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Wheel of Fantastic  Wheel of Fantastic is offline
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Red face Current Morgan Greer decks - Different card sizes


I'm posting this because a) I'm slightly confused and b) delighted.

Why am I confused? I own a Belgium printed MG bought back in 2004; a current English printed in Italy edition bought this year and an Italian language edition printed in Belgium which I just received.

The modern English edition is 4 mm narrower than the Belgium editions. What is the reason behind this, does anyone know? 4 mm doesn't sound like much but you do notice it. Not saying it's bad but personally I prefer the larger cards; cardstock for all 3 is a nice firm matte.

Why am I delighted? If you liked the larger Belgium cards with not quite so saturated colours then you will be glad to hear the Italian edition is IDENTICAL to the old Belgium English edition. Except for the language of course. I am personally pleased I can still get the older pre-laminated, pre-printed in Italy decks. I find the saturated English edition makes some of the cards too dark - such as the Lovers.

Anyway, just wanted to put this info out there. If you buy the Italian deck you will get the older, larger, brighter Morgan Greer of the late '90s/early '00s. When it comes to Tarot, you can time travel!

Also, why are US Games printing this deck in two different countries? Wouldn't it be more efficient to have all the language editions printed in the same place?
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Originally Posted by Wheel of Fantastic View Post
Also, why are US Games printing this deck in two different countries? Wouldn't it be more efficient to have all the language editions printed in the same place?
I suppose for the same reason everyone else does it: money.

I find your observations very intriguing, in more than one way. I mean, we are talking about a deck that, even in the first few printings, changed from borderless to bordered and back to borderless within a year or so, and whose backs, while apparently being the same, change strangely from printing to printing, and even from card to card in the same deck. (And I'm not even getting into the off-center cards, mostly trumps, and the brown or blue boxes.) There are entire threads here devoted to establishing a definite timeline!

My Morgan Greer is one of the very first printings, with an off-center Chariot (and another card I can't remember). And I love the cardstock. Matte and silky and 100% unlaminated... Like you say, it is rare to find such cardstock nowadays, and I'm happy to know that it can still be had if you buy a Made in Italy Morgan Greer.
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There were quite a few off centered cards. The Chariot. Was onre of the more noticable ones. I got me another one and was perfect. I don't have the decks with me right now so I can't compare which was which but the poker size in the tin is nice also. I'm on the other side, I like the glossy because I think it brings out the colors. I have an original in the box that is matte and the colors have faded.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magicjack View Post
There were quite a few off centered cards. The Chariot. Was onre of the more noticable ones. I got me another one and was perfect. I don't have the decks with me right now so I can't compare which was which but the poker size in the tin is nice also. I'm on the other side, I like the glossy because I think it brings out the colors. I have an original in the box that is matte and the colors have faded.
My original is still rich and vibrant, but to be fair I got it unused last year. (It was like Wheel of Fantastic says, time-traveling back to the 70s.) I like my off-center deck, maybe because I am an off-center person...
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Wheel of Fantastic  Wheel of Fantastic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLizarraga View Post
I suppose for the same reason everyone else does it: money.

I find your observations very intriguing, in more than one way. I mean, we are talking about a deck that, even in the first few printings, changed from borderless to bordered and back to borderless within a year or so, and whose backs, while apparently being the same, change strangely from printing to printing, and even from card to card in the same deck. (And I'm not even getting into the off-center cards, mostly trumps, and the brown or blue boxes.) There are entire threads here devoted to establishing a definite timeline!

My Morgan Greer is one of the very first printings, with an off-center Chariot (and another card I can't remember). And I love the cardstock. Matte and silky and 100% unlaminated... Like you say, it is rare to find such cardstock nowadays, and I'm happy to know that it can still be had if you buy a Made in Italy Morgan Greer.
Cardstock is a big deal for me. The Italian edition not only is matte but also appears to have a carbon layer; it should last for years without creasing, chipping etc etc.

I 've read a lot of the old posts here about the history of the Morgan Greer; the different permutations of the deck + box make your head spin. Good to know the modern incarnations of the deck are keeping the tradition alive!

One more thing: the box for the Italian edition looks pretty much like that of the old Belgium English edition (Chariot on front, 8 of Cups on back) except there is no US Games logo anywhere on the box.
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Hi Wheel !

Just after reading your post, I had to go and check my own copies, because I had never realized that the new english edition is narrower. But you are right, it is ! By several milimeters ! I had never noticed !

I have the Morgan Greer in english, in a recent edition, narrower cards, darker backs, and the cards have more saturated colors with a matte finish. The cardstock is nice and easi to shuffle. The box showed a Queen (cant rememember which)

Then I have two other copies (the french version and the italian version, but apart from the languages they are identical) printed in Belgium, larger cards, lighter backs, satiny/semi shiny finish, lighter colors on the images, super sleek cardstock (they fly everywhere when shuffling). The boxes showed the Chariot.

My favourite is the one in french, but I am biaised. So many of my decks are in english, most of my collection is in english. So, from time to time, it is nice to have a deck in my native language.
Cardstockwise, I am not sure I would not have a slight preference for the newer narrower version, just because the cards do not fly everywhere when you handle the cards (the Belgium cardstock is really slippery !) But I still like my french version better, even if I have to pick up the cards from the floor each time I attempt to shuffle
The Italian version is actually my "backup copy", should I lose a card from my french deck (but let's hope that will not happen - I just like to be super cautious)
I could not have replaced such a card with one from the newer edition, since the backs are a different color and different finish (and since the size is different too, as you just pointed out !), and the french edition is out of print and difficult to source (I know where to get some, but they are very pricey), so the italian version is a good option for backup, for me
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Hi Carojulie

I didn't even realise there was a French edition (Spanish and Italian were the only non-English editions I was aware of).

I love the feel of the larger Belgium printed cards but you're right, they are slippery devils even though they're matte! That finish though makes them superb for fanning out on a table.

I was considering getting a vintage deck at one point but was put off when I heard there were issues with the cardstock of the early decks. This is a case where I feel modern is better than vintage (with the Rider Waite it's the other way around).
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Originally Posted by Wheel of Fantastic View Post
I was considering getting a vintage deck at one point but was put off when I heard there were issues with the cardstock of the early decks. This is a case where I feel modern is better than vintage (with the Rider Waite it's the other way around).
Do you mean you prefer the new narrower edition ?
Or you prefer the slightly wider edition printed in Belgium?

For me I think the narrower edition is the modern one, and the two editions printed in Belgium are vintage (my italian version is from 1996 I think, and the french version from 1993. Both printed in Beligum with larger cards and lighter backs, and I had a feeling they were both out of print - the french one is definitively out of print. There was a german edition in the same box and cartstock, I think it is OOP too)
Now I wonder if I am not mistaken ?

ETA : I have looked up the different versions in the net, and you are right, the italian version is still easily available, while all the other languages seem difficult to get and obviously OOP.
But, really, my french edition and the one in italian are 100% similar, I could not tell one card from another unless I look at the language (and on the pips, their is not name so they are exactly the same) Same cardstock, same quality, same box, both printed in Belgium.... it kind of makes me wonder if the italian version printed in Belgium is still in print, or if their is just a big stock still in circulation ? Would that be possible ?
I know (from a shop affiliated to the printer in Belgium - the belgium shop that still sell many OOP decks, but pricey) that there had been only one print of the french version in 1993...
In any case they are 100% identical and, since my french version is vintage, that is why I kind of consider the italian version printed in Belgium, to be "vintage" too, by association !
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Wheel of Fantastic  Wheel of Fantastic is offline
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My sense is the Italian version is still in print, it's widely available and is also on Amazon.com. My English edition printed in Belgium (identical to the Italian edition) went out of print around 2004 when US Games switched printing to Italy.
I find it ironic that the Italian edition is not printed in Italy whereas the English edition is.


By vintage Morgan Greer I mean early '80s, where cards in the same deck had different star patterns on the back. I own vintage decks but I'm not a collector - I try to get vintage decks if they are better quality than the current versions. For this reason I own early '70s Rider Waite and a '60s/'70s vintage Albano Waite. I don't feel the vintage Morgan Greer decks are better quality than the current versions.

EDIT:

Just checked the US Games website, the Italian edition is available there so is definitely still in print. The page for the Spanish edition is disabled so appears to be out of print. Therefore, the MG is only currently available in English and Italian.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheel of Fantastic View Post
My sense is the Italian version is still in print, it's widely available and is also on Amazon.com. My English edition printed in Belgium (identical to the Italian edition) went out of print around 2004 when US Games switched printing to Italy.
I find it ironic that the Italian edition is not printed in Italy whereas the English edition is.


By vintage Morgan Greer I mean early '80s, where cards in the same deck had different star patterns on the back. I own vintage decks but I'm not a collector - I try to get vintage decks if they are better quality than the current versions. For this reason I own early '70s Rider Waite and a '60s/'70s vintage Albano Waite. I don't feel the vintage Morgan Greer decks are better quality than the current versions.

EDIT:

Just checked the US Games website, the Italian edition is available there so is definitely still in print. The page for the Spanish edition is disabled so appears to be out of print. Therefore, the MG is only currently available in English and Italian.
I see !
Yes it's ironic that the italian version is still printed in Belgium and the english version is printed in italy. I cannot even see the economic reason for doing it like that.... but there must be one certainly. I had thought that this deck was no longer printed in Belgium at all, and that was the reason for all foreign versions of the deck to disapear, but obviously I was wrong. I read somewhere that the tin version is printed in China, go figure.

I have another deck in french that was printed in Belgium (apparently from the same printing facility as the Morgan Greer, though I am not 100%certain). It's the Albano Waite french version (OOP). The cardstock is very different from the original english version (the french version is more "papery" and more satiny, though still in a robust, quality cardstock, fine to the touch. It seems to have the inside carbon layer.) and I like that. The only (big) caveat I have with my french version Albano is that the french titles are plain printing font block letters, as opposed to finely handmade font of the titles of the english version. But I still prefer my french version for sentimental reasons and for the cardstock ; and besides I also have the Centennial to appreciate Pixie's beautiful handmade font. Sorry for this digression from Morgan Greer ! But I thought it was interesting to compare
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