I'm new, & -What elements exactly don't get along?

Hi, I'm a new member. I've used a RW deck a bit in the past and mainly the Feng Shui Tarot Deck by Connelly. I've had a Thoth Deck for a while,(but only started readins with it recently) read most of the book of Thoth, and have a fair grasp of it. The things I can't grasp I will bug you all about a lot here. I'm fairly sure I'm going to post a lot of my readings in the readings forum and let you know about them here, as theyw ill be with a Thoth Deck. For now, I just have one...set of questions.

I understand how each of the elements are represented by a suit, and in a 15 card Thoth or Golden Dawn Spread, certain elements do and don't get along and that affects the meaning of the card, and the reading.

Can only a court card be ill-dignified?

What elements exactly don't get along? I know Cups and Swords Don't like each other. Do Wands and Disks not like each other too? How about Swords and Disks? What are the exact hate/indifferent/like relationships between these four elements?

Within a set of three cards in a Thoth tarot spread, does the position of a card play a role in how the suits interelate with each other? For example, If the situation card is a Disk, The internal influence card a sword, and the external influence card a cup, are the external and internal forces okay with the situation, but the external and internal influences are at odds with themselves?

The cross on the back of the cards tell you what elements don't get along.

If they are opposite each other, they don't.

which elements are which on the cross?

I just read this in the pamphlet that comes with the deck-

Swords are adverse to disks. Wands oppose cups. Swords are friendly to cups and wands. Wands complement swords and disks.

I was lead to believe swords and cups didn't get along, is this wrong?

Red for fire, Blue for water, yellow for Air and dirty green color for Earth (in the full version of the cross there are 4 colors in the Earth square, Russet, Olive, Citrine and Black).

Fire and Water do not get along.
Air and Earth do not get along.
Fire and Air are on quite good terms.
Fire and Earth are fairly neutral.
Water and Earth are on quite good terms.
Water and Air are fairly neutral. (I'd say they are a bit neutral as Water is a cold feminine suit, while Air is hot masculine one. In contrast Earth and Water get along well, both being feminine and cold. Fire is hot, dry and masculine, so it rather hates wet, cold and feminine water)

There is a great thread on the topic running at the moment on how to apply this http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=92919

I dunno guys ... I know the theory but ....
Fire and water dont get along? In some cases they make steam, contain it and focus it and its an amazing source of energy, dont contain it, it just wafts off, contain it but dont control it - kablooey! (A bit like the Prince of cups see the 'steam' clouds behind him).

But in tarot we are talking suits,.. cups and wands dont get along? I'm pretty sure they do, and think anyone will agree that has ever practiced magick, wicca or tantra ... if you get my drift.

My system is to look for 'dignification' through the whole reading taking into account the subject matter and the nature of the person.

Sure, use these 'rules' to learn and start off, but dont be restricted by them.

In some instances (eg. magnetism) opposites attract and similar repels.

center cluster of the cross

So then does the center cluster denote the variations of the elements? There are variations of shadings - orange-red, yellow-orange - like airy side of fire? Or is it just degrees with the suit (like the minors)?

balenciaga said:

So then does the center cluster denote the variations of the elements? There are variations of shadings - orange-red, yellow-orange - like airy side of fire? Or is it just degrees with the suit (like the minors)?

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The central rose and it's coloured petals relates to the letters of the Hebrew alphabet and the Major cards. The diagram on this page should help: http://www.hermeticgoldendawn.org/rose.HTM

The Rose Cross on the back of the Thoth cards is just a simplified version of that cross.

ravenest said:

But in tarot we are talking suits,.. cups and wands dont get along? I'm pretty sure they do, and think anyone will agree that has ever practiced magick, wicca or tantra ... if you get my drift.

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And anyone who has been married will tell you that they are complete opposites and although they can do stuff together they are always talking different languages at each other.

That's cos men think with their wands.
and women are utterly justified in nagging them.

Chuck a cup of water at it, I say.
That will put the fire out.

Now, I made a washing up rota and why aren't you sticking to it?

thanks, Aeon

similia said:

Air and Earth do not get along.[/url]

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So then one should think dust blowing on an empty plain?