Play the Game! Tarot!

[Umbrae]

So here I amm hanging out at my sisters house. My ol' dead brother-in-law had a ton of computer games. So I'm wandering through the files...

Sierra Games, Hoyle Card Games 2005 has Tarot. Fun stuff! Not quite as fun as playing live, but a great place to learn the rules.

[Callistabell]

Where else can you learn the rules? I'm wanting to learn to play the game, but don't know where to go. Also, I thought I might make up some rules for a game to play with my TABOO Tarot, and I thought learning Tarrochi would be a nice place to start.

[philebus]

Well, I can link you to www.pagat.com where there is a huge range of card games, including many tarot.

[rachelcat]

I got the Hoyle computer game on Friday and tried game of tarot. All I can say is, it's a good thing the computer does the scoring! It's going to take a while for me to figure that out!

Everything I have learned in one weekend:

You have to bet to win (but I never win when I bet!)
Lead with your kings first. Then your trumps.
Save your 1 of trump until last. (Well, that's what they call it. We know it's that wily Magician. . . )
And that's about it . . .

If I have any breakthroughs, I'll let you know! (Otherwise I'll just be hanging out playing blackjack, go fish, and solitaire!)

[philebus]

I think that learning this without others is probably going to look a little duanting - especially if you haven't played a game of this sort (not just tarot - it's a broad family).

I'm not sure that I would call it betting to win. When you bid for the role of declarer, essentially you want to increase the stakes, such that the reward for winning is greater but with a higher penalty for losing. The defenders are still described as winning is the declarer fails to make his/her bid - they just get a lesser reward for it.

Tarot scoring is notoriously odd but when you get the hang of it, it does make a kind of sense. For the French game, it is often easier to think of the cards as having half points - so that a King becomes 4.5 instead of 5. Then pair counters with half point cards, a King and a Pip for example will simply be five instead of 5+1-1.

I would only hold the pagat (1 of trumps) back till the end if you are very sure that you won't lose it in the last trick. The pagat is one of the bouts (or oudlers) and the card points you need to win decreases according to how many of these you have in your trick pile at the end. The 1 is the only of the three (being the excuse, 1 and 21 of trumps) that can be lost to your opponents, so unless you have a very good hand, I would do my upmost to protect it and the longer you hold onto it, the harder that becomes. Of course, if you don't have it in your hand at the start, then it is important to try and win it yourself.

I also have Hoyle and I have to admit, it does play a fairly good game of tarot - better than I expected. (and better than it does Spades which has my partners make some very strange bids)

I do hope that you enjoy this and perhaps find some other players to teach. If you can find players, there is a very good three player version - but the five player is the most fun.

I love the French game and have many happy memories playing it. If I can answer any questions, I will.

[Scion]

It's so funny, Umbrae... this Hoyle's game is exactly how I learned the rules of the game. Totally changed how I see the Fool actually... and the Magician as well.

S

[philebus]

If the quirks of card use in games interest you for your interpretation of them, then you might want to look at the Italian games as well. There, although still numbered 20, it is the Angel that ranks as the highest trump. In Bologna, the cards now replaced by the Four Moors, the 2-6 of trumps, were collectively called The Papi and also held equal ranking. In Sicily, the highest trump is the 20, with a unique trump called The Beggar, unnumbered and ranking below the 1.

And, just for fun, the first four numbered trumps were, in many countries, named after birds. The 1 was The Sparrow, the 2 was The Owl, the 3 was the Cockatoo, and the 4 was The Marabou. (albeit with some variations) Special tricks taken with the 2-4 are still named for these birds.

[rachelcat]

I stayed up too late last night, determined I was going to win SOMETHING! I did win two gardes, but that just made me more eager to actually win an 8-hand game (against my cheerful opponents, the tyrannosaurus, the cowboy, and the Indian lady). I haven't yet!

Originally Posted by philebus

I'm not sure that I would call it betting to win. When you bid for the role of declarer, essentially you want to increase the stakes, such that the reward for winning is greater but with a higher penalty for losing. The defenders are still described as winning is the declarer fails to make his/her bid - they just get a lesser reward for it.

I (and my imaginary friends) were able to prevent some of the takers from winning, too. But I think I still need to bid to get out of the hole caused when the takers win!

Originally Posted by philebus

I would only hold the pagat (1 of trumps) back till the end if you are very sure that you won't lose it in the last trick. The pagat is one of the bouts (or oudlers) and the card points you need to win decreases according to how many of these you have in your trick pile at the end. The 1 is the only of the three (being the excuse, 1 and 21 of trumps) that can be lost to your opponents, so unless you have a very good hand, I would do my upmost to protect it and the longer you hold onto it, the harder that becomes. Of course, if you don't have it in your hand at the start, then it is important to try and win it yourself.

Oh, you're so right! I've seen the error of my ways! Now it seems like the only way to hold onto that 1 is to be the last person to play a card in the trick to be sure there are no higher trumps coming!

Do you recommend discarding to the chien whole suits from your hand so you have more chances to play trumps? (I think I figured that out yesterday.)

Originally Posted by philebus

I also have Hoyle and I have to admit, it does play a fairly good game of tarot - better than I expected. (and better than it does Spades which has my partners make some very strange bids).

Yeah, and that dinosaur sure is a funny guy! I haven't won a game yet, and I still have it set on "normal," not "difficult" . . . I have to give myself time!

Thanks for the help so far! I'll probably be back with questions!

[philebus]

Well, giving yourself a short suit (just a few cards) or a void suit (no cards) has both pros and cons. Certainly, it does mean that you have a chance to trump some court cards early in play but on the down side, your opponents can lead your void suit, playing only low cards to the trick and thus forcing you to waste your trumps. Remember that if you have a short suit, then most of the cards will be with one or more of your opponents and so they will try to avoid playing their courts until they've drawn out your trumps on pips. If you have enough trumps to be able to lose some early in the hand, then its not a bad strategy but if you're limited then it might be best to leave yourself at least a short suit rather than a void. Things get more interesting when one of the defenders is void the same suit

As an aside - I've just won an auction for a promotional pack for Woody Allen's film Scoop! I'm not a big fan of his films but it says something about how mainstream tarot play is in France! I read somewhere that this is now their second most popular game.

[northsea]

Playing the Hoyle tarot (not sure if mine is Sierra) is great for learning the rules, but it's rigged in the computer players' favor at least in regards to the cards dealt.