firecatpickles
Since our discussion in Ancient Minchiate Etruria: Hope got a bit off-track, I have started this new thread to continue it. This thread is linked (above) and vice versa.
KK
KK
Minchiate - Faith
firecatpickles
The allegory of Faith sites on her throne studying a tablet (faithfully?), and in one of the cards below the figure is male and holds a monstrance, suggesting perhaps this figure is Mary Magdalene or Peter.
Carried over from the other thread is the observation that "this Faith could be Pope or Papess."
Meneghello-Solleone- Williams
Carried over from the other thread is the observation that "this Faith could be Pope or Papess."
Meneghello-Solleone- Williams
DoctorArcanus
Faith according to Cesare Ripa
Catholic Faith according to Cesare Ripa's Iconologia
According to Ripa, faith is holding in her left hand the tables of the law (old testament) and a book (new testament).
In her right hand she holds a hearth with a candle on it, as a symbol of the illumination you get through Faith.
This is one of many versions provided by Ripa: other versions are more similar to a Papesse (woman holding a cross) or to a Queen of Cups (woman holding a cup).
The Solleone card is quite interesting: it does not seem to fit conventional representations of Faith...
Marco
Catholic Faith according to Cesare Ripa's Iconologia
According to Ripa, faith is holding in her left hand the tables of the law (old testament) and a book (new testament).
In her right hand she holds a hearth with a candle on it, as a symbol of the illumination you get through Faith.
This is one of many versions provided by Ripa: other versions are more similar to a Papesse (woman holding a cross) or to a Queen of Cups (woman holding a cup).
The Solleone card is quite interesting: it does not seem to fit conventional representations of Faith...
Marco
Dwaas
DoctorArcanus said:
Very interesting. The Etrurian Faith holds the tablet then and a book.
Now I wonder what kind of faith Faith is. Is it like faith in for example the returning of a lost son, or more like faith in growth of your soul while learning? I hope this question is not too vague...
Here the Etrurian Faith and a picture of a painting from 1530 which is now in the The Hermitage in St. Petersburg, called Allegory of Faith. With total different attributes!
Blessings
Attachments
firecatpickles
From this Thread: http://tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=93040
If you take the Hebrew word, Emmet, for Faith, and reduce it numerologically based on the Hebrew numerological system, we get get this result:
Emmet = Truth (i.e, "Faith")
The Scripture notations are the first instance of this particular vocabulary in the Old Testament.
Hebrew word |... Numerological equivalent | Reduced | Expanded | Minchiate card | .....Scripture
[size=+1]אמת [/size][col............] 1 + 40 + 400 = 441 [col...]= 9 [col]= 1 + 8 [col]= 18. Faith [col..]Genesis 42:16
If you take the Hebrew word, Emmet, for Faith, and reduce it numerologically based on the Hebrew numerological system, we get get this result:
Emmet = Truth (i.e, "Faith")
The Scripture notations are the first instance of this particular vocabulary in the Old Testament.
Hebrew word |... Numerological equivalent | Reduced | Expanded | Minchiate card | .....Scripture
[size=+1]אמת [/size][col............] 1 + 40 + 400 = 441 [col...]= 9 [col]= 1 + 8 [col]= 18. Faith [col..]Genesis 42:16
firecatpickles
Rosanne
Sorry to be a pain...
Genesis 42.16
Send one of you to fetch your brother, and you will interned, so as to test your statement whether you are honest; else by the life of Pharoah, you are certainly spies.
Joseph does not seem to have Faith. Or are you meaning something else?
~Rosanne
Genesis 42.16
Send one of you to fetch your brother, and you will interned, so as to test your statement whether you are honest; else by the life of Pharoah, you are certainly spies.
Joseph does not seem to have Faith. Or are you meaning something else?
~Rosanne
firecatpickles
You have to go by the Hebrew text:
"'Send one of you, and let him fetch your brother, and ye shall be bound, that your words may be proved, whether there be truth in you; or else, as Pharaoh liveth, surely ye are spies.' (Gen. 42:16)"
The word for Faith in the Hebrew is actually the word "Truth".
The translation "whether you are honest" is inaccurate.
"'Send one of you, and let him fetch your brother, and ye shall be bound, that your words may be proved, whether there be truth in you; or else, as Pharaoh liveth, surely ye are spies.' (Gen. 42:16)"
The word for Faith in the Hebrew is actually the word "Truth".
The translation "whether you are honest" is inaccurate.
firecatpickles
This translation: "so as to test your statement whether you are honest" takes two separate clauses and incorrectly creates one.
His commandment for them to go away is for two reasons: "that [their] words may be proved" and "whether there be truth [i.e., "faith"] in [them]."
Joseph is in fact testing their honesty and their trust, as they had forsaken him before and he had to be sure of their loyalty both to him and the (oral) Torah.
His commandment for them to go away is for two reasons: "that [their] words may be proved" and "whether there be truth [i.e., "faith"] in [them]."
Joseph is in fact testing their honesty and their trust, as they had forsaken him before and he had to be sure of their loyalty both to him and the (oral) Torah.
Rosanne
It is not really in 'Good Faith' then is it? Anyway I find your answer that the word for Faith in Hebrew is actually Truth, more pertinent.
From a Christian point of view at the time of Minchiate- Faith/Truth was through the intermediary of the Pope- so Faith and Truth would be the Catholic Pope- not the Orthodox Eastern Pope. Then again images like the Papesse have been used as 'Mother Church' and she does have a book of Wisdom/Truth like Minchiate 18; which seems more like have Faith, rather than 'a Faith'.
Faith is said to be belief without proof- but the image of 18 with the book shows Faith because of the Book/tract. Maybe it means Faith in a promise or loyalty to a promise- been constant.
Like your numerology Kilted Kat!
~Rosanne
From a Christian point of view at the time of Minchiate- Faith/Truth was through the intermediary of the Pope- so Faith and Truth would be the Catholic Pope- not the Orthodox Eastern Pope. Then again images like the Papesse have been used as 'Mother Church' and she does have a book of Wisdom/Truth like Minchiate 18; which seems more like have Faith, rather than 'a Faith'.
Faith is said to be belief without proof- but the image of 18 with the book shows Faith because of the Book/tract. Maybe it means Faith in a promise or loyalty to a promise- been constant.
Like your numerology Kilted Kat!
~Rosanne
