Queen of wands an introverted?

gorgeousbutterfly

i am reading "understanding the tarot court" by Mary K. Greer and Tom Little and reading the part about "Myer-briggs type indicator (MBTI)" about the court and personality types.backed on jungian psychology. there are


-the extrovered ,and opposite side introverted

-intuitive and sensing

-thinking, and feeling

-judging and percieving.

so you are either extorvered or an introvert and you cant be both.

the good defines extrovered "draws energy from interacting with others,thinks out loud and prefer action to study."

Introvered "draw energy from solitude, think carefully before speaking and are intrested in understanding things than changing them"

So they label queen of wands as "INTJ" as an introvert? i always thought of her as someone who is very spontaneous fun loving girl who is popular and admired, she goes out and she inspires others but not only that she is energized and gets more energetic by individuals who are like her, enthusastic and lover of life that is all characterics of an EXTROVERT. what am i missing? Yes she is spirtual and she mediates and is spirtual etc.

she is a fire sign so she is intutive. (as cups are feeling, and pentacles are sensing,swords thinking)
 

Thirteen

Excellent as Greer is, she isn't always on the nose, and I really can't agree with her on this unless she's infering it from a reversed perspective--that is, the other side of the coin that all cards seem to have. I could see the Queen/Wands as "wanting to be alone!" in Marlena Dietrich terms--that is, rather like the queen in her castle, primping in the mirror, needing no one else but herself to admire. But a true introvert?

I know a lot of true introverts and they really lose energy around other people. That's not Wands to me. Wands always seem to find fuel in others, burning hotter when they're at the center of attention.

UNLESS Greer sees Wands as Air and Swords as Fire? I say that because, to me, the Queen who seems likely to flip from extreme extrovert to extreme introvert would be the Queen of Swords. One minute standing before a hall filled with people, lecturing, talking, instructing, thriving on the communication...the next minute wanting to be alone to think and solve problems.

I know a Queen of Swords and she VERY much flips from one end of the spectrum to the other. She can be having a fun time at the party chattering away one minute, and the next she's hidden away in a room with a book.

As for a true introvert: Queen/Cups. THERE is someone who is so sensitive that having too many others around her could scrape her raw.
 

WalesWoman

Being a Wands/Fire person, and qualifying as a Queen due to my femaleness and "maturity", there is some truth to this introverted/extroverted thing I think, that both can co-exist at the same time in various degrees in the same person.

I can be very extroverted (when feeling secure and confident when in my element), much as Thirteen described... the energy from other people can act like fuel to get me blazing. I haven't been the life of the party for many, many years, but I do remember those days. Still, I know I do get loud when I'm fired up about something, enthusiastic, bombastic and impassioned. For the most part I am open, friendly and sometimes talk to much.

But at the same time, too much of a crowd... is like dumping a ton of wood on a fire which practically puts it out, overwhelming sense of suffocation... so tend to withdraw and become more introverted. I tend to be "shy" in large gatherings, sitting on the sidelines and observing when I can't avoid going to them. Making small talk is not a forte, but if someone wants to talk about something specific, I'm all for it.

On the otherhand, solitude and wanting to be alone is a welcome and generally prized state to be in. I am a loner, even when I'm not alone. I tend to live in my head more than not, but enjoy and welcome company, if anything for the change of pace, input and exchange of ideas.... more fuel for thought, an injection of creative juices, sometimes the impetus to take what has been going on in my head and make it happen.

I'm not quite sure if this could apply astrologically, since Queen Wands is I think, Aries rather than Leo. I do know that on the whole Leos tend to exhibit both qualities, possibly because beneath the outgoing, vivacious ego lies a major infeority complex. Or so it is said, which seems to ring true, atleast for me... I'm sure I'm not quite as fantastic as I believe I am. :D So in a sense, we carry our own pin to burst our bubble, lest our heads get to big or worse, someone else pops it first. (See... I even talk in the royal third person sometimes)

Rethinking what Thirteen wrote and what I just said, perhaps I am a Swords/Fire rather than Wands/Fire... hmmmmm.

But... the qualifiers
-intuitive and sensing

-thinking, and feeling

-judging and percieving.

Those are very much part of this Queen and part of me. I have to disagree with Mary K. Greer... I think she can be both, without flipping the coin or the card. I know other Queen Wands that are very much like this, a blend of both and not conflicted about it at all.
 

Thirteen

WalesWoman said:
On the otherhand, solitude and wanting to be alone is a welcome and generally prized state to be in. I am a loner, even when I'm not alone. I tend to live in my head more than not...perhaps I am a Swords/Fire rather than Wands/Fire...
Wands are philosophial and spiritual, so I could see wanting to be alone, say, in a church praying, or in a passionate moment as you work out your personal philosophy...alone to feel that energetic connection that warms you like the sun and re-invigorates you.

But that doesn't quite ring as "being in your head"--which I see as far more "air." I suppose the difference is that the moment the solitary Wands works out the philosophy, they're going to be out there telling it to people. Calling a town meeting so they can share their revelation as a fiat accompli.

Whereas, an Air person would be happy enough to just think things through over and over again in their mind until they're ready to communicate it and get communication back on it. Argue, discuss, and then go back to solitude to think on it some more.

A subtle difference, granted, but that's where I see the difference.
 

WalesWoman

Thirteen said:
But that doesn't quite ring as "being in your head"--which I see as far more "air." I suppose the difference is that the moment the solitary Wands works out the philosophy, they're going to be out there telling it to people. Calling a town meeting so they can share their revelation as a fiat accompli.

Whereas, an Air person would be happy enough to just think things through over and over again in their mind until they're ready to communicate it and get communication back on it. Argue, discuss, and then go back to solitude to think on it some more.

A subtle difference, granted, but that's where I see the difference.

Well, that explains why next weeks paper will have a letter to the editor and emails & letters to every official I could think of with my reasoning as to why a cemetary should not be put in on 10 acres of gravely, timbered watershed along a creek... in my front yard, literally across the street. :D
 

huredriel

The court card that comes up for me most often is the Queen of Wands and I'm a Leo ........ yep I *can* be extrovert, most often when out with friends or doing something I'm really interested in as WalesWoman describes ....... yet most of the time I live in my head and have a real need for solitude ...... can't be around people for too long else I start to get really irritated. Get me in a gathering with mates and people I feel *bonded* with and I'll be one of those talking the most ......... put me in a large gathering where I know no-one ...... and I'll either have not turned up or be sat trying to hide and feeling quite sick!

I think you can be both ....... after all, we are all made up of many different parts and experiences, not just one :)

PS: My chosen significator is Queen of Swords, but I have absolutely no air in my astrological natal chart whatsoever!
 

Thirteen

Huredriel, do you have any water signs? Especially Rising? Moon?
huredriel said:
Get me in a gathering with mates and people I feel *bonded* with and I'll be one of those talking the most ......... put me in a large gathering where I know no-one ...... and I'll either have not turned up or be sat trying to hide and feeling quite sick!
See, this is what I see for the Queen/Cups. This is VERY much a water attribute. Wands people (USUALLY), can be friends with anyone and everyone. They can go among strangers and end up with a dozen new buddies before the night is out--and end up the center of attention, the new star among these strangers (I've seen it happen! Quite remarkable).

But a Cups/Water person tends to be uneasy among people they *don't know* Cups/Water Courts want family and friends, the longer known the better (consider the cards in the suit that reinforce this: 3/cups--sisterhood, 6/cups--nostolgia, 8/cups--how hard it is to leave all you know, 10 cups--the joys of family). The whole cups suit is dedicated not just to romance and love, but good friends and family. NOT strangers.

I think that it is the QUEEN/CUPS who would be fine--gracious, comfortable, even talkative with those she knows, but unhappy, silent, even terrified among strangers. She would do EXACTLY as you do, try to hide or run (I've seen this happen, too, with a very strong Cancer sign, a woman I would have labeled Queen/Cups no question).

Compare this to the suit of Wands, where cards are all about dealing with others who are not family/friends--5/Wands, competiting with strangers to stand out, 6/Wands--being applauded by a crowd, 7/Wands--standing up to strangers, etc. No other suit (in RW, at least) has so many people in it.

This is why it's very hard to correlate REAL PEOPLE with court cards. Because real people have many sides to them--many astrological (if you believe that) signs influencing them. And real people can be different court cards depending on situation, or a time in their lives, or as they are viewed by others. We can be the Queen/Cups one day, and Queen/Swords the next.

The court cards are going to hold to the essence of their symbol in their introversy/extroversy. Which is why I'd argue that the Queen/Wands, while she might get annoyed with people who distract her from finding her spiritual energy, and want to be alone for inspiration, is not the sort to feel sick or want to hide from strangers. Exactly the opposite. The whole essence of the Queen/Wands, for me at least, is that she wants to be on stage--whether that is a party or a theater. She wants to charm everyone, strangers and friends. No stranger, or group of strangers, is going to be anything to her but an exciting challenge. The more likely they are to resist her, the more determined she'll be to win them over.
 

huredriel

Thirteen said:
Huredriel, do you have any water signs? Especially Rising? Moon?
LMAO ........ *ahem* ....... Scorp rising and ummmm Cancer Moon LOL ...... actually I have equal balance of fire to water ....... my predominant signs are Virgo believe it not ....... strange considering I always choose the Queen of Swords dontcha think :D and Queen of Cups is the Court I'd always go for absolutely last out of any of them.

See, this is what I see for the Queen/Cups. This is VERY much a water attribute. Wands people (USUALLY), can be friends with anyone and everyone. They can go among strangers and end up with a dozen new buddies before the night is out--and end up the center of attention, the new star among these strangers (I've seen it happen! Quite remarkable).
Well this has been known to happen ........ but it depends on how much alcohol has been drunk ;) ....... in that situation I'm very Queen of Wands :D

competiting with strangers to stand out, 6/Wands--being applauded by a crowd, 7/Wands--standing up to strangers, etc. No other suit (in RW, at least) has so many people in it.
Hee hee, yep 3rd decan Leo to boot and very competitive!!
 

Thirteen

huredriel said:
my predominant signs are Virgo believe it not
LOL! Given what you said about strangers, yes, I very much believe it. There's that other introvert sign. The water signs will want to hide under the rocks and/or snap their claws when strangers approach, but Virgo just scowls and says, "Do I know you?" and shuts the door. It's Virgo's (the Hermit's) home and no one gets to come in who is not invited :D
 

WalesWoman

I can identify with everything huredriel said... perhaps the Queen Cups then corresponds with my moon in Capricorn or my Venus in Virgo. I've never been able to figure out why I'm not your "typical" Leo... or perhaps I do most of my attention seeking here. :)