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Enochian Magick

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Since it now seems okay to talk about double agents ,while, at the same time, keeping ontopic by not inadvertently mentioning that hypnotism is a different state to 'trance' (as Crowley used the term) I might poke my head back out the wardrobe.

< peeks around >

The reason I first decided to try an Enochian working was I heard it was a type of magic that was good at getting results, even for those unfamiliar with magic generally (dont know if thats true or not ?) ... but it ended up being so for me.

The 'state' I was in in during the 'vision' part was more like lucid dreaming, but more lucid, clear, communications were easier, things were very detailed, visual and colorful (no, I didnt 'take anything' for the ritual) .... the 'realm' ( in the pyramids or within the tablets) seemed more' objective' than other 'realms' .... a lot of the specific techniques of operation within it, were learnt within it (Eg, in the GD versions of the tablets, each side of each pyramid is a different colour and symbol, but in the vision each side was made of a different type of stone or mineral and had an entrance somewhere so a pyramid could be entered from any side, and what was within was different depending on the side you went into. With 4 realms on each 13 x 13 square on 4 tablets .... thats a lot of doorways ! Would keep one busy for some time.

I suppose the big question here is ( the question Crowley poses; are the results of magical experiments indicative of being projected out from consciousness/unconsciousness of the operator or are they indicate of an objective outside agent ? ... Crowley said the decision was still out on that and he wasn't going to make the call ) , did it make a difference to this outlook ...... I came to the same non-conclusion , if anything, evidence swayed it towards the subjective outlook. Fun experiment though.


< Goes back into wardrobe >


<sticks head out>

what was it you wanted me to elaborate on anyway ?

<pulls head back in >
Top   #41
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Wouldn't the "Thelemic" answer be that they are one and the same? Your HGA may be a "personal deity" but it is also you, the Star flying in the vastness of Nuit. External angels and internal trance states are the same. It doesn't matter whether one sees the Thelemic pantheon as actual deities or scientific principles, the way one approaches them is the same. Enochian angels exist because you kind of create them.

Or am I just projecting?
Top   #42
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I dont supply Thelemically Tailored answers ..... I would assume the best person to go to that would be THE original Thelemite, and his conclusion was inconclusive.

[ Lately I have read a lot of poo-poo on Crowley as he turned magic towards a psychological explanation - I dont see it that way myself, he certainly bought in that influence as an addition and possibility but not IMO as a replacement theory.]

I do not agree that 'External angels and internal trance states are the same' however .... and certainly do not approach scientific principles and 'actual' deities in the same way . The whole concept of a scientific principle is about objective reality; other people being able to do the same test and get the same result.

Maybe when people start being able to PROVE the same way with magical results I might start approaching the two in the same way ?
Top   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zephyros View Post
Wouldn't the "Thelemic" answer be that they are one and the same? Your HGA may be a "personal deity" but it is also you, the Star flying in the vastness of Nuit. External angels and internal trance states are the same. It doesn't matter whether one sees the Thelemic pantheon as actual deities or scientific principles, the way one approaches them is the same. Enochian angels exist because you kind of create them.

Or am I just projecting?
I have forgotten where I read it, but I remember Crowley having said something to that effect. I am also inclined towards the psychological explanation of magick. However there are some things I cannot explain with it. What about this whole Aiwass thing? Aiwass clearly knew some stuff Crowley did not know. Take for example the Tzaddi/Star thing. Crowley took a very long time to figure that out, so it seems reasonable to suppose that Aiwass != Crowley.
Top   #44
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update - a really interesting evening. Hearing Dr Shoemaker in person vibrating the names and god names of the cabbalistic cross and for the LBRP was awesome, It felt like the ripple of an electric current. He also made the Enochian calls for the 30th Aethyr TEX which were going to have a go at scrying. I can’t remember what call it was or what the words were, it seemed to bypass my ears. I think I was a little overwhelmed by the newness or unfamiliarity of everything. I did have a go at trying to scry astrally. The suggestion (close to Liber 0) was to form your body in a form you wanted, try and enter it and look out of those eyes, transferring your consciousness I guess. That was really difficult, it kind of seems really advanced to me. Mine turned into an eastern looking woman with long dark hair, gold body and a bright blue and possibly red gem thing on the forehead, moving around, looking at me, so I don’t think that was mine, just a brief image.

For TEX I tried to imagine scrying with a pool of water or object (as suggested) which seemed easier than previously imagining getting larger, trying to expand consciousness outwards, maybe going inwards rather than out. I think that might work well for others, depending on what suits you. So I continued with a bit of a gold theme, entering a black gap with gold ripped edges following a miniature gold soldier holding a long stick. Dr Shoemaker had suggested to see if you might have a guide, though when I asked the figure he turned round and smiled kind of, and his head turned into a fat munchkin with two leery big front teeth.

I saw briefly (or imagined) a red, pinky mist and then a barren landscape of what looked like crosses and one very large cross standing out on higher ground. The word Cavalry cross came to mind. A golden cherubim hovered in the sky, a judgement theme. I am glad I didn’t comment on what I saw (others did on theirs). Initially it seemed out of keeping with the High Priestess/Hermit/Universe cards that were mentioned for the Aeythr. Also, afterwards when I checked TEX it did have a judgement theme of the end or more ushering in the new Aeon from the old. I must have known about that from the Liber 418 study group thread but I had completely forgotten about it. So that would have been embarrassing as it was supposed to be my vision not related to AC’s. It is interesting though how our memory recalls information without awareness necessarily.

I did though manage very briefly to locate my astral foot (yes!!) While looking down on the scene it suddenly occurred to me, where was my body… I then looked down and saw my own foot on the grass and felt it, it was a bit squishy and damp. I wasn’t able to look up at all though only downwards, so there was no exciting view only grass. Sorry for the ramble, I’m still tired but fizzy….I seemed to have a delayed impact, there is something about the Aethyrs, an effect on some subtle level.
Top   #45
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I'm trying to remember a few details of the ritual. I wonder if you remember?

First of all, what was his statement of intent at the beginning? He said it so quickly I didn't really catch it.

The second thing is, as far as I can tell he invoked the whole of the Earth Tablet, rather than get into any specific angel. I may be wrong. But I remember he invoked the three god names of the Tablet, and the elemental king. Was that it? Did he invoke the Seniors afterwards? Or the servient angels?
Top   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fianic View Post
I'm trying to remember a few details of the ritual. I wonder if you remember?

First of all, what was his statement of intent at the beginning? He said it so quickly I didn't really catch it.

The second thing is, as far as I can tell he invoked the whole of the Earth Tablet, rather than get into any specific angel. I may be wrong. But I remember he invoked the three god names of the Tablet, and the elemental king. Was that it? Did he invoke the Seniors afterwards? Or the servient angels?
Hello Fianic. I didn't know there was a fellow At'er there

ehh... It was a bit quick for me too, I didn't catch the statement of intent either. I think I was more experiencing it than having my thinking brain on...I kept up with the LBRP etc because I am familiar with that. the rest was too new.

I have just been looking up the Great Table, (I might have followed more if I had read beforehand...ahem..) From what I am trying to understand, each of the four quarters or Elemental tablets ie Earth, involves a hierarchy. The Great Cross in the middle of each tablet has the Three names of God on the horizontal line, (the line of the Holy Spirit), the King from the left and the seniors also drawn from this Cross.

The sub angles or quarters again of each of the four tablets have another cross in the middle - the Cavalry cross which has the Call and command Angels, then Kerubic Angels, Dispositors and Cacodaemons... rather a lot there to be invoking

The order that you heard seems to make sense, firstly, the three God names then the King. it would seem that the Seniors would be next as apparently the King calls forth the Seniors according to what I have read as he begins their names...

Sorry not to have been of much help! I do remember Dr Shoemaker mentioning the 19th call for all the Aethyrs, with only the need to changing the name for each one, and all of us reciting the names of the four governors of Tex, I guess that must have been after the invoking of the Earth tablet... Maybe that was when I zoned out a little and was thinking of floaty threads wrapping around.
Top   #47
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Thanks to everryone for sharing your ideas n Enochian magick.
Up till now I had left it for later, since I consider myself at the very beginning in ceremonial magick (even though I am somewhat experienced in celtic witchcraft, only my actual practices are far more simple and direct in approaching the deities).
My cousin bought for me (as I have been visiting family in Italy) James Eshelmann's Visions and voices and I must say that through his explanations verse by verse the book has caught me.
I think, even if I am still far from the desire of trying the scryings myself, reading about AC's experience, through the "objective" (relatively to astrological and quabalistic attributions) commentaries of Eshelmann can set a foundation for eventual practical work.
I found it even easier than the commentaries on the BoL.
I have half a mind to start building the tablets on egg's cartoons..
But I really need to get into the LBRP and LIRP before starting any ceremonial work..
Maybe I can be able to make contact with a spirit guide willing to teach me.
Thanks to everyone!
Top   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beira View Post
Thanks to everryone for sharing your ideas in Enochian magick.
Up till now I had left it for later, since I consider myself at the very beginning in ceremonial magick (even though I am somewhat experienced in celtic witchcraft, only my actual practices are far more simple and direct in approaching the deities).
My cousin bought for me (as I have been visiting family in Italy) James Eshelmann's Visions and voices and I must say that through his explanations verse by verse the book has caught me.
I think, even if I am still far from the desire of trying the scryings myself, reading about AC's experience, through the "objective" (relatively to astrological and quabalistic attributions) commentaries of Eshelmann can set a foundation for eventual practical work.
Hi Beira. Enochian magic does have a fascination even if it's too advanced for me as a beginner as well. I am reading as theory rather than practice. Though having a little go at scrying in a structured environment with a very experienced practitioner, I think is a real opportunity and provides another aspect to studying Liber 418.
Top   #49
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just thinking about the four governors of TEX as this morning I had a couple of dream fragments, someone telling me that there were different ways of doing something... could be four, or some,...(maybe none? that doesn't make sense) and then I was looking at a page of a book with a separated section (underneath the main writing) with words on the left and then right. I grabbed a pen but only remember Ayin on the left and a word near it that looks like enochian spelling. A few letters overlap one of the names of the governors. I am curious as to whether it might suggest that not all four governors are necessary maybe one. For what though I have no idea.

Rather randomly, the word 'Aorta' also comes to mind, which I have just looked up as "the main artery of the body, supplying oxygenated blood to the circulatory system. In humans it passes over the heart from the left ventricle and runs down in front of the backbone".

a little morning ramble... I think enochian has gripped my imagination. it's probably because I have previously been looking at Enochian letters while tracking the governors sigils. They are as far as I can see close together at the top of the water table on the top right. Apparently, though this is the reformed Great Table and in the original Great Table, they appear on the bottom right quarter, Fire.
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