How much astrology is really necessary?

Im currently enjoying studying the Thoth, lurking in the wings here, reading threads and books, looking hard at the cards and one thing really bothers me. The astrology in Thoth.

I have zero knowledge of astrology. I probably just about know the dates of the star signs and not much else. O and I also know how to draw the symbols. The more I read about Thoth, the more I see astrology is fundamental, yet - at the same time - is, in itself, a lifetime study. Is not knowing astrology really going to hamper my understanding of Thoth?

Give it to me straight.

So far Ive kind of skimmed over the astrological references simply because I don´t have the lingo so it doesn´t mean much anyway. I mean "Mars in Capricorn" (or is it Capricorn in Mars?) and the idea of being "exalted" (?) i.e, not only "in" but exalted too??

I have a very basic astrology book (which I shalln´t name). Ive seen recommendations here, but I think they still assume a certain amount of knowledge.

My question is how much astrology should I know? Im enjoying examining the Thoth so much, Im treading carefully and don´t want to get too snowed under and disheartened. It´s probably quite difficult to convey here just how little I know. Ive been reading with/about tarot for 25 years now and have always managed to avoid the astrological aspects (which I shall dare to say is easier with the TdM) But I keep coming up against a brick wall in the Thoth. Having to skim paragraphs in DuQuette and Snuffin simply because I don´t have the background knowledge. "Aquarius in Atziluth". What on earth does that mean? And who decided that Virgo is The Hermit, and yet the Tower is not a sign, but a planet?

So, in a nutshell, what should I know?

Planets and their qualities? What else?

Welcome to the jungle, Le Fanu! It doesn't help matters that different people focus on various types and time periods for their astrology methods either. I'm going to let someone who knows *Thoth specifically* answer, but I found that this diagram helped me get some of the concepts for rulerships better:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thema_Mundi

Hope it helps some.

Thank you! OK, I think I get that. It means that those signs are ruled by thse planets. So far, so good. Looking at your diagram, it seems that 5 star signs, i.e Aries and Aquarius, don´t have planets. Am I right in this?

(O Id so like this thread to be step by step guide!)

Do these attributions change? Or are they permanent fixtures?

I pounced on the link to exaltations to see what they are and I see that each planet has an astrological sign "in" it (whatever that means) i.e Venus in Libra. But thinking of the Thoth (Im remembering a diagram in Duquettes´s book) am I right in thinking that the star signs have different planets "in" them which is how the qualities change, i.e Venus isn´t always "in" Libra, it might, one day, have Saturn "in" it which would have different effects?

(this is embarrassing! )

Le Fanu said:

Having to skim paragraphs in DuQuette and Snuffin simply because I don´t have the background knowledge. "Aquarius in Atziluth". What on earth does that mean? And who decided that Virgo is The Hermit, and yet the Tower is not a sign, but a planet?

Click to expand...

I hate to break it to you, but Atziluth is from Qabalah, so that's something else to wrap your head around.

I'm in a similar situation to you. I've always avoided learning beyond the basics of astrology, even when I was learning the Golden Dawn system. Well, that's not entirely true; I once learned enough to cast and interpret a basic chart for myself. But I certainly don't remember any of that nowadays.

At any rate, I've come back to the tarot, and I most enjoy the Golden Dawn style with its astrological layers added, so I'm learning more as I go. The Thoth is based in the Golden Dawn tradition, and they decided that The Hermit relates to Virgo. (Yes, I'm glossing over some history here.) It has to do with the majors on the Tree of Life -- something else that never interested me greatly, if I'm honest.

I recently picked up "New Way to Learn Astrology" from the library. It's from the Noel Tyl school of thought (whoever that is). It may get criticism from the traditionalists; but it looked like a detailed and easily assimilated book, and I didn't have to buy it, so it works for me. I figured this will help me get the basics down. I've only worked through the chapter about planets, but I already learned more about them, so I can't complain.

I think you can work with the Thoth (or a GD deck) with minimal astrology, but to really understand it requires understanding why certain attributes exists and what they mean. I personally found Snuffin's book very helpful with the minors; it helps the reasoning behind their designs to click. And I like how it's direct and to-the-point.

Le Fanu said:

I pounced on the link to exaltations to see what they are and I see that each planet has an astrological sign "in" it (whatever that means) i.e Venus in Libra.

Click to expand...

Pardon my double post, you and I "crossed" in the ether. But I want to share a tip that I picked up on this forum, I think it was originally from Scion: a planet is expressed through a sign (not the other way around). The constellations form a background which planets can move through.

So Venus in Libra, to me, is the qualities of Venus (love, senuality, aesthetics, relationships) expressed through Libra (balance, love of beauty, and so on). I can't express that very well, it's sort of intuitive to me yet, but I hope you find this tip helpful.

Le Fanu said:

Looking at your diagram, it seems that 5 star signs, i.e Aries and Aquarius, don´t have planets. Am I right in this?

(O Id so like this thread to be step by step guide!)

Click to expand...

This was just the "origin" type view. The ancients travelled back down the line of planets for the "missing" places, until new planets were discovered.

This is where you get the modern revisions that get so debated!

Let me see if I can find a site link or a PDF file here on my computer . . .

rif said:

I hate to break it to you, but Atziluth is from Qabalah, so that's something else to wrap your head around.

Click to expand...

OK. If I look at those very useful diagrams in Snuffin, I see that it relates to the Sephira Chokmah. No idea how anyone could remember all these matching charts. I suppose you just have to buy it all and not question it. It just is.

rif said:

I think you can work with the Thoth (or a GD deck) with minimal astrology, but to really understand it requires understanding why certain attributes exists and what they mean. I personally found Snuffin's book very helpful with the minors; it helps the reasoning behind their designs to click. And I like how it's direct and to-the-point.

Click to expand...

Yes, Snuffin´s book is very good on the individual cards. It was just that the Swords suit seemed to have a lot of astrology in it. Maybe the other suits do too; I just skim read them more effectively

My basic astrology primer has chapters on the following;

What is astrology?
Zodiac Signs
The Planets
Houses
Other key components (like aspects and elements)
Then the forecasting part (which Im not too fussed about)

I suppose the part on Planets would be the most important...

dignities- links

http://www.skyviewzone.com/astrology/dignities.htm

http://www.astroconsulting.com/FAQs/the.htm

http://www.renaissanceastrology.com/essentialdignities.html

Again, hope they help.

Thank you! Those are great. Im going to print them off and read them properly with highlighter pen!

ETA: The chart in that first link makes a lot of sense to me now thinking about Thoth and those clashes of planets/detriments/fall. I can see where this might work with the cards. Thank you!

You're welcome! Just be aware that different authors/groups will assign things a bit differently for the Court Cards. As long as you are aware of which deck is using which assignment, you should be okay!