$ Publishers contracts $

baba-prague

Thanks Moonman, that list is useful. However, I think some of these publishers don't do original decks - only reprints. I may be wrong about this, but we see a lot of Platnik decks here in Prague (as we are close to Vienna, which is where Platnik are based) and they are usually reprints of historic decks - and they seem to do more Oracle cards than Tarot. I would guess that some of the Italian publishers are similar - i.e. unfortunately it might not be worthwhile submitting new work to them.
As someone said on another thread, Lo Scarabeo commission everything themselves and do it in-house.

I guess it's just different business models and specialisms. Maybe it would be useful to try to narrow down this list (and add others) to those who will actually look at proposals from designers and artists?

We are effectively acting as our own (very small!) publisher, doing our deck and then, hopefully, one more of our design and one with an artist here (we spent some very interesting hours yesterday looking at Marseilles, Thoth and RWS with him so that he understands fully what the possibilities are). I'll be more than happy to report back. However, as discussed on another thread, we have lower than average print costs here (not very low, but definitely not as high as Western Europe or USA) so things that are viable/affordable here may not really be the same in other countries. Also, we are both professional artists/designers so it's easier for us to do all our own print-ready artwork and supervise colour separations etc. If you have to pay someone to do all this, again, it may change the costs quite a bit.

Anyway, like I say, we can feedback a bit of our experience as we go along if it is relevant and useful.

ps - ignore our web site (can't believe I'm saying this!) We have redesigned all the cards - more or less completely - and the new site (www.tarotofprague) will be up in about a week.

Best wishes,

Karen
 

moonman

Publishers contracts

Originally posted by baba-prague

I guess it's just different business models and specialisms. Maybe it would be useful to try to narrow down this list (and add others) to those who will actually look at proposals from designers and artists?
Anyway, like I say, we can feedback a bit of our experience as we go along if it is relevant and useful.


Yes when the website that I mentioned is up it will have some of this info but getting back on track. Do you have any feed back regarding contracts or anything relating to contracts that would be good?
 

baba-prague

contracts

Hi Moonman,

No, like I say, we are effectively self-publishing (well, we will act as a very small press which will publish our own deck - or hopefully decks - and probably one or two others), so I can't really help on publisher's contracts. I've talked to a few friends who have published art/design books and they usually get a contract similar to the one described at the beginning of this thread (ie small payment on publication, then you have to wait until the royalities catch up - also another small payment for each new addition - one friend got an unexpected amount as one of his books has just been translated into Korean!)

Sorry I can't help much more with that. What I'm happy to do is feedback our experiences as a small press - but perhaps when the time comes this should be another thread?

Best wishes - look forward to seeing your site, which sounds good.

Karen
 

moonman

Deals, signings and whatnots .......

Originally posted by baba-prague
No, like I say, we are effectively self-publishing (well, we will act as a very small.......


Baba-prague I sense a little tension

I just wanted to keep things back on track. I guess I should of posted the list of publishers on a new thread.

I'll keep my eye on your site:*
All the best
 

HudsonGray

Something else came to mind for me--while publishers would be doing the mass marketing & promotion, a printer can do an awful lot too if you locate the right type.

Mostly I'm thinking of the ones who do up so many things for the Dungeons & Dragons type role playing games. They not only print weird shapes (hexagonal, triangular, round) in any size, they have protective coatings on them for long lasting use & are full color with their graphics ability. There's none around me locally, so I never considered contacting the ones who do the printing for the big guys like Wizards of the Coast or Talisman or such, but SOMEONE is printing out all that stuff for the gamers & doing it cost effectively enough that even the smaller businesses with just a few modules or games can make a profit at it. I never considered even looking in that direction for printing up tarot cards.

This might be just the thing someone who's doing a non-standard shape deck might need. Wasn't someone working on a hexagonal or octagonal deck? And it would be perfect for those who want to do a round deck--who would be getting the cold shoulder from local print shops who can't die cut circular images.

It's not 'publishers' info, no, but might be worth a look-see by someone wanting to do a small print run. D&D companies all have email addresses, they can point you in the direction of the guys they use for their printing.
 

moonman

Worth reading

The Authors Guild. www.authorsguild.org

I would recommend these books

Authors guild model trade book contract & guide

Author's guide to publishing & understanding publishers contracts

both books cover the same sort of thing and will break down all the jargon that blinds you in the contracts.

Sorry I don't know anything about the artists but it should be more or less the same sort of thing.

It's understandable that some artists & authors keep their contract details a state secret. + it may be in the contract to keep your mouth shut about such deals. It might seem like asking a private question like what color is your underwear, how much do you earn........

Good luck with all your tarot decks, books, T-shirts .....
 

baba-prague

Hi Moonman,

No, no tension, don't worry - but I was dashing off the message before a meeting (which turned out to be entirely in Czech, so I only understood about a quarter fo what was said, but that's another story :) ).

Anyway, just found the most beautiful sgraffito engravings from 1540 - now the only problem is to work out if there is still time to sneak even one of them into one of the card images!

Karen

ps - my only direct experience of publisher's contract is when I was contracted to write a book on design years ago. I got my advance - and the publisher went out of business before I'd written a word! Ah well, they let me keep the (small) advance, so I didn't know whether to laugh or cry. Wheel of Fortune?
 

retrokat

Payment re Publishing Contracts

It's true that Advances (the up-front payment) from major publishers are small, but considering what they have to invest to get a new deck to market I'm not complaining.

The major Tarot publishers only do a handful of new decks each year, and it's a very competitive field. I doubt that many authors are ever in the situation of choosing between self-publishing and a contract with one of the majors. The distribution network of companies like US Games and Llewellyn mean that a small % of sales with them will probably be a much better return than you could possibly achieve by producing it yourself - let alone the $ investment required to self-publish. I certainly wouldn't have enough money to fund even a small print run and high enough quality for sale.

I think it's worthwhile to look at it from the Publisher's point of view, too. I've discussed this in other threads but the basic gist is that they're in business, and what we authors produce is product. Fair enough, I reckon. I can't possibly do what they do and make the deck available to people worldwide at high quality and an affordable price, so I'm very grateful to be given that opportunity.

I certainly don't feel 'exploited' - in fact, I was very surprised to get offered an Advance at all, since they're taking a big financial risk by signing up a first-time deck creator.

I invested 1500 hours of my life to make the high-resolution (publishable) version of my deck, but I made that decision with the security of a contract that ensures me a fair % of sales. It's in my Publisher's interest to maximise the sales and as I'd desperately love to be able to make a living doing stuff like this, then I'm pretty happy to go along with whatever they suggest to maximise sales.

I probably shouldn't give specifics about my contract, but your guesses all seemed to be pretty realistic. It sure isn't a way to get rich :p
 

moonman

Re: Payment re Publishing Contracts

Originally posted by retrokat

I certainly don't feel 'exploited' - in fact, I was very surprised to get offered an Advance at all, since they're taking a big financial risk by signing up a first-time deck creator.


I'm glad that you feel this way, but the Publishers NEVER take any financial risks.
They think $$$$ because they are a business.

I would imagine if I was in your shoes the money would not matter it's just the fact that I would have my own deck published, that might be good enough for most people but I could also understand why some, be it a small amount feel shafted.

Good luck with The Golden Tarot and I can't wait to see it on sale!
Thanks for your input.