Nicolas Bodet

Moonbow

The Bodet and Vandenborre look very similar, there are small differences though.

For example looking at the Captain we can see where they differ:

Bodet:.....................................................Vandenborre:
bodetcaptainwd6.png
.......
vandenborrecaptainwt8.png


As I understand it the Nicholas Bodet dates 1743-1751 and the Vandenborre is 1766-1775. Not much in it but the Vandenborre, when comparing these two cards, looks more recent as we can see that the Captain's hat is covered by the border.

I really enjoy this deck and its is similar in places to the Vieville, particularly in that the cards were printed in reverse as the Vieville was. The Tower, Star, Moon and Sun cards are like the Vieville depictions too.

Does anyone know where Martin Dupont figures in this?
 

kwaw

The Juggler and the Ace of Hearts:

kwaw said:
I · Van den Borre's LE BATELEUX:
Among his things on the table appears to be a pack of French Suited cards, with the Ace of Hearts showing:

http://www.tarothermit.com/belgian.htm

Friend.Here's ftrange Juggling it seems.
Score. Ha, ha, but now you talk of Juggling, we had
rare Juggling here not long fince; we had like to have
had all the Money in the Country juggled away.
Friend. As how!
Score. Why, here was a Trickfter came down to Gotham."

Enter Wat Wafhball

Ho, Wat Wafhball! Come in, come in mun; this zame
Man can teftify what I am going to zay: 'He is a very
honeft Freeholder, of vour Pounds a Year, zo he is,
a Barber here by; with your Leave, Mafter, I'll drink to
him.
Friend. Pray do, you are welcome, Friend.
Wat. Thank you, Sir.
Score. Come pull a Chair Wat, and zit down; I was
telling Mafter Friendly here, of the Trickfter that chang'd
the Cards zo, you know, Wat, in the Town-Hall.
Wat. Ay, that was a bitter Dog, I believe we fhan't
forget him in Hafte.
Friend. Why, what did he do ?
Score. Why, yon muft know, Sir, he play'd feveral
Tricks, but his greateft Skill lay in changing the Cards.
He had a plaguy Nack at that; don't you remember,
Wat, how he dealt a Card round the Hall,
when our High Sheriff had got the Ace of Hearts,
you know ?
Wat. Ay, as plain an Ace of Hearts are ever I zaw in
all my born Days.
Score. Ay, and what does this zame Trickfter but with
one Whif, conjures away this zame Ace of Hearts,
and claps the Knave of Clubs in its Place..
Friend. Ha, ha, ha.
Score. When my Neighbour Wafhball and I zaw that,.,
we wou'd have had the Mayor made his Mittimufs, and
zent him to a Gaol.
Wat. No, no, not for that; not for that, Landlord, it
was for changing an Englifh Guinea into a French Piftole,
you know.
Score. Right, right, zo it was Wat, zo it was; and you
know the Mayor faid the Piftole was the better Gold, and
wou'd not meddle with him vor't.
Friend. But there was Four Shillings loft by that Change;,
what cou'd your Mayor fay for that ?
Wat. Zay! Why he pretended to prove by Logick, I
think he call'd it, that Seventeen and Six-pence was
more than One and Twenty and Six-pence.
Friend. Pretty. Sophiftry truly, for a Mayor of a Corporation;
and what is become of this Juggler?
Score. Gone to the Devil, vor ought I know.
Friend. From "whence came he?
Wat. Why zome zay from one Part, zome another;
but thofe that pretend to know beft, zay he came from
zome Part of the Zouth-Zeas.
Friend. I rather believe the South-Seas came from him.
Wat. Pray what is this zame Zouth-Zeas? A Shire,
Town, Burrough, or Market-Town?
Friend, It was a Market, and once had a very great
Trade for Flumery and Leeks.
Score. Well, of all Garden Stuff, I hate thofe zame
Leeks.
Wat. They leave a plaguy Stink behind them.

From A Gotham Election by Mrs. Centlivre
Published in The Works fo the Celebrated Mrs. Centlivre: With a New Account of Her Life by Susanne Centlivre, 1760.

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=95IBAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA160&dq=&as_brr=0&ie=ISO-8859-1#PPA159,M1

'Tis true, to marry is the moft inhuman
Damn'd Cuftom in the World; for, look you, Brother,
Wou'd any Man ftand plucking for the Ace of Hearts,
With one Pack of Cards all Day's on's Life?

From The Works of Francis Beaumont and John Fletcher 1750

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=tm0kAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA7&dq=&as_brr=0&ie=ISO-8859-1#PPA7,M1
 

Moonbow

Wonderful Kwaw! And you have good eyes too!

This is the best scan I can find of the Bateleur from the Vandenborre and it certainly does look like a heart on the cards. Also, for comparison is the Bodet, showing more differences between these two decks:

Vandenborre:..................................Bodet:

vandenborrebateleurae7.png
...........
bodetbateleurxg6.png
 

kwaw

ABRACADABRA ~ I Turn The Juggler's Baton...

Moonbow* said:
Vandenborre:..................................Bodet:

vandenborrebateleurae7.png
...........
bodetbateleurxg6.png

... INTO A LEEK ;)

Friend. Pretty. Sophiftry truly, for a Mayor of a Corporation;
and what is become of this Juggler?
Score. Gone to the Devil, vor ought I know.
Friend. From "whence came he?
Wat. Why zome zay from one Part, zome another;
but thofe that pretend to know beft, zay he came from
zome Part of the Zouth-Zeas.
Friend. I rather believe the South-Seas came from him.
Wat. Pray what is this zame Zouth-Zeas? A Shire,
Town, Burrough, or Market-Town?
Friend, It was a Market, and once had a very great
Trade for Flumery and Leeks.
Score. Well, of all Garden Stuff, I hate thofe zame
Leeks.
Wat. They leave a plaguy Stink behind them.
 

Moonbow

:D excellent.... "plaguy Stink" an' all.
 

kwaw

kwaw said:
Friend. Pretty Sophiftry truly, for a Mayor of a Corporation;
and what is become of this Juggler?
Score. Gone to the Devil, vor ought I know.
Friend. From "whence came he?
Wat. Why zome zay from one Part, zome another;
but thofe that pretend to know beft, zay he came from
zome Part of the Zouth-Zeas.
Friend. I rather believe the South-Seas came from him.

On the South Sea bubble, by which rare Juggling here not long fince; we had like to have had all the Money in the Country juggled away:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_South_Sea_Company


"For several years, since the conclusion of the war,
there had appeared a growing taste for money speculations,
not only in England, but throughout other
parts of Europe. This was first taken advantage of
for state purposes in France, where the national
finances had been thrown into so hopeless a state, that
the government was on the eve of bankruptcy."

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...ig=YhjOF8JAiYiN8zDwmNPplwXq2DQ&hl=en#PPA59,M1

South_Sea_Bubble_Cards-Tree.jpg


South Sea playing cards, 1720
http://www.wopc.co.uk/uk/margary/bubble.html

The
notion of political playing-cards was not altogether
new : in the reign of Charles II. a pack of such
cards had been published on the celebrated Popish
Plot, which had caused almost as great an excitement
throughout the country as the bubbles of the
year 1720. A set of bubble cards had also been
published in this latter year in Holland ; but whether
the Dutch took the hint from the English, or the
English from the Dutch, it is not easy to determine.

From A South Sea Ballad:
...
5.Tis said that alchemists of old
Could turn a brazen kettle,
Or leaden cistern, into gold, —
That noble tempting metal ;
But if it here may be allow'd
To bring in great and small things,
Our cunning South Sea, like a god,
Turns nothing into all things !
...
10.Five hundred millions, notes and bonds,
Our stocks are worth in value ;
But neither lie in goods or lands,
Or money, let me tell you.
Yet though our foreign trade is lost,
Of mighty wealth we vapour ;
When all the riches that we boast
Consists in scraps of' paper!
 

kwaw

quote:

The period of the South Sea bubble is that in which
political caricatures began to be common in England ;
for they had before been published at rare intervals,
and partook so much of the character of emblems,
that they are not always very easy to be understood.
Read's Weekly Journal of November 1, 1718, gives a
caricature against the Tories, engraved on wood, which
is called "an hieroglyphic," so little was the real
nature of a caricature then appreciated. Another
fault under which these earlier caricatures labour is
that of being extremely elaborate. The earliest English
caricature on the South Sea Company is advertised in
the Post Boy of June 21, 1720, under the title of " The
Bubblers bubbled ; or, The Devil take the Hindmost."
It no doubt related to the great rush which
was made to subscribe to the numerous companies
afloat in that month. I have not met with a copy of it,
but in the advertisement it is stated to be represented
"by a great number of figures." In the advertisement
of another caricature, on the 29th of February in this
year, called " The World in Masquerade," it is set
forth, as one of its great recommendations, that it
was " represented in nigh eighty figures." In France
and in Holland, (where the bubble-mania had thrown
everything into the greatest confusion,) the number of
caricatures published during the year 1720 was very
considerable. In the latter country, a large number
of these caricatures, as well as many satirical plays
and songs, were collected together and published in
a folio volume, which is still not uncommon, under
the title, " Het groote Tafereel der Dwaasheid," (
The great Picture of Folly.) The greater portion of
these foreign caricatures relate to Law and his Mississippi
scheme. In one of these, a number of persons
of both sexes, and of all ages and conditions in society,
are represented acting the part of Atlas, each supporting
a globe on his shoulders. Law, the Atlas who
supported the world of paper, — F Atlas actieux de papier,
as he is termed in the French description of the plate, —
bears his globe but unsteadily, and is obliged to call
in Hercules to his aid.

http://ids.lib.harvard.edu/ids/view...tions,+Baker+Library,+Harvard+Business+School

Roi Atlas, he I pourquoi te fatiguer ainsi ?
Permets qu'Hercule vienne, et te donne assistance,
Et l'aide a soutenir ton charge d'importance.
Quoi qu'on dit c'est papier ou du vent, aujourd'hui,
II n'y a en ce temps d'espece si pesante ;
Plus qu'en troc et trafic il pese plus que d'or."

So little point is there often in these caricatures,
and so great appears to have been the call for them
in Holland, that people seem to have looked up old
engravings, designed originally for a totally different
purpose, and, adding new inscriptions and new explanations,
they were published as caricatures on the
bubbles...

...a
large plate, which seems originally to have been an
allegorical representation of the battle between Carnival
and Lent, (a rather popular subject at an earlier
period,) is here given under the new title of " The
Battle between the good-living Bubble-lords and approaching Poverty,"

...The best of these caricatures is a large engraving
by Picart, which appears in the Dutch volume, with
explanations in French and Dutch, and which was
re-engraved with English descriptions and applications
in London. It is a general satire on the madness
which characterised the memorable year 1720.

"Qui," says the inscription,— "

Qui le croira 1 qui 1'eiit jamais pense ?
Qu'en un siccle si sage un systems insense
Fit du commerce un jeu de la Fortune ?
Et se jeu pemicieux,
Ensorcelant jeunes et vieux,
Remplit tous les esprits d'une y vresse commune."

Fortune is here driven in her car by Folly, the car
being drawn by the personifications of the principal
companies who began the pernicious trade of stockjobbing,
as the Mississippi, represented with a wooden
leg ; the South Sea, with a sore leg, and the other
bound with a ligament ; the Bank, treading under foot
a serpent, &c. The agents of some of the larger
companies are turning the wheels of the car, and are
represented with foxes' tails, " to show their policy
and cunning." The spokes of the wheels are inscribed
with the names of different companies, which, as the
car moves forward, are alternately up and down ;
while books of merchandise, crushed and torn beneath
them, represent the destruction of trade and commerce.
In the clouds the Devil appears making bubbles
of soap, which mingle with the " actions" and
other things (good and bad) that Fortune is distributing
to the crowd."

...At the other extremity of the picture, the infatuated
crowd is hurrying forward to fill the three places
of its final destination, — the mad-house, the poor-
house, and the hospital. The latter is called, in the
English print, " The House of Fools ;" but, in several
particulars of this kind, as well as in artistical
execution, the original engraving of Picart is
much superior to the English copy. Folly is
represented with the spacious hoop-petticoat,
patches, and other extravagant fashions of the
day, — a true female exquisite of the year 1720.


Folly1720.jpg

Folly in 1720's garb.

England Under the House of Hanover by Thomas Wright, 1848

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...ig=YhjOF8JAiYiN8zDwmNPplwXq2DQ&hl=en#PPA69,M1
 

kwaw

The Final Destination

quote:

...At the other extremity of the picture, the infatuated crowd is hurrying forward to fill the three places of its final destination, — the mad-house, the poor-house, and the hospital. The latter is called, in the English print, " The House of Fools"

VANDENB22.jpg


Harlequin stockholders:
http://ids.lib.harvard.edu/ids/view...tions,+Baker+Library,+Harvard+Business+School

Many are driven crazy who believed in schemes:
http://ids.lib.harvard.edu/ids/view...tions,+Baker+Library,+Harvard+Business+School

Bomabario, O Death. You were no friend to law when you shot down Pope Clement:
http://ids.lib.harvard.edu/ids/view...tions,+Baker+Library,+Harvard+Business+School

Index to images:
http://www.library.hbs.edu/hc/ssb/recreationandarts/tafereel.html
 

MaureenH

ihcoyc said:
This is perhaps the most curious. Unlike the Besançon Tarot, which puts Juno and Jupiter in the places of the Papess and Pope, the Belgian decks use Bacchus/Bacus for the Pope, and the Spanish Captain Fracasse, a miles gloriosus type character from commedia dell'arte, instead of the Papess. Juno and Jupiter could be viewed as an attempt to preserve the symbolism of the original cards. Captain Fracasse seems far removed from the original.

I wonder if that change was a spoof or a social commentary about people taking certain ideas (religion, or tarot?) too seriously to the point of snuffing the life out of them. Who used these cards? How widely were they accepted? What were the generally-accepted meanings (if there were any) of these different cards?
 

eugim

Please Monsieurs et Madmoiselles...
Return to the deck topic please ! // Could we ?
I know that each of us has his own prior belief but here we are I think to search iconographic details.

-kwaw you re posts are awesome as usual even I am not agree with you.(I m not close but never to Qabbalah).

-I mean this this a new a wonderful (full) thread...
So why don t we be close to the topic ? / I mean we are talking about Belgian family born from Vieville deck,so for me that is the central point all about.

-For example they have an unusual XV card...
I mean with regard to the others Marseilles decks cousins.
His faces barely all around his body...

-Moonbow are you there ? /Or not ?

Eugim