Marseilles Seekers Thread (Second Exercise)

EnriqueEnriquez

frelkins said:
World & Star have long blonde hair; Papesse has a covered head. World & Star are naked, Papesse wears many clothes. Actually, while World is naked, she does sport a red cloak, like Papesse's. Maybe we should count her as semi-nude, with her belt of laurel leaves.

I would say two are basically nude and one is heavily dressed, creating a N-D-N pattern.

frelkins said:
All the women have white hands. All the cards gaze to the left, the past. Of course, they are all women, these main figures. They start small in World, magnify to Papesse, and then go to medium size in Star. Also 1 stands, 1 sits, 1 kneels - a falling rhyme.

Great. I have noticed that you always pay attention to the optical rhyme, which will be very useful when you are reading the cards.

frelkins said:
The World has a green bottom on which the animals repose, Papesse's throne seems to be also on green, Star is kneeling on the green, altho' the water flows towards Papesse. Star & Papesse have bent elbows, World has open arms.

Very good! You did great.

frelkins said:
Star's flowing brook.

frelkins said:
I like the way World dances.

frelkins said:
How comfortable Star is being naked under her celestial display. Why Papesse doesn't ditch her robes - in that group, it's like wearing a burka on a nude beach.

This is a fantastic analogy!

frelkins said:
Whatever all these beauties are staring at.

I loved this. In this case, you could place a card in front of Le Monde, to see what is what they are all staring at. In any case, similar to Satori’s sequence, there is a heavy accent on the past here. The difference being that Lestoille at the end suggest this will be left behind.

frelkins said:
The look on Star's face.

I have always felt she has a very zen-like face. She is all here and now, staring at emptiness.

frelkins said:
The sly smile on World's lion - he looks back at Papesse like he knows a naughty secret about her.

frelkins said:
Something's going down on the left that's worth everybody's attention. Someone's entire energies remain stuck towards the past, there's nothing looking out at the present or forward to the future.

Good. I see someone who has closed a chapter in her life too soon, so she starts second guessing her choices, like when we jump into our summer clothes when winter isn’t off yet and we have to run back home to get a sweater. But this will only be a brief set back. Soon enough it will get warmer.

Best,

EE

Hooked on TdM

Camoin Deck: Ace Batons, VIIII Coupe, VII D'epee.

Rising, steady, Rising

1. -wand centered, sword centered
- blue ruffle around hand, blue leaves, blue sword
- open circles on want stumps, open circle of cups
- all perfectly balanced
- yellow rays, yellow leaves, yellow petals
- hand holding wand, hilt of sword
- rays from wand, leaves and vines on cups

2. - I heard trumpets, a drum beat. It was like a musical progression from a parade, starting out small, growing huge and loud and tapering off...

3. - the brightness of the rays and the extension of the vines, the excitement of this and the exuberance
- the feeling of uplifting and increasing
- the sword which ground the excitement so that it's not overwhelming

4. - My mood changed with the cards! I felt as if I would burst with joy from my chest yet I was still still and solid

5. - The expansion of the cup and vines, as if reached to it's furthest point or ultimate potential
- the complete exploration, no stone unturned

6. - the four flowers of the swords, they are so modest and quiet yet so perfectly balanced as a good foundation, making room for growth and further exploration.

7. - The music that just roared in my head. I've never heard that before from cards. It was very wonderful to experience.
- also the snapshot of such greatness when learning and growing from a single action

8. - I singular action taken in the past, spurred forth great emotional growth, exploration and experiences. leading to a solid intellectual foundation on which spurs forth more growth from a different perspective. This is about a learning experience. It is in motion, an evolution of an aspect of the soul. It is beautiful to see, feel and hear it despite the changes to the previous ideals that this brings.!

Okay.. this was so cool to do!

Hooked

indianstorm

exercise 3-- Camoin TdM

Camoin Deck: VI LAMOREVX, III CUPS, IIII CUPS

Firstly- EE-- some of what you've written makes perfect sense even to non cartomantic crowds. People look for meanings in symbolism from almost everything. I do believe , or at aleast one my theories of the tarot, are they function as cues. A deceptive cue--because while you are searching for what the card means- you end up uncovering various other prompts which lead to solution/s. Maybe- the TdM served as a media for lateral thinking back in the old day-?? just something I pondered on-

'Our second exercise is about paying attention. It will consist on looking at three cards together and answer the following questions':

What did you notice?
Firstly-- I seem to be attracting cups left, right and centre lately- In the camoin deck- the cupidon wings pale blue,the fair lady with the flowers in her hair- long pale blue streak on robe, the pale blue tips of the 3 cups laves, with pale blue central vine of 4 Cups.

3 individuals in amoreux rhyme with 3 cups- if I treated cupidon as 4th person in amoreux- rhymes with 4 cups-

Cupid has 6 arrows in his quiver plus one he's aiming with- 7 Arrows- 3cups + 4 Cups = 7 Cups together.

4 flowers on amoreux lady to the right hair rhymes with 4 cups.

This rhyme looks weighted to the right

What did you hear?

Persuasion gone wrong--

What did you admire?
i liked the body language of the man in amoreux- his hands point to the lady on the right, his gaze to lady on left, but his feet are pointing in both directions!! Lol!!--

What astonished you?
Men still can't make up their minds when it comes to choosing a woman- despite cupid getting involved.This was back in the day as well-- somethings dont change

What would you like to see again?
cupid rogue arrow aimed better--

What was most tender?
3 and 4 cups saying there is more to this story-- it doesnt end here-- there's an extra cup in 4 for an extra person-- cupid- he is recognised for his part in the solution- so thank you!

What was most wonderful?

well--i noted that we sometimes have difficulty picking sides- but this time the cards actually appears to have picked a side-- shades of red in the goblet, palle blue stripes, 4 cups to the xtreme right- saying pick her- the girl with the 4 flowers in her hair!!

What did you think was happening?
I noticed there's a prominence of green in the lady to the left of THE LOVERS. there is no green in cupid or 3/4 cups. There is somesort of triangle going on here-- and the woman is being cut out or being phased out for whatever reason because the odds are against her. Not usre I am getting this- but it just seems she is not going to get her way!!

Hope this is along what you are looking for...

Stormy

Gavriela

Hi Enrique -

I'll get there - it's been an insane day and I was getting into a reading like this with another deck of cards.

The Hebrew bible shares a similarity to the Christian one, in a way. You learn that there are four levels on which it is to be interpreted:

pshat: the literal meaning (symbol)
remez: hints and mnemonics
drash: the allegorical
sod: the mystical

But however you interpret it, one of the rules is that the pshat must always stand. The symbol never loses its inherent symbol quality.

There are all sorts of interesting things Jewish scholars did with the bible - like pulling word analogies out of the Prophets that 'rhymed' with verses in Torah.

The whole of it is called The Language of the Branches, and should you ever run across Yedidah Cohen's stunning translation of the Baal ha Sulaan's In the Shadow of the Ladder, I think you'd really enjoy it.

It's pure kabbalah, not tarotic kabbalah, but the Baal ha Sulaan held the notion that it was there to be used by all people - he didn't see a reason it needed to be limited by a Jewish belief system, though he himself was very pious, and died penniless in Jerusalem in the early part of the 20th century.

If you read Hebrew, the book is stunning, in both its starkness and its richness. Yedidah's translation not only saved it from being completely subsumed by the Kabbalah Centre types, but she did an outstanding job of keeping much of the feeling in her translation.

This concept of language isn't exclusive to Christian Europe, but at the same time, I dread putting the tag 'universal' to just about anything, because we can only come to an understanding of the universal through a set of particulars.

When I was studying film and theatre, we also concentrated on it - most notably in the works of Pasolini, Josef Sternberg, and Jean Genet.

Fascinating stuff.

firefrost

Exercise 2

IIII Bastons
VII Bastons
Le Soleil

What did you notice?
I noticed everything is drawn to the centre. I noticed that on the VII Bastons, the centre baston is leaning off to the right (puts me in mind of the Tower of Pisa!) and the orange/yellow bands aren’t symmetrical.

This seems to be a central to rising eye rhyme, on closer inspection. The Sun ends the row, and the VII baston leans towards it and on the IIII Bastons, the flower in full bloom (as is the sun) is at the top.

What did you hear?
Trumpets and a band. The sun put me in mind of Leivgment (Judgement) and with the bastons I thought of Cheerleaders marching to the music.

What did you admire?
The flowers and thoughts of summer.

What astonished you?
How much similarity there actually is in the three cards! I would never have likened these three cards before.

What would you like to see again?
Oh, summer days with beautiful flowers – again and again!

What was the most tender?
I feel I should say the couple on the sun here, even if he does appear to be blocking her – can’t decide if that outsized hand means a huge welcome!
Having said that, I’m falling back and going with the flowers again. There are leaves, buds and blooms – who knows, they could have been lovingly tended to by one of the couple on the Sun.

What was most wonderful?
That The Sun is there at the end, its warmth radiating out.

What do you think is happening?
I think decisions are being made. One person is quite set in their ways and the other is leaning towards new ideas the first may not like.
The central rhyme I see as the grey woven bastons and the couple on the Sun. They’ve been going along nicely in their lives but now the woman wants to try something different and the man’s not too happy.
The rhyme rises and she should get her way – how can anyone fail with the Sun beaming down on them?!

stella01904

EnriqueEnriquez said:
OBJECTIVE OBSERVATION PROMPTS INTUITIVE INSIGHT

We observe, looking for eye rhymes and visual rhythms without projecting our intellectual understanding of the symbols on the cards, and once we have detected all these poetic patterns we allow an all-encompassing idea to label the essence of what we are seeing.

I just had to drag this quote over here from the last thread.

Sometimes the left brain has to step aside and let the right brain do it's thing.

Back soon with what I got for the third exercise. It looks like a good one, I want to take a bit of time with it.

Bernice

Emperor + 2 Cups + 4 Coins

Noblet (Flornoy) Emperor + 2 Cups + 4 Coins

What I noticed (+ eye rhymes):

Emperor is beholding something pleasing to him which could result in something of value. His staff is repeated in the 2 Cups and is doubled in the 4 Coins. i.e: 4 staffs, repeated number(4) which is summed up in the 4 Coins.
Is he going to put his 'all' into it?

Ground level continues from the Emperor to the 2 Cups, but the 4 Coins stands alone - no ground.
Creatures: Eagle low in Emperor, to griffons (?) high in 2 Cups. Emperor is considering enhancing or adding, to something that is already established, elevating it. He's considering getting something 'off the ground'.
Shield is repeated in Emperor and 4 Coins, but is higher (elevated) in 4 Coins and its' design appears less 'personal'.
It is something that will flourish (4 Coins foliage)

Hear:
Ahhhhh! (vocal expression of a good idea that could be followed up) After looking at them again = lots of tinkling bells.

Admire:
From contemplation (emperor looks at top of 2 Cups), there can come something 'real' that is stable and bloomimg, 4 Coins.

Astonishment:
He (Emperor) has thought on something that already has an established identity (eagle shield), and can percieve a way to transform it!

To see again:
You lost me here (?)

Most tender:
I don't see any tenderness. I do see something fragile that has become a pleasing concept. (First 2 cards)

Most Wonderful:
The transistion from no-thing to some-thing. It appears in each card.

What was happening:
What can be imagined, can be realized. But the foundation must be sound (his shield), and the purpose must be honest & true (his staff).

Bee

lark

Emperor~ Death~ Ace Batons

What I notice?
>Hands... the Emperor's hands and Deaths hands are the same...but not Ace Bartons...yet they all hold something.
>The leaves on the ground in Death match the droplets on Ace Batons...colorwise too.
>It looks like Death picked a little tuft of grass from the ground and is wearing it on his head.
>Emperor and Death stare straight at each other.
>The heads on the ground in Death stare over at Ace Baton.
> The Baton looks like the aorta of a heart.
>They all wear a band of color around their wrists.
>The eagle looks prehistoric.
>Each has a symbol on their card...a cross...a flower...and a feather/leaf.

What do I hear?
The sound of a chiming bell...a ticking clock....dripping water.

What did I admire?
The Emperor's stylish hat.

What astonished me?
That Death's back looks like a smoked fish...how when you eat it you seperate the flesh from the back bone of the fish, and the meat looks like the blue part of Death's back....with lines in it just like that.

What would I like to see again?
The feather/leaf on the Baton.

What was most tender?
They way Emperor has his red leg crossed over the blue one...it makes him look casual..approachable.

What was most wonderful?
Oh, that ruffle on the sleeve of Ace Baton.
It reminds me of the Adams Family show...THING...the hand with no body, and the flesh eating plant Morticia Adams used to feed everyday.

What did I think was happening?
It's Emperor and Death in a show down...Death wants to lay Emperor low with heart surgery.
That was my instant first impression on seeing the cards together....it's about a man struggling for his life.

stella01904

3rd Exercise

IIII Deniers * Chevalier de Coupe * Le Chariot

EnriqueEnriquez said:
What did you notice?

The upward-pointing chevrons on the IIII Deniers shield and on the armor of the guy in the Chariot. The Chevalier has a pink and blue horse, there is a pink horse and a blue horse pulling the Chariot. Gold coins with red centers rhyme with the bowl of the cup, and the Chevalier's cup rhymes with the scepter on the Chariot. The Chevalier looks a little like the Chariot driver. Coins rhyme with wheels. The red in the gold buds on the Deniers card rhymes with the wine in the cup.

What did you hear?

Hooves thumping on soft dirt. Wheels grinding - they sound screechy. The Chariot makes a rattling sound.

What did you admire?

The way the Chevalier balances a cup full of wine on his palm while riding a spirited horse. He's very good at this!

I think the guy and his horses on the Chariot also admire him, maybe envy him a little. They are all looking his way!

What astonished you?

The Chevalier's horse splitting into two horses on the Chariot. I'd never thought about this before!

What would you like to see again?

I would like to see the guy in the Chariot ditch the crown and the stiff armor. I'd like to see him become the Chevalier once more, wear comfortable clothes, ride a single unified horse and go where his heart leads him.

What was most tender?

The same thing I admired - the way the Chevalier holds the cup - he does not grasp.

The little leaves and grasses are also tender. I hope they do not get trampled underfoot.

What was most wonderful?

That the Chariot seems to be ready to turn and follow the Chevalier! That looks hopeful.

What did you think was happening?

I see the IIII Coins as a small, steady income. (I am using the Noblet, but I remember Jodo put a phoenix on this card.) We are only at 4, but the material is stable because it is continually renewed. A small, but adequate flow. It's like a little paycheck every week from a day job that is not demanding and gives you time to pursue the things you love (Chevalier de Coupe) during your time off.
The Chevalier loves what he does and he's very good at it! Maybe someday the money will pour in, but even if it never does, he's still managed to enjoy his life.

Contrast him with the Chariot. Here, it could be a promotion. Say you took a position as manager, and there was more money and marginally more prestige, but you would have to be there six days a week, eight or more hours a day. You would have to enforce policies that you know are stupid, move where and when they told you to go, and be rah-rah patriotic about a company that you know isn't ethical at all. The wheels roll in two different directions. The Chariot driver is in a box way up high, above the shield from the IIII Deniers that's become a mere company logo, removed from his horses, he isn't at one with them like a rider would be. He looks so stiff in that armor. He's even cut his hair, and it's not golden anymore, it's that pinky color that passes for "flesh." He's looking back at his Chevalier days and wanting to return to that.
So this spread might advise a person not to take a job or promotion simply for money but to continue to do the things they love. You can't take it with you.

MUCH more incisive than the conventional "You've been in a financial bind but there is a new romance coming that will make everything all better" - !!!

ETA: As a rule, the Chariot is one of the cards I most like to see, but with the Chevalier riding away from it, it seemed to reek of restriction and imposed order.

This deck is alive....

EnriqueEnriquez

Hooked on TdM said:
Camoin Deck: Ace Batons, VIIII Coupe, VII D'epee.

Rising, steady, Rising

There is something I want to point out. Ideally, we should see just one whole rhythm, composed by the three cards. Not each card as a separate rhythm. In this case I would see that we are looking at a steady rhythm, since there is no sense of the whole sequence going neither up, nor down. In fact, the eye rhyme created by the wand and the sword gives a symmetric feeling to the whole sequence.

Hooked on TdM said:
-wand centered, sword centered
- blue ruffle around hand, blue leaves, blue sword
- open circles on want stumps, open circle of cups
- all perfectly balanced
- yellow rays, yellow leaves, yellow petals
- hand holding wand, hilt of sword
- rays from wand, leaves and vines on cups

Excellent.

There are two ways of seeing: we can actively project our vision like torpedoes over the image, or we can become receptive with our eyes. This is a way of looking that is similar to hearing. Hearing is always receptive. To experience a poem we have to listen to it. Even if we are reading it, we must read it aloud so we can listen to its shape. In the same way we need to listen to the tarot’s shape, and we accomplish that by listening with our eyes.

Hooked on TdM said:
I heard trumpets, a drum beat. It was like a musical progression from a parade, starting out small, growing huge and loud and tapering off...

Great. I tend to see wands as the sound of a piano, or a pipe organ. A sustained progressive sound in which no key is released, but new keys are added up. Cups feel more like voices, human voices, a chorus. And swords are an expansive sound, like the sound of a flute or a trumpet. The sound expands even when the center, the source of it, is empty.

I like what you are hearing!

Hooked on TdM said:
- the brightness of the rays and the extension of the vines, the excitement of this and the exuberance
- the feeling of uplifting and increasing
- the sword which ground the excitement so that it's not overwhelming

I was specially interested in the last sentence. The sword anchors the wand’s sound, but it is not as strong as the wand.

Hooked on TdM said:
- My mood changed with the cards! I felt as if I would burst with joy from my chest yet I was still still and solid

Yes, like digesting an eureka moment.

Hooked on TdM said:
- The music that just roared in my head. I've never heard that before from cards. It was very wonderful to experience.
- also the snapshot of such greatness when learning and growing from a single action

I am loving you!

Hooked on TdM said:
- I singular action taken in the past, spurred forth great emotional growth, exploration and experiences. leading to a solid intellectual foundation on which spurs forth more growth from a different perspective. This is about a learning experience. It is in motion, an evolution of an aspect of the soul. It is beautiful to see, feel and hear it despite the changes to the previous ideals that this brings.!

This is a good example of how we can bring our previous knowledge of the cards to the table, once we have gotten a the essence of the message through an exploration of their poetic patterns.

I see an idea that is so good, or strong, that it has to be watered down for people to accept it, or understand it. That wand’s fire is killing the cup’s leaves! The idea has to be processed, tamed, or decanted, for it to be useful.

Beautifully done!

EE

Marseilles Seekers Thread (Second Exercise)

EnriqueEnriquez

Hooked on TdM

indianstorm

Gavriela

firefrost

stella01904

Bernice

lark

stella01904

EnriqueEnriquez