The Chariot/Cheth & Hebrew Letter

Grigori said:

Wait, are there secret papers? Really?

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Yes, but they are all in Class B. Note that the Probationer of A.'.A.'. is required to study all the Class B material.

You've probably downloaded them already. But if you haven't just do a search for:

Liber CCXXVIII De Natura Deorum.

Liber XXIV De Nuptiis Secretis Deorum cum Hominibus.

Liber C Agape Azoth sal Philosophorum.

Liber CDXIV De Arte Magica.

The only reason Crowley didn't publish them is because of his various OTO oaths.

You might also want to do a search for Francis X. King's, "The Secret Rituals of the O.T.O". Yes, it does contain some errors, but if you have no intention of joining OTO it won't do you any harm.

And if you do have intentions to joining the OTO?

Sorry, I'm feeling flippant . . . it sounds like this document knows my intentions and will flay me if I intend joining . . . if not, however, it will just ignore me

Sorry. Still curious though

\m/ Kat

Aeon418 said:

You've probably downloaded them already. But if you haven't just do a search for:

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Thanks Aeon, I have several of those, but not all so will hunt down the remainder. I know a probationer's reading should fill up a year, but I think I could stretch it across several

Aeon418 said:

You might also want to do a search for Francis X. King's, "The Secret Rituals of the O.T.O". Yes, it does contain some errors, but if you have no intention of joining OTO it won't do you any harm.

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Well I think my local OTO has no intention of letting me join, so I shall read it guilt free and with reckless abandon

thorhammer said:

And if you do have intentions to joining the OTO?

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Well obviously you might not want to read King's book.
But you might also want to investigate what the OTO actually is before you join. Some people join expecting it to be some great magical order, and are disappointed when they find out it's more like a social club. (see the letter extract I posted earlier.) In an A.'.A.'. sense the system of OTO, just like the old Golden Dawn, never leaves Malkuth/Neophyte.

Part of the efficacy of initiation rites lies in the surprise factor. If you already know what's coming the impact of the initiation might not be as intense.

For example I can think of one initiation (not OTO) where the candidate is made to believe they are in real physical danger. The intended feelings of fear that are supposed to be aroused by this situation might not occur if the candidate had foreknowledge that the initiators weren't really trying to kill him/her.

The publication of secret rituals to nullify their efficacy was partly behind Crowley's decision to publish the Golden Dawn initiations in the Equinox. But some people, like Regardie, think otherwise.

Grigori said:

I know a probationer's reading should fill up a year, but I think I could stretch it across several

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See Liber Collegii Sancti - The task of a Probationer.

1. The Period of Probation shall be at least one year.

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Really?

Loved reading post 21, especially after post 20! .

Also LOVE the way all groups all over the world get tarred with the same brush - classic. Sorry guys, I'm not big on 'academia' just my own experience.

thorhammer said:

And if you do have intentions to joining the OTO?

Sorry, I'm feeling flippant . . .

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So am I . Well I guess you could memorize the ritual, and the candidates responses and then go into the temple and .... Ohhhh that's too wicked to write here!

Aeon418 said:

But you might also want to investigate what the OTO actually is before you join. Some people join expecting it to be some great magical order, and are disappointed when they find out it's more like a social club.

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EXACTLY! And I'd take it further, check out the actual group you would like to join and dont prejudge them according to what you checked out about the OTO in general.

For some, it might seem like a sociall club, others might seem like (or even might be?) a very magical group (and thats easy to tell, check out the members and the people running it - that is if you can tell 'shit from shinola' as they say) and some you might NEVER want to come across again!

And if anyone thinks crap doesnt go on in the GD or AA as well ... look, just read Regardie's "Everything that you should know about the GD. Un/fortunatly (?) no one has written such a doc (? or have they) about the AA.

But again, I'm no academic, just what I have observed from personal experience.

Aeon418 said:

But you might also want to investigate what the OTO actually is before you join.

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Oh, I already have. I was shooed away unceremoniously. *le shrug*

As an aside, and because I feel the need:

Part of the efficacy of initiation rites lies in the surprise factor. If you already know what's coming the impact of the initiation might not be as intense.

For example I can think of one initiation (not OTO) where the candidate is made to believe they are in real physical danger. The intended feelings of fear that are supposed to be aroused by this situation might not occur if the candidate had foreknowledge that the initiators weren't really trying to kill him/her.

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I think I know the one you mean; I've been through one like this. But I did know, and yet that knowing in no way diminished the impact, let me tell you. It was a shock, and a bad one.

\m/ Kat

thorhammer said:

Oh, I already have. I was shooed away unceremoniously. *le shrug*

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How do you sort the serious aspirant from the merely curious?