are exhalted. So to me they represent an idealized ruler, like the best version of the mythology of King Arthur, or perhaps even Richard Lionheart on a very good day. This is why I like how Crowley changed the title of this card from "Established Strength" to "Virtue". Its similar in terms of the "king" analogy, but it brings in the romantic idealized society and rulership of that mythos. The 2 is a king also, but he's a Martial warrior king, fiesty and bloody and to me younger. The 3 is more even tempered, more mature (established strength) and virtuous.

The really cool thing was noticing how this relates to the image in the RWS. You have a king, raised up high above everything else (exhalted) looking down upon his fleet of boats, that are orbiting him, like satellites. He is like the Sun at the centre of the solar system, with everyone else revolving around him as he commands them too. That is why we are standing behind the king, rather than seeing him from front on. We are looking from his position out across the solar system.

Even better than that, I re-read what Frawley has to say about the first house in astrology, which is the natural house of Aries. It represents the head of course, and as such the rest of the body sometimes (like a King representing his kingdom), but also carrying that analogy further her describes it as "the ship that you sail in". Just like the boats orbiting the king. Awesome!!

I take back everything bad I ever said about poor maligned Pixie Colman Smith! Love your work lady!

sweet_intuition said:

Well, yes thats all good... however, Venus is illdignified in the sign of Aries, and from whatever bit of astrology I know off... Venus is a total biatch in that sign (and an evil one scorpio )... so I never really understood how Venus in Aries could signify - "Completion"

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Yep, all true. I've been trying to focus on only the astrology part so far, and temporarily fudge over the kinks with Venus being in her Detriment in Aries, so as to not get things too confused. But it is kinda of like taking the softest prettiest princess you ever saw, and chucking her in a biker bar. Things can get ugly

The card gets saved by being a 4. Plain and simple.

It's Chesed the 4th Sephirot, and the first below the abyss. The first 3 are ideals, not so much a reality, but the 4 is the start of the real thing. It represents the first real manifestation of the suit, so is a VERY strong position to be in. 4 is like the cube (one is the point, two is the line, 3 is a plane and 4 makes a cube, the first 3D object). Eventually we throw in the 5 which is when "Motion" comes into play, and of course that is why the 5's are so miserable and send everything straight to ****.

The astrology is strongest in the early cards, especially the 2's and 3's above the abyss. After that as we go further down the tree of life, it becomes less and less pure and things get more murky. For example the 10 of Swords. Why would the Sun in Gemini be so miserable? Its not because of the astrology, its because of the other stuff.

Aeon418 made the point in the thread on the signs that we are only looking at a part of the story, which is really true. I'm trying to get enough of the astrology system out there, so we can be comfortable tackling the rest. You caught me. *sprung*

So what makes Venus illdignified in Aries? All that softness and beauty up against all that male aggression?

AW