Zan and BC's Excellent Thoth Adventure: The Fool

zan_chan

I've always been a bit turned off by the Thoth Fool, honestly. He seems so grotesque, so twisted, as if that friendly smile could turn evil and violent at a moment's notice. He isn't human, I suppose, as he has horns and is being bitten by a tiger without giving it any attention. Having not yet read about him in the BoT, I'm not quite sure how I would interpret him in a reading. Perhaps as impervious to the world around him - a bit of a psychopath, at once sharing the physical space of the rest of the world, but not paying it any attention.

By the way, Le Fanu, as you're the expert on bags, what sort of bag does one keep the Thoth in? I haven't quite figured that out yet... I have a perfectly-sized knit bag that emmsma made for me, but it almost seems too warm and homey for Thoth. Hmm...
 

Le Fanu

Have you (zan & BC) read all about The Fool yet? Don't you think it might be interesting to identify the symbols you see and reflect on what they might mean before you go to the Book of Thoth? Some of the imagery - butterfly, crocodile, bag of coins, gold boots, floatingness &c - you might get to grips with before reading BoT.

And it is always interesting (& gratifying) seeing whether you were on the same wavelength, or what additional elemtents you can pick up from reading.

I always like to have a good look myself before I start reading about the symbolism...

I love threads like this but even threads by so-called beginners always lose me! Something about numbers a few pages back. What on earth was that all about? I went out for some tapas at that point but now I'm back...
 

Bat Chicken

I haven't actually read the chapter on the Fool yet - it was plan for this evening, however, your suggestion is how I would read a card, so that is exactly what I will do first.

Thanks for the great suggestion, Le Fanu. It is easy to get mired in the words alone! :)
 

zan_chan

Fool: Initial Thoughts

Alright - before I start getting at all into the stuff from the books, here is the only thing I can seem to think when I look at the Thoth Fool: He looks like a prisoner.

I see this guy trapped in those rings, a prisoner of the dangerous, psychotic world around him. While practically standing on a crocodile and being bitten by a tiger, he grins like an idiot, oblivious to either the pain or his impeding doom.

Something I like about the rings on this card are the fact that they make looking at the card from any angle seem appropriate. Completely upside-down, the card seems to make just as much sense as it does right-side-up. There's something very three-dimensional about them, as well. Remember the movie "Contact" with that bizarre space ship that Jodie Foster may or may not have ridden at the end? It has rings just like these that spin at such an incredible speed. When I look at the Fool, I imagine the rings moving just as quickly, perhaps causing his obliviousness and maddening him enough to cause that silly grin on his face.

But what he really looks like is this: (excuse the picture; it was the best one I could find to illustrate what I mean)

2755157576_4ceb65a1ef.jpg


Now here's The Fool:

00-Major-Fool.jpg


Does anyone else see the resemblance? Look at that woman chained to the wheel, about to have knives thrown at her - what could be more foolish than that? And yet there she is, looking calm, collected, and yet frightening in her own right. The Fool has nearly the same look to him - smiling, seemingly happy, and yet surrounded by an air of acceptance of what's yet to come.

(And how about that sun covering his genitals - certainly, in this present context, looks like a target to me...)

One also can't help but notice that the rings form a circle, reflecting, maybe, the number 0. I then can't help but think of Fortune, the Sun, and, perhaps, the 4 of Wands.

His horns remind me of "The Picture of Dorian Gray". He seems like he would have been a good-looking guy before something happened to turn him into what he is now. Maybe he's a fallen Prince or some kind of hero gone wrong. It feels like he was cursed somehow - the picture was slashed and he became on the outside how he behaved on the inside. A bit like "Beauty and the Beast": handsome guy transmorphed into his personality.

He seems to hold the Universe in his bag, but rather than meaning that he has control of it, it seems to mean that it's out of his reach. The Universe is safely wrapped up, guarded by The Fool, protected by its bag, but the Fool can only watch from afar, like Atlas holding the World on his shoulders.

A very melancholy, hopeless card this would seem to be before exploring the meanings held in its symbology...
 

Grigori

zan_chan said:
(And how about that sun covering his genitals - certainly, in this present context, looks like a target to me...)

I was reading the chapter on the Fool this evening, and something caught my eye.

Crowley said:
Harpocrates is (in one sense) the symbol of the Dawn on the Nile, and of the physiological phenomenon which accompanies the act of waking.

I can only think of one physiological thing that may be noticeable on waking, apart from the being awake bit. Are there any others that I've overlooked?
 

Bat Chicken

I thought you said you were UNvisual! :laugh:
I completely see what you are talking about.... Brilliant!

Perhaps he is falling (implying THE Fall) becoming flesh from the Divine and ending up on the Wheel of Samsara so to speak...

The Fool's bag has the planets and the signs in it - perhaps that is the tools for 'calculation' that was being referred to before. (I haven't read the chapters in the BoT or DuQuette yet - this afternoon!!)


Grigori said:
Crowley said:
Harpocrates is (in one sense) the symbol of the Dawn on the Nile, and of the physiological phenomenon which accompanies the act of waking.


I can only think of one physiological thing that may be noticeable on waking, apart from the being awake bit. Are there any others that I've overlooked?
Yes! Waking! And that explains it - not the first thing a chick would think of... LOL!

OK - I have some stuff that needs to get done, but, I am going to note here all the stuff that caught my eye before I dive into the books. Give me a couple hours...
 

Aeon418

Bat Chicken said:
Perhaps he is falling (implying THE Fall) becoming flesh from the Divine and ending up on the Wheel of Samsara so to speak...
But if he is falling, it is a self-willed fall. And he doesn't mind where he lands either because he knows his true essense can never really be harmed during his wandering and adventures in the divine world of the flesh.
 

zan_chan

Aeon418 said:
But if he is falling, it is a self-willed fall. And he doesn't mind where he lands either because he knows his true essense can never really be harmed during his wandering and adventures in the divine world of the flesh.

Why :?:
 

Aeon418

zan_chan said:
The notion of the Fall in the Judeo-Christian tradition, and the perceived separation between the divine and humanity, is usually portrayed as some kind of punishment for disobedience.

The philosophy of Thelema that underpins the Thoth Tarot views this "perceived separation" as a voluntary choice made by the divine itself to incarnate in matter in order to manifest and experience it's own infinite possibilities from unique points of view. You are one of those points of view. ;) Whatever happens in your life, whether you consider it positive or negative, has no effect on the spark of divinity within you. It is always unharmed, just like the Fool, but it is enriched by it's experiences.

Crowley sums up this doctrine on page 15 of The Book of Thoth, where he uses the model of an atom going into various combinations to increase it's experiences. But at the end of it's adventures it always comes out unharmed.
 

Emily

Le Fanu said:
I also got into the Liber T for a while but I have to confess, it totally defeated me. It made the Thoth look so easy. I feel more and more comfortable with the Thoth even though I cannot profess to know an enormous amount about what is really going on, but I always have it at hand...

I think too that my working with the Liber T has opened up the Thoth for me - I just couldn't get my head round the Thoth a few months back but something clicked when I started to compare the two decks side by side.

The Liber T is still 'mine' but I'm eager to get to know the Thoth now too. I also love having such a big deck to use, I think the large Thoth spread out is an impressive sight. :)

I've read the Fool's pages in the BoT, very interesting and way over my head LOL - So I've found DuQuettes book out again and will keep that to hand as I read the BoT. I love the style of Crowley's writing but he has a style that as you read, you read then realise you haven't took any of it in. I might start to take notes as I read.

Its interesting reading all your thoughts on the Fool.