Zan and BC's Excellent Thoth Adventure: The Fool

zan_chan

Hey Batty, you out there?

I've been reading Liber AL today and came upon this line: Chapter 1, Verse 11

These are fools that men adore; both their Gods & their men are fools.

I haven't quite formulated my thoughts on this to comment just yet, but here's a link to the study group thread.

Is this Fool a "fool that men adore"?
 

ravenest

There are fools and then there is The Fool.
 

nicky

For me, the Fool shoots through Ain, Ain Soph and Ain Soph like a rocket - the energy generating from that well placed sun on his crotch. He is not ejected out of but rather in to... we carry the universe within all of us always.

The Fool is a sexy bugger :)
 

Ashtaroot

nicky said:
For me, the Fool shoots through Ain, Ain Soph and Ain Soph like a rocket - the energy generating from that well placed sun on his crotch. He is not ejected out of but rather in to... we carry the universe within all of us always.

The Fool is a sexy bugger :)

that is what I meant with the poof the explosion the spark of the whole :)
 

Grigori

zan_chan said:
Is this Fool a "fool that men adore"?

I'd vote no, I think from the tarot realm The Fool is one of the closest cards to a real expression of divinity, and not the foolish versions or social substitutes we indulge in.
 

ravenest

Yeah ... I've always thought RHK used the term in the same sense as Mr. T.
 

thorhammer

ravenest said:
Yeah ... I've always thought RHK used the term in the same sense as Mr. T.
I agree; the tone is contemptuous, dismissive, angry even.

I think it's worthwhile linking ravenest's thread in this one:

I never notied that before.

\m/ Kat
 

Bat Chicken

Hi Zan! I'm here. My eyes can only go so long reading on-screen, so I haven't read Liber Al yet. I promise I will try to catch up and try still to get some of these in print. I live in a rural area so my access to hard copies is limited. :)

Aeon418 said:
Have you read Crowley's essay, BERASHITH: An Essay in Ontology? It really is required reading if you want to understand what Crowley means by Zero.
Thank you Aeon, for the essay recommendation and the link, it certainly gave me a place to start and it led me down an interesting path. I understand it completely in the Qabalist sense, but, I struggled with the full meaning of what Crowley was saying and this certainly helped. A non-dual state is automatically thought of as Unity, 1. It is even present in the equation (sort of! :laugh: ). But then the abstraction at that point is not complete and there lies the source of my conflict with you involving the differentiation. I now see what I was missing and clarity of your earlier example - and I should add the 'negative' aspect.

I was left scratching my head with his leaps in logic around one of the equations in the essay. I discovered in Chapter 5 of "Magic Without Tears" he acknowledges that the algebra might be found questionable by some. It certainly did for me. The indices yielded a result that didn't seem to jive in the larger equation. Following the assumptions of another part of the same equation into higher algebra proved to be quite fascinating in potential. I followed the questions it raised in me as far as my elementary understanding of algebra could take me, all surrounding 0 to the power of 0, 1/0 and (∞x0) and it led me to union sets, Aleph Null and the Riemann sphere and I was quickly out of my league - But it is worth looking those up because I was blown away by the implications. My algebra is too weak to do anything but meditate on the possibilities. I wonder if this is actually what I perhaps should be seeing - even if in the strictest sense, the equation isn't really 'accurate'? I expect I'll be working with that for a little while! :)

His other analogies in Ch. 5 are also more visual for those so inclined. The logic in one of those examples uses intersecting sets, so I am still reconciling that with the earlier ideas, even though this is very straight forward by comparison.

(Sorry to ramble on - but it's not enough just to know it, I need to internalize it so I can use it)

Grigori has shared the link to the site with all of Crowley's writings on another thread, but I'll include the specific link to "Magick Without Tears" here if anyone is interested. It is a really interesting read:
http://hermetic.com/crowley/magick-without-tears/

As for your last comment Aeon, I am so sorry my apparent ignorance offends you. You are certainly not required to bear it by any means. Pointing me in the right direction was very helpful and for that I am grateful. It is in that vein that I hope you will choose to continue. The implication was inappropriate and, most certainly, unnecessary.
 

Le Fanu

ravenest said:
Yeah ... I've always thought RHK used the term in the same sense as Mr. T.
Who is RHK and Mr T? I'm sure I know but these abbreviations befuddle my brain...
 

Aeon418

Bat Chicken said:
A non-dual state is automatically thought of as Unity, 1.
Not quite. Unity = 0.

This is a bit of a confusing point and many people don't get it straight off, but it's really simple once it clicks home.
When you say that unity is 1, you're actually setting up duality again. The only way to perceive the unity as 1 is to step outside of it. By that very act you have suddenly created the number 2, self and not-self, relationship, relativity, perception, object/subject, etc. Join them back together and they all vanish in Zero. 0=2. ;)
Bat Chicken said:
As for your last comment Aeon, I am so sorry my apparent ignorance offends you.
I'm not offended in the slightest. In fact it's usually the other way around. I'm a Sagittarius rising. ;) I don't take offence easily, but I frequently give it without knowing it.