How big are your hands?

I struggle to shuffle my Liber T which is a standard size LoScarabeo so anything over that size I can't shuffle but, to save my fingers, learned how to shuffle top-over-top so unless the deck is very small I shuffle that way anyway.

Barleywine said:

I have the feeling the OP wasn't talking about riffling. If I shuffled by riffling, I could probably shuffle dinner-plate-sized cards. Hand size really has more to do with holding the deck to shuffle it, IMO.

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Riffling (my preferred method) does NOT work with thick Schiffer stock.

But my response related to overhand as that was clearly the issue.

RiotFemme said:

I voted 14cm because I have the DruidCraft and I can shuffle them, albeit slowly and somewhat clumsily. It's not just the size of a deck that makes it harder to shuffle for me. Sometimes a deck that is thick is just as uncomfortable. For example, the Flornoy Noblet is small, but it's probably the thickest of all my decks and it has pointy corners (thinking about trimming those). It's a little awkward to shuffle.

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Yes, my Le Veritable Tarot de Marseille is thick *and* long, which makes it hard to shuffle. I will have to sell it. I have only used it a few times and it's a pity because it's my favourite of all the TdM's. I don't like the garish primal colours of other TdM's.

gregory said:

Riffling (my preferred method) does NOT work with thick Schiffer stock.

But my response related to overhand as that was clearly the issue.

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I doubt very much if riffling would work well with the Illuminati either, since the cards feel like styrofoam beer coasters. I'm sure I'd have creases across the middle of most of them if I tried.

I think we may have inadvertently wandered off into riffling before you commented, since many people don't use any other method. It's probably the automatic remedy for "too-small" hands, or maybe a vestige of childhood card games. My grandmother was a champ at it, but I never did master it; it often turned into a game of what we used to call "52 Pick-up." Call it "too-clumsy" hands, I suppose.

When I asked the question, I kinda assumed that everyone riffles the same way, by holding the cards across the widest point, like this (although maybe not in-the-air-riffling with bigger decks) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uW8zMwJF5ys I wasn't counting table riffling at the corner of the cards because I take this as a sign that the deck is too big to hold.

I also assumed that if people didn't riffle, that they still held across the widest point of the card, because you don't always have a table to hand? Or maybe you guys do!?! So when I asked about hand size, I thought thumb to middle finger length would be the key measurement.

Gregory- yup I can 'table-assisted-riffle' the Mary-El lengthways, just.
Dream Raven, which is my biggest Schiffer can be delicately widthways riffled by this method https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ue30EJUTCUk

Personally I believe that shuffling should be like egg whisking- the aim is to keep it light and fluffy with air cushioning the cards, which should remain as close to flat as possible. Corner riffling, and then jamming them back together, especially with sticky Schiffer, is the fastest way to damage cards IMHO.

earthair said:

When I asked the question, I kinda assumed that everyone riffles the same way, by holding the cards across the widest point, like this (although maybe not in-the-air-riffling with bigger decks) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uW8zMwJF5ys I wasn't counting table riffling at the corner of the cards because I take this as a sign that the deck is too big to hold.

I also assumed that if people didn't riffle, that they still held across the widest point of the card, because you don't always have a table to hand? Or maybe you guys do!?! So when I asked about hand size, I thought thumb to middle finger length would be the key measurement.

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Thanks for posting the video. It confirms what I've always defined as riffling in its various forms. I always shuffle overhand and never riffle-and-bridge the cards since I hesitate to bend them to the extent necessary. They do cost considerably more than a deck of playing cards so I handle them with a lot more care. I used to think riffling looked flashy and sophisticated, but now I'm just pragmatic about shuffling.

Barleywine said:

I doubt very much if riffling would work well with the Illuminati either, since the cards feel like styrofoam beer coasters. I'm sure I'd have creases across the middle of most of them if I tried.

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I have riffled that perfectly easily. I wonder what's up with your copy

I checked. I can't hold the Shadowscapes across the widest point, at least not all of it- a smallish pile, a bit more with extreme discomfort, but not all 78. I have to hold them sideways. I don't think I CAN shuffle cards bigger than average playing cards without a table...

My hands are 15cm wrist to middle fingertip and my deck is about the same size. I've only been able to do a table-assisted riffle minus the bridge. I've seen a woman with the same hand span shuffle Thoth decks twice that size with ease though. <_<

Barleywine said:

They do cost considerably more than a deck of playing cards so I handle them with a lot more care. I used to think riffling looked flashy and sophisticated, but now I'm just pragmatic about shuffling.

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Exactly why I believe decks should be manufactured at a size to enable gentle riffling by a person of average hand size
Done well, riffling puts virtually no stress on the cards, with faster randomisation= less shuffling time= longer shelf life. Sideways shuffling can cause the edges to knock on each other. Corner riffling on a table bends the cards diagonally slightly. Following the above progression of logic, maybe publishers use oversized cards so we damage them faster and have to buy more