Devil's hand is reverse of Hierophant's, what are your thoughts?

Abrac

The description in the PKT for The Devil says: "The right hand is upraised and extended, being the reverse of that benediction which is given by the Hierophant in the fifth card."

The description of The Hierophant says: ". . . and with his right hand he gives the well-known ecclesiastical sign which is called that of esotericism, distinguishing between the manifest and concealed part of doctrine."

Does anyone have any idea what it means, the fact that The Devil's hand is the "reverse" of The Hierophant's? It says The Hierophant keeps some doctrine concealed. So it appears The Devil is doing just the opposite, revealing everything. Can anyone think of a reason why that would be "evil" or in keeping with The Devil's character?

Hands
 

ravenest

Depends whether you mean 'it' or 'this' ; I know what the signs are supposed to mean ... who knows what Waite means here ?

As usual it is probably within his own context that is only to be had by wading through all his stuff and trying to figure what his allusions to his own secret meanings are within context of his own self-referential 'philosophy'.

Have fun. (meaning ... how long have you been trying to nut this out to get at what Waite meant ... and what good has it done you ? )
 

ravenest

I cant link to a pic but have you seen the 'devils shadow' in the sign of benediction ... I think its origin is in Levi ... although I think Crowley mentions it as well.
 

Abrac

Yeah I've seen the picture you're talking about in Levi.

I love symbolism and love trying to get to the bottom of its meaning. The journey itself is mostly what I get out of it.

After I posted this it occurred to me, as it often does, The Devil could be breaking an oath of secrecy, or more likely, symbolizes the temptation to break an oath.
 

Zephyros

This thread seems familiar, hasn't it already been discussed?

Anyway, I've always seen the Devil as the Hierophant's "interface," that which ultimately leads to initiation. I seem to remember having justification for this but I'm too tired to wade through my notes right now. I did write something about it here, although I don't mention the Hierophant. I do mention him here.

I'll probably have more tomorrow, have to go to bed.
 

kalia_marja

the Devil's character

So it appears The Devil is doing just the opposite, revealing everything. Can anyone think of a reason why that would be "evil" or in keeping with The Devil's character?

This brings to mind two stories from the Christian Bible. I can't speak to how much these influenced the images on the cards, but perhaps they will be useful in answering your question.

One story is of the Serpent in the Garden, traditionally viewed as the Devil, who tempts Adam and Even to eat by saying that the fruit will make them like gods. So they eat and get kicked out of the garden, not as punishment, but to keep them from eating the fruit that gives them eternal life. So the Serpent wasn't lying. It was actually Yahweh who was dishonest when he said they would die if they ate from the tree.

Also I think of the Temptation of Christ, where the Devil tries to get Jesus to test Yahweh's word. To me this mirrors the temptation in the garden because the Devil isn't really lying. He's saying, "didn't Yahweh say...?" Jesus doesn't fall for it-- almost as if he's acknowledging the truth in what the Devil is saying. Again, the Devil isn't not lying-- he's quoting scripture. If Jesus' subtext is "yeah I know Yahweh said that, but he didn't really mean it," then the Devil gives his final challenge-- maybe Yahweh didn't really mean for you to worship him alone.

My point is, the Devil has a long history of revealing everything, and Yahweh doesn't. I mean, you see the image of the Devil in the card, but Yahweh hides his face and sends a delegate (the Pope).

Also the Devil has the cross inscribed on his hand, where the Pope only has the cross on his garments-- which can be removed. But now I'm getting off the topic :)

tldr: The Pope's benediction has secrets inherent in the blessing; the Devil's "benediction" is the whole truth, which always has unpleasant consequences.
 

ravenest

Yahweh sent the Pope ! ? I thought the tree in the garden was about the knowledge of good and evil ?
 

Aeon418

I cant link to a pic but have you seen the 'devils shadow' in the sign of benediction ... I think its origin is in Levi ... although I think Crowley mentions it as well.
Waite's translation of Levi's summary of that picture is typically dodgy. Waite's translation reads:
Sarcerdotal Esotericism making the sign of Excommunication.
But excommunication is not what Levi intended. The word he used was "reprobation." The Catholic Waite obviously saw the Calvinist heresy, and substituted something more conducive to his own world view.

The picture appears to be one of Levi's subtle jokes, and is aimed at the then contentious theological controversy concerning predestination and reprobation. Levi's drawing suggests that the same God of 'goodness' is also the originator of 'evil'. In essence they are two sides of one coin.

The word "reprobate" comes from the Latin "probare", which mean to prove or to test. The Initiator (Atu V) and the Tester (Atu XV) are one and the same. Crowley's Hierophant is explicit on this very point.
 

ravenest

True .... but in the RW world such knowledge is lost and one only has the ' typically dodgy ' 'Waite world view' .

Let success be thy proof.
 

Zephyros

One story is of the Serpent in the Garden, traditionally viewed as the Devil, who tempts Adam and Even to eat by saying that the fruit will make them like gods. So they eat and get kicked out of the garden, not as punishment, but to keep them from eating the fruit that gives them eternal life. So the Serpent wasn't lying. It was actually Yahweh who was dishonest when he said they would die if they ate from the tree.

I guess it all depends on interpretation. Adam and Eve actually did die, as indeed we all do. Nobody was lying, everyone was telling the truth. When they ate of the fruit they gained powers "as gods," meaning that they gained the ability to create life independently of God. Kabbalistically, Eden is at Tiphareth, in essence, their wills and God's will were the same so long as they remained there. Once they gained knowledge of Good and Evil, their procreative powers were made manifest but being mere mortals their "engines" couldn't handle the sheer power of it all and so they died (eventually).

The outcomes of the crisis were not punishments but logical outcomes. Eve was stricken with birth pains as a price one must pay for creating life when you're not immortal. Adam was doomed with a similar fate, no longer would the earth give up its riches for nothing, he would have to wrest a living from the earth with backbreaking work.

Now, connecting the snake to the Devil is interesting in several ways, but he finds greater significance in his capacity as redeemer, that is, the one who leads into the light. In Hebrew the snake is characterized by the word ARUM, which has two meanings: "cunning" as well as "naked." This would suggest that the snake had cunning and is indeed described in many ways as a human in that it can speak, walk, eat and think. However, the snake is also "naked," that is, simple and direct.

To understand why the snake would "tempt" Eve one must consider a little theology. All are God's creatures and all obey his commands, yet it falls to humans to follow God's verbal commands, and this is a privilege we alone have. Animals also follow God's commands but to them it comes from instinct. Anything an animal does comes from the core of its being, its "animalistic" nature.

When the snake meets Eve in the garden, it asks her why she does not eat of the fruit, and if it is because God said, verbally, not to eat of It. In other words, Eve is following God's word, while the snake is also following that same word but for him it comes as instinct. If all is God's doing, so are our non-verbal yearnings and urges, which for the snake are completely natural, thus he has trouble understanding the special responsibility Eve has. Eve wants the fruit, a desire programmed into her by God, yet she is forbidden to take it because of a verbal command.

So Eve ultimately eats of the fruit, and the rest is, as they say, history. Humanity gained the creative powers of gods, but also became slightly less human as a result, because the immense power is constantly battling to be let out, hence our own animal, primal instincts.

What that power is can be seen in many different "devilish-like" figures. Pan, for example, is a lusty, creative god who has a prodigious sexual appetite. He is also associated with music and love, two things that leave us powerless to resist their charms. In addition, he is also known as a dying, which leads us to the age-old stories of the phallus rising and then dying after completing its task.

But in both stories there is no discipline, the power cannot be contained. Indeed in the Thoth the Fool has Pan-like horns, connecting him to the wild, animalistic abandon of the Devil, creative energy in its most material form. Now, Capricorn falls in Winter, which is not something I would intuitively connect with the Devil, but upon further reflection it does make sense. It is in Winter that all the actual "work" of fertilizing the earth is done, when the leaves from Autumn break down and become part of the earth.

Now, although this isn't the Thoth, the ideas of Will and the HGA are still relevant, though not in their Thelemic sense. The Devil being opposite Death on the Tree of Life, and both leading to Tiphareth (Eden) one can assume that Death implies surrender to the Will of God, while the Devil is the single-minded pursuit of that Will. Death is Knowledge (immersions) while the Devil is Conversation (creative process).

Now, all that is only marginally relevant to the Hierophant, but was necessary to explain my point. The Devil is the "tool" we use to perform God's Will, and the mode by which we learn the Hierophant's lessons, the animal and human natures are ultimately the same. The Devil is the means by which we interact with Creation, the pen which we use to write down the Hierophant's lessons.

Another point to consider is the term "Lucifer," the "Morning Star," which is actually Venus. Venus was seen as adversarial as it seemed to rise a few hours before the Sun, seeking to supplant It. But Taurus, attributed to the Hierophant, is ruled by Venus, implying some "hidden attribution" that shows there is no adversarial relationship, all are manifestations of Love (in essence, energy directed at something or other).

The Talmud has an interesting passage on the "evil inclination" which was first formed at the Tree of Knowledge and later plagued Cain. In discussing the sin of Cain, and evil in general, the Rabbis of the Talmud were in a quandary. After all, when Creation was done, God looked at it and said that "it was good," and this included evil. So was evil good? Was evil planned? No, but what was given was the free will to do either good or evil. In speaking of the propensity towards evil, God urged Cain to develop a relationship with that inclination (יצר הרע) rather than to shun it completely. It is alright to desire, it is alright to feel urges and even act upon them, but ultimately every act should serve a higher goal, which is, in this case, service of God, but Thelemites may use the same logic to carry out their Will. Ultimately even the Devil has his place, and not as a bad example, but in a more "Capricornian" capacity of creative urge, the lust to conquer new territory, to climb ever higher. Climb too high and you'll fall like Icarus, succumbing to hubris. Not climbing at all, though, is just as bad.

"Can the Evil Inclination be good? It seems impossible. Rather, were it not for the Evil Inclination, a man would not build a house and would not marry a woman, he would not have children and would not engage in business." (Bereishis Rabbah, 9:7)