A Most Genuine & Authentic Fake 15th Century Method!

[Moonbow]

Yes, a bit like that Kwaw, reading the cards as they lay, and in relation to each other. Thanks for the quote, I don't remember reading that whole thread!

Mel, if this thread doesn't give inspiration to people to work out a reading method I will gladly at my hat.

[Melanchollic]

Originally Posted by Moonbow*

Mel, if this thread doesn't give inspiration to people to work out a reading method I will gladly eat my hat.

No! Don't do that Moonbow! I have a fatal weakness for women who eat hats!

[Rosanne]

Originally Posted by Moonbow*

Yes, a bit like that Kwaw, reading the cards as they lay, and in relation to each other.

I have not said what I use as my 21 cards as this is the Early decks thread

The thing is what I love about this method is that Querents, when they have a question, usually for me it is a sort of yes/no question.
With this way, I have a starting point. I can then expand, like Kwaw has said- to timing and then on to the cards I see as having influence on the yes/no answer. I do not do party readings where yes or no is all that is required. I often look at a spread and I know basically what the cards say, but I have no starting point to expand upon. I have also narrowed my field of Querents down to people I can at least verify the accuracy with.

Don't you find that say with a Celtic Cross, you start the conversation with the 1st card- when scanning the reading you know that cards 6 and 10 have given you the answer already and so on and on you burble and get deflected from the question that was proffered in the first place? I have tried turn and read one card at a time, but I go off in all sorts of tangents.
I am forming a list of significators. It is not at all what I thought in the first place. I have no idea what to do with the World card- because I do not actually think of it as God or Heaven. So I think I will pull it out. Makes it neater anyway. :

~Rosanne

[Melanchollic]

To Procure the Resolution of Miscellaneous Questions and Demands

• To judge if food and drink will be served at a particular function, use The Sun as the significator of food, and Fortune as opportunity. If for just drink, or for wine and spirits particularly, use the Moon and Fortune.
  
  
  
• To make judgement on inheritances, judge the proximity of The Chariot to Death, as it is literally gaining from death.
  
  
  
• To find the possibilities of recovering a lost object, use The Moon to signify the lost object, and The Last Judgement as recovery.
  
  
  
• To determine if someone has been dishonest, use The Juggler as the significator for deception, and Fortune.
  
  
  
• To determine possible illness, find The Empress' (The physical state) proximity to The Traitor.
  
  
  
• To judge on the recovery from illness, use The Empress and The Last Judgement.
  
  
  
• To predict the length of an illness, use The Traitor as significator of illness, and Time - a close proximity being a short duration, a farther proximity being a longer duration.
  
  
  
• In case of possible incarceration, employ either The Traitor or The Tower as main significator, and Fortune as co-significator
  
  
  
• To judge the possibility of parole or pardon, look to The Last Judgements proximity to Fortune.
  
  
  

[kwaw]

Originally Posted by Rosanne

It is not at all what I thought in the first place. I have no idea what to do with the World card- because I do not actually think of it as God or Heaven. So I think I will pull it out. Makes it neater anyway. :

~Rosanne

Well if you are using a deck in which it is the highest trump, it beats everything else in play; thus may be related to any question that can be reduced to the concept of their being a winner in any situation, or 'will n come out on top'?

You could always let chance / fortune dictate which card is left out, after deciding what the signicators are, then shuffle, cut and put top card aside then deal the rest.

You just carry on as normal then, unless the turned up card is one of the significators. If it is one of the significators you could place this back in the spread after it has been dealt using the above four corners method (add up the numbers of corner cards to decide the position of the discarded significator - deducting if the total is over 21 until you get to a number with range). This way both significators could end up occupying the same place = 100% ?

[Rosanne]

Aye Kwaw, that is a good idea, I will try the four corners first- if it makes it too complicated I will use the Fortune idea , shuffle, cut and remove the first card.
~Rosanne

[kwaw]

Originally Posted by Rosanne

Aye Kwaw, that is a good idea, I will try the four corners first- if it makes it too complicated I will use the Fortune idea , shuffle, cut and remove the first card.
~Rosanne

An alternative to the four corners method would be to designate a card, say the WoF, or World, or Fool, which is never chosen as significator unless one of the chosen significators turns up in the cut; then the designated card replaces it as significator - this way the two significators will never occupy the same position in the spread, as they may in the four corners method; this is simpler in that it does away with all that boring counting.

[kwaw]

Originally Posted by kwaw

You just carry on as normal then, unless the turned up card is one of the significators. If it is one of the significators you could place this back in the spread after it has been dealt using the above four corners method (add up the numbers of corner cards to decide the position of the discarded significator - deducting if the total is over 21 until you get to a number with range). This way both significators could end up occupying the same place = 100% ?

Or you could read the significator turning up as the discarded card as meaning that the question is void for some reason and is one the reader cannot answer accurately at the moment, or needs one to question the question and restate it in a different form. This issue of a question being void is one that is met with in horary astrology for example, and thus one a 15th century reader/querent might be familiar with.

[Melanchollic]

Originally Posted by kwaw

Or you could read the significator turning up as the discarded card as meaning that the question is void for some reason and is one the reader cannot answer accurately at the moment, or needs restating in a different form. This issue of a question being void is one that is met with in horary astrology for example, and thus one a 15th century reader/querent might be familiar with.

I like that. It would give it a real 'period' feel, wouldn't it!

[kwaw]

Originally Posted by Melanchollic

I like that. It would give it a real 'period' feel, wouldn't it!

I thought you might like that one

It is also used in some modern GD type derived reading methods, part of the process being to determine for example which of the piles the significator should be in, in relation to the nature of the question.

The ability of the reader to divine the placement of the significator being a sort of control as to whether he is divining the reading correctly or gone astray. For example from Book T:

"First Operation"
This shows the situation of the Querent at the time when he consults you.
1. The pack being in front of you, cut, and place the top half to the left.
2. Cut each pack again to the left.
3. These four stack represent I H V H, from right to left.
4. Find the Significator. It be in the HB:Y pack, the question refers to work,
business, etc.; if in the HB:H pack, to love, marriage, or pleasure; if in the
HB:H pack, to money, goods, and such purely material matters.
5. Tell the Querent what he has come for: if wrong, abandon the divination.
6. If right, spread out the pack containing the Significator, face upwards.
...
"Second Operation"
Development of the Question
1. Shuffle, invoke suitably, and let Querent cut as before.
2. Deal cards into twelve stacks, for the twelve astrological houses of
heaven.
3. Make up your mind in which stack you ought to find the Significator, "e.g."
in the seventh house if the question concerns marriage, and so on.
4. Examine this chosen stack. If the Significator is not there, try some
cognate house. On a second failure, abandon the divination.
...
"Third Operation"
Further Development of the Question
1. Shuffle, etc., as before.
2. Deal cards into twelve stacks for the twelve signs of the Zodiac.
3. Divine the proper stack and proceed as before.
...

etc