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Sophie's Avatar
Sophie  Sophie is offline
Join Date: 10 Oct 2004
Location: moving again
Posts: 20,323
Eden Gray is wrong

I find the idea of Raphael in the Lovers quite unlikely. He is the archangel of Healing. In Temperance, possibly, though in the original tarot, Temperance is a feminine angel, and Raphael is masculine (yes, angels & archangels do have sexes in angeology!! - though some don't). Eden Gray also seemed to have trouble with her Judgement Day myths: go around Italy & have a look at umpteen Judgement Day representations in churches, painted before or at the time Tarot was invented - we have Michael as the archangeal blowing the Trumpet to wake the dead.
Top   #11
Greywoolfe's Avatar
Greywoolfe  Greywoolfe is offline
Join Date: 05 Jun 2005
Location: Kent, United Kingdom.
Posts: 584

Originally Posted by tarotbear
According to Eden Gray:

#20 - Judgement - Gabriel - water
#14 - Temperance - Michael - fire and Sun
#6 - Lovers - Raphel - air

So where is Uriel, pray tell?
I think The Devil is supposed to be Uriel. I did a webserach for Uriel and came across this snippet:

"Uriel is one of the Archangels of rabbinical angelology. He was sent by God to answer the questions of Esdras (II Esdras iv). He is mentioned in I Enoch and IV Ezra, where he "watches over thunder and terror." In the Midrash 1, Uriel is said to be one of the four guardians of God's throne. In The Book of Adam and Eve he presides over repentance.

Uriel appears in Milton's Paradise Lost where he is the 'Regent of the Sun' and 'sharpest-sighted spirit of all in heaven.'

Uriel is of the leading angels in noncanonical lore, and ranked variously as a Seraph, Cherub, Regent of the Sun, Flame of God, and Angel of the Presence. As one of the most faithful and dedicated members of the host, Uriel was also placed in charge of Tartarus (another name for Hades)."

from some of these aspects- 'The Flame of God' (Bringer of light- Lucifer?) and guardian of Tartarus (Hades, Hell) it seems that 15- The Devil fits the bill.

Top   #12
psychicbody's Avatar
psychicbody  psychicbody is offline
Join Date: 12 Jul 2005
Location: Syracuse, NY USA
Posts: 273

I think Auriel (Uriel) should be the Sun. His name does mean fire of god, not "temptation" of god ;p
If Gabriel is not Judgement, than Justice is the runner up for me. I was told he is the angel of "redemption", as well. However, in Norse Mythology, he is the watcher of the Bridge to Adgard, which would be more akin to The Hierophant.
Top   #13
UniversalSeeker's Avatar
UniversalSeeker  UniversalSeeker is offline
Join Date: 07 Apr 2002
Location: Texas, USA
Posts: 85

Two of Cups, you make a good case for Auriel (Uriel) being the devil.

Top   #14
Shade's Avatar
Shade  Shade is offline
Join Date: 28 Aug 2002
Location: California, USA
Posts: 2,863

So, I have to ask. Angelology? Is this a Doreen Virtue thing?
Top   #15
Sophie's Avatar
Sophie  Sophie is offline
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Angeology? nothing to do with Doreen Virtue. It's quite serious. I was as baffled as you were!! I believe it's a branch of folkore or myth studies.
Top   #16
psychicbody's Avatar
psychicbody  psychicbody is offline
Join Date: 12 Jul 2005
Location: Syracuse, NY USA
Posts: 273

Like Demonology, it's Myth/Folklore, as well as Theology. And no, it is not a Doreen Virtue thing: the subject is ancient.
Top   #17
Carla's Avatar
Carla  Carla is offline
Join Date: 13 Dec 2009
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Tarot Wisdom - Rachel Pollack

I was just reading Tarot Wisdom by Rachel Pollack, and she suggests the following:

The Lovers - Raphael, 'Healing of God, God Heals'
Temperance - Michael, 'Who is like God'
Judgement - Gabriel, 'Strength of God, Hero of God, or God is my Strength'
The Devil - Uriel, 'Light of God, or God is My Light'

I can add the following facts--
Only two of these four archangels are mentioned by name in the Bible. Gabriel is mentioned 4 times. Twice he appears to Daniel to help him interpret his dreams (Daniel 8-9), once to announce John the Baptist's birth to his father (Luke 1:11-20), once to tell Mary she will give birth to Jesus (Luke 1: 26-38). Michael is mentioned in Daniel, Jude (where he is described as being in a dispute with the Devil or Moses' body) and Revelation (where he commands the hosts of the Lord in the battle against the dragon in a war in heaven).

The Bible doesn't say which angel blows the trumpet on Judgement Day. Milton claims it's Michael in Paradise Lost, while Christian tradition holds it is Gabriel.

As to Pollack's claims, I think each person is entitled to form an opinion since there doesn't seem to be any lore, scriptures or writings to conclusively support any one idea.

To me, Temperance seems more of a card about alchemical blending to create something strong and/or perfect, so I personally would associate that one with Gabriel. The angel in the Temperance card even has 'Yod Heh Vah Heh' on his chest, above the triangle. I just don't see Michael as standing and pouring water from cup to cup. However, I can see him blowing the trumpet and rallying the people to Judgement, so I'd be likely to assign Michael to Judgement. However, I have also heard all my life that Gabriel blows the horn, so I can see why it's stuck in the mind and could work for people. Even me, for that matter.

Next are Lovers and the Devil. Is the Lovers Uriel, or Raphael? The card is dominated by the angel, not the people. And there is a BIG sun beaming down from above. Despite that, I cannot help but associate Love to Healing, so Raphael must be the angel in the Lovers card.

That leaves the Devil. Is there any reason to think the Devil is one of those four archangels? Not scripturally. But Uriel, in various sources, is called the Angel of the Earth, Angel of Repentence-- in fact, in the Apocalypse of St Peter, he is compared to being as 'pitiless as any demon'. He also holds the key to the Pit in the End Times (in Jewish mystical traditions), and is the presider over Hell, according to some modern angelologists. Still, I can't reconcile an archangel to The Devil. For me, the Devil is none other than Lucifer (Helel, Morningstar). Lucifer is the only other archangel mentioned in the Bible, his fall described in Ezekiel and Isaiah.

So... I don't know where Uriel is in the RWS deck. But if he's in there, he isn't one of the ones with wings. Not to me.

What do you guys think?
Top   #18



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