Introvert

CrystalSeas

JIf a statistician (who's also into Tarot- wow) would make his way here, I think he might be able to provide a more nuanced analysis.

Sorry to destroy your stereotype, but the WOW statistician who made his way here is a she, not a he.

There is no way to provide a more nuanced analysis because this is not a random sample.

If people self-select to participate in a poll, then the only nuances you can provide are about the people who participated. You cannot extrapolate about people who did not participate, even if they are members of the same internet forum.

So all the statistics that can be gathered are statistics about "people who are members of AT and choose to answer a poll".

Mostly it means you can say things about the kind of tarot readers who do online polls and join forums. And that's the limit.

You can't say anything about people who didn't participate because you don't have any data about them. You can certainly project a lot of fantasies about the things you imagine about them, but that is just fiction, not based on any data.
 

feminine_mystique

I'm the biggest introvert. I observe others but wanted to learn more about people "under the mask" which is why I use tarot.

Not that I'm nosy or anything.. I just find tarot fascinating in what it could tell you. Interpreting shadow cards/base cards is definitely something I want to excel in as well. Getting the deepest answers.

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk
 

gregory

Sorry to destroy your stereotype, but the WOW statistician who made his way here is a she, not a he.

There is no way to provide a more nuanced analysis because this is not a random sample.

If people self-select to participate in a poll, then the only nuances you can provide are about the people who participated. You cannot extrapolate about people who did not participate, even if they are members of the same internet forum.

So all the statistics that can be gathered are statistics about "people who are members of AT and choose to answer a poll".

Mostly it means you can say things about the kind of tarot readers who do online polls and join forums. And that's the limit.

You can't say anything about people who didn't participate because you don't have any data about them. You can certainly project a lot of fantasies about the things you imagine about them, but that is just fiction, not based on any data.
EXACTLY this - thanks CrystalSeas. I get so sick of conclusions drawn based on non-random samples.

"90% of people prefer cats to dogs." Sample taken from members of the Cats' Protection League.

"90% say they will vote Labour" - survey taken among those attending the Labour Party conference.....

So few surveys are truly random any more. Even those that claim to be so only get to sample those who can be bothered to take part - which almost suggests they are selected from the more "responsible" members of society - or the loneliest. I used to work in market research - and I was acutely aware of only REALLY getting one type of person - the kind who looked as though they'd co-operate ! Grouchy people are never included in the results - they all told the interviewer to piss off. :D

And to return to THIS topic - my IRL friends are all aware that I come to forums in part to avoid interacting with Real People - partly because I'm deaf and it's a pain, but there is also the shy introverted thing. I am VERY interested in all things tarot, but you would never catch me in a real life GROUP of PEOPLE who meet up once a month. I'd have to TALK to them. No thanks. But many people here are extroverted and do that.

It's not the TAROT thing that brings out the disproportionate number of introverted tarotistas here; it's the forum side of it. You'd find all the introverted botanists on a botany FORUM, but probably not in a botanical garden, maybe.
 

RavenLuna

Here's an interesting link on INTJ, says Hillary Clinton is an INTJ.

http://www.truity.com/personality-type/intj

Thank you for the link. That is really interesting... even the comments are interesting! I'm going to lose loads of time in there :D I like that they included Sir Isaac Newton on the list. I'm sure he would have loved tarot.

It's definitely true that I have a thirst for knowledge and desire to understand systems. Perhaps that's why there are a few INTJs (and similar personalities) in here - because you never really get to the end of your tarot learning journey.

I like what Gregory said about introverts being here because of the forum format, that certainly helps. If I had to learn tarot solely by reading in public, I wouldn't have done it.
 

Barleywine

One of the funniest back-handed compliments I ever got was when a co-worker told me many years ago that I "reek of self-confidence." That definitely fits some of the INTJ commentary I've seen on the various websites about self-assurance based on intelligence. (I call myself a "lapsed Mensan" because I never really connected with the rest of the "two-percenters" I came in contact with - they must have been extroverts! :))
 

Papa Tango

Well, I took the test. Then I compared it to the full battery I took 28 years ago--at the hands of professional psychologists. It roughly remained the same. My four letter designation was NUTS. Briefly hospitalized for this--as the testing was court ordered--I am still banned in Florida from visiting golf courses and political events. Nor do I agree with their assesment of my IQ--as I feel that I have been educated far beyond my native intelligence... :cool2:

Now that I have moved from that state, the testing seems to indicate that my scoring is INTP. The gory details are as follows:

Introvert: 22%
Intuitive: 66%
Thinking 3%
Perceiving: 31%

There seems to be a bit of dichotomy due to that 3% with my flagellating in an INFP sphere. This is probably due to my Cancerian tendencies. What to do.... :confused:
 

Papa Tango

I disagree with dividing things up by introvert or extrovert appeal...because it's often done by people who have a very disdainful view of extroverts.

OK, but here is the real deal. It has nothing to do with Tarot. Or whether you are Catholic, Protestant, or Bahia. It has to do with your behavioral and cognitive orientation.

Not relevant you say? Then discard everything you accept about Tarot--as ultimately what is shown there is based upon archetypes of social form, behavior, and personal action.

We all perform internally, socially, and existentially as actors on a social stage. Never forget that--as it is a fact-and our roles are proscribed and defined. Vary too far and suffer social repercussions. Some are outward facing. Others are inward facing. Opinion does not change that--as such behavior is established and well documented. Matter of fact, it is essential to 'human being.'

Opinion does not trump human behavior... :bugeyed:
 

EmpyreanKnight

Sorry to destroy your stereotype, but the WOW statistician who made his way here is a she, not a he.

There is no way to provide a more nuanced analysis because this is not a random sample.

If people self-select to participate in a poll, then the only nuances you can provide are about the people who participated. You cannot extrapolate about people who did not participate, even if they are members of the same internet forum.

So all the statistics that can be gathered are statistics about "people who are members of AT and choose to answer a poll".

Mostly it means you can say things about the kind of tarot readers who do online polls and join forums. And that's the limit.

You can't say anything about people who didn't participate because you don't have any data about them. You can certainly project a lot of fantasies about the things you imagine about them, but that is just fiction, not based on any data.

I was previously thinking about how long a shot it would be if the site would have an actual statistician hereabouts, but I kinda knew too that people of all persuasions and professions flock here. It's so nice that an actual one got to answer my question!

Btw my apologies if my phrasing seemed to imply it, but I make no stereotypes about statisticians. If someone where to ask me the default sex of one, I would answer that it could be either really. It's just that in school here in my country, we were taught that in English, the gender-neutral form of a pronoun usually takes the masculine one. I know I could have used "he/she" or "his/her" instead of the plain "he" or "his", but it would be cumbersome if I were to use them all the time.

When I looked at the research that the MBTI manual did in 1985 and 1998, I was astonished and couldn't help but compare them to our very own polls here, since the results were quite divergent. I mean, a 4:4 vs 7:1 I:E result for two population sets is quite revealing. The figures were certainly compelling. But I remembered a caveat from a professor in our statistics class about making sure that the survey sample is sufficiently randomized before applying it to the focus population. I am assuming that the people behind the MBTI manual know their stuff and conducted their studies on a randomized sample of the general pop. But I have misgivings if we can say that about the poll we conducted in these forums, even if the population size of 571 may not be negligible. I remember how important random sampling is and how it might not apply to our poll here, so I posed my misgivings thus:

There might be questions about how randomized our sample of test-takers are relative to the members of these forums, and relative to all the Tarotists in the general population. If a statistician (who's also into Tarot- wow) would make his way here, I think he might be able to provide a more nuanced analysis.

The assumption I am going to make may be wrong, but I think that a layman, upon looking at the results of our MBTI poll where 87+ % of the responders answered as Introverts, would conclude (or fantasize) "Ah, so most Tarotists are really introverts!" They may not think that since the poll was not performed on a random sample, it would not be correct to extend its results to the pop segment they're thinking of.

So thanks a lot for clarifying things, CrystalSeas! You taught us that in making conclusions about the poll, it is not correct to state that "Most Tarotists are introverts" or even "Most Aeclectic Forumers are introverts". The accurate statement would have been "Most of the people who took the poll are introverts, though this conclusion does not apply to the members of this forum in general or even to the population of Tarotists as a whole". It's a good thing to know stuff like this so that we can make logical inferences. :)
 

EmpyreanKnight

I call myself a "lapsed Mensan" because I never really connected with the rest of the "two-percenters" I came in contact with - they must have been extroverts! :)

Oh wow Barleywine, you're a Mensan? I am a (silent) member in our local chapter here. This year they issued a blue-greenish ID with a bar code and signature space at the back and my mug, name, member number (1**5), first year of membership, and date and month of validity in front. I never went to any of our gatherings tho lol. And I'm INTJ too!

I know another one of our members is into Tarot, and his wife is a pretty well-known intuitive who's into Tarot too. I dunno if they're members here though.
 

Barleywine

Oh wow Barleywine, you're a Mensan? I am a (silent) member in our local chapter here. This year they issued a blue-greenish ID with a bar code and signature space at the back and my mug, name, member number (1**5), first year of membership, and date and month of validity in front. I never went to any of our gatherings tho lol. And I'm INTJ too!

I know another one of our members is into Tarot, and his wife is a pretty well-known intuitive who's into Tarot too. I dunno if they're members here though.

I'm what my 92-year-old Dad calls a "usta-was." I still have my old membership card but I haven't been an active member for years, not since I got tired of being the only one in 100 miles and didn't feel like driving that far for meetings - especially not for the "Friday Night Temperance Society," whose motto was "Ridding the world of Demon Rum through the deceptively simple practice of drinking it all." Pack of shameless extroverts anyway . . .