Tarot of Marseilles help desk (Frequently Asked Questions): Non-History

kwaw

Re: Re: The Kings

kwaw said:
This makes me think of the four figures of the wheel of fortune in some other decks [eg, the visconti], one that will rule/have a crown, one that does rule/has a crown, one that has ruled/had a crown, one that has no rule/crown.

Kwaw

Perhaps more relevant, as a self-contained reference, is that it is the king of earth element suit that is without a crown, and it is the bull, symbol of the earth sign taurus, that is without a halo in Atu XXI.

Does this parallel between 'odd one's out' indicate that the four creatures of the 'world' could also be symbols of the four suit kings?

Kwaw
 

TenOfSwords

Question about the colours

I have the Kris Hader reproduction/recreation and I've been wondering about how consistent the use of colour in the Marseilles tradition(s) is e.g. in the Hader, the leaves on the spine of Death are green and the shield of the emperor/empress is a yellow eagle on green background and the hands of the pope are yellow.

Is the colour-scheme in itself just as much 'the tradition' as the imagery and evolving in the same way or is it more subject to individual variation and preference of the particular card maker? or asked in a different way: Is it just as significant and consistent that Le Pendu is bending his right leg as the fact that his feet are red or do the colours vary more than the rest of the imagery?

Apologies if it has been addressed elsewhere and it might seem to be a trivial question, but to me it tells off how much or how little emphasis has been put on colour symbolism.
 

Major Tom

It's a good question. :)

There's actually very little consistency regarding colour within the Marseilles tradition.

Even various impressions made from the same plates of the Conver have been coloured differently.
 

stella01904

But if you look at the LS TdM and the Heron, even though they appear very different, they follow a very similar color pattern, with the Heron substituting black for green.
 

Fulgour

Colours & Meaning

I've always felt there were possibilities within
the scheme of Primary, Secondary, Tertiary.

Red, yellow and blue are the primary colours.
Orange, green and purple, secondary colours.

Tertiary colours are made by mixing primary
colours with the nearest secondary colours.

http://www.abelard.org/colour/col-hi.htm

*

"Brides in the Middle Ages wore green
to symbolize fertility."
http://www.factmonster.com/spot/colors1.html
 

tmgrl2

Hadar discusses color in his book..in French. I had translated it somewhere here but can't find it.

As has been said...color in the Marseille decks requires examination across the decks, not just an examination of a modern reproduction...but....

here is a thread that discusses color ..you might find it of interest, TenOfSwords:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=42413&highlight=Marseille+colors

I suggest you scroll down and read jmd's summary, although the whole thread is worth reading.

This one is on colors in Marteau...

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=19560&highlight=Marseille+colors

This thread also discusses colors:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=24030&highlight=Marseille+colors

Rusty Neon started it...to answer non-history questions on the Marseille decks
 

TenOfSwords

Thanks for clearing it up and thanks for the links (I really should learn to spell color as most people do it, should make searches more fruitful).

Maybe a moderator could merge this thread into the non-history question thread. Seems more appropriate there?
 

shaveling

stella01904 said:
But if you look at the LS TdM and the Heron, even though they appear very different, they follow a very similar color pattern, with the Heron substituting black for green.
That color in the Heron always leaves me asking if it's really black, or a very dark green, or maybe something that started lighter when the cards were printed and went dark with the passage of years. Do other people have definite opinions on this one way or another?