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Escaping from the Tree of Life?

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Yes, that's what he is saying. He doesn't want to understand individual card meanings, but rather he focuses on the energy from the each cards in the spread.

When a client comes along to you, and asks whether his / her partner is having an affair, or is he / she right partner for marriage, or will she win the lotto this month, what is Tree of Life got to do with it? That is what he is saying.
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And what do you think?
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My position is, as always, open minded. I never discard anyone's view as rubbish until such times comes along - that I have 110% factual evidence that it is wrong, unless of course, it sounds utter non sense.

If it sounds reasonable, and is open for debate, then I will always listen, and see how it goes, and squares in theory as well as in real life in the long run. Also gather more opinions from more people.
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Yes but there is a difference between having an open mind and having no opinion. You asked a question, got answers, what is your opinion on the matter?
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Open mind is not same as having no opinion.

I still think ToL is meaningful system in explaining and understanding mind, deity, universe, and tarot. I would never toss it away in favor of anything. It has its place.

But if I am reading for a client who is asking if she is going win the lotto this month, then I would not use ToL for that reading. Rather, I would use 3 cards reading, YES NO spread.

So depending on the application of situation, he could be right or wrong. Maybe in some particular readings, OOTK can be powerful and suitable method, but it cannot tell anything about what ToL can.
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When you say Tree of Life, what do you mean? The Tree isn't a spread, it is the structure upon which the GD Tarot is built. The OOTK is a spread that rests heavily on kabbalah. One is not interchangeable with the other. It is nigh impossible to perform the OOTK without some sort of Kabbalistic base, as it relies heavily on the pairing of elements and the like.

Plus, as I tried to demonstrate, the Tree is very useful when dealing with the mundane, one just needs to know how. But it isn't a spread, although it can be used as such.

How would you go about doing the OOTK without kabbalah?
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That is exactly what I said. Tree is not a spread, nobody said it was. Tree of Life is a conceptual frame of explaining and understanding mind, deity, universe and tarot.

So when you read Tarot for your clients, you forget about it, but use OOTK or 3 cards spread or CC whatever spread you think is relevant for the question.

By the way, I don't think PHB was talking about tarot spreads anyways, but about one's mental frame when doing tarot readings.

I am not against Kabbalah either. I study it, because I believe it enriches Tarot reading and understanding. But there are many thousands people who do not know it, and read cards well too. I am sure. There would be ways to use OOTK with Kabbalah or without, I would imagine. I also sometimes use OOTK without Kabbalah - my own way.

I think above is PHB's opinion. I am just an open minded tarot student not on one side or the other.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foolMoon View Post
......I think above is PHB's opinion. I am just an open minded tarot student not on one side or the other.
I think you have an excellent grasp of PHB's perspective. Accordingly, I also think that your understanding of Kabbalah is at least as profound as his.

You either accept the ToL as a valid map of reality or you don't. If you do, why use it sometimes and not others? If you don't, why use it at all?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LRichard View Post
You either accept the ToL as a valid map of reality or you don't. If you do, why use it sometimes and not others? If you don't, why use it at all?
This is a valid question. In my opinion the Tree of Life is a valuable model of reality. It is not the only model, of course, and others may have a very different view of how the world works. But I find it useful as a mental model on which to place experiences and events and then analyze them accordingly. But I do it both in psycho-spiritual readings as well as more mundane readings.

I'm curious as to why you feel the Tree is useful for some things but not for others? My demonstration wasn't perfect, but did it not show how it is done?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LRichard View Post
I think you have an excellent grasp of PHB's perspective. Accordingly, I also think that your understanding of Kabbalah is at least as profound as his.

You either accept the ToL as a valid map of reality or you don't. If you do, why use it sometimes and not others? If you don't, why use it at all?
I don't think one has to be deluded, as if there should be one truth, and only one way to understand Kabbalah. All understandings evolve, and are different from person to person. No two minds are same, and one can only try to understand other minds by linguistic contacts, which would be never perfect.

And I feel I don't have to accept or discard anything just because it is right or wrong.

Why one would, or would not use Tol sometimes is, I am guessing and repeating, but as I have explained to clos, there are situation where ToL does well -for example more metaphysical activities such as trying to find where God might be, where one's desire comes from, how things are made and come to being ...etc, but there are also cases where it is totally impotent such as answering to mundane questions for examples whether Mrs T will win Lotto jackpot this month, or is X a good partner for Y in business or marriage etc, which are mostly requested to be answered by general Tarot reading clients.

Of course, one could try explaining the readings based on the ToL path walkings to his clients, which will neither likely to be understood, nor appreciated. And does it warrant any advantages such as more accuracy in the answers of the readings for them? - I am not sure.
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