Original Rider Waite - Which Original ?

Everyone here will no doubt have taken a look at Holly's Rider pages at some time or another:

http://home.comcast.net/~vilex/index.html

Probably like me you've had to throw much of what you thought correct concerning the deck's print history out of the window!!

I always assumed that there were two versions of this deck - what we now know of as the 'original' Rider waite, based on cards printed from plates destroyed during the war and the 1971 U.S. Games reconstruction.

Seeing Holly's pages, I've now discovered that the U.S. Games is more original than the 'original', being a very close copy of the 1909 1st edition and the 'original' is a facsimile of one of many inferior copies that were printed between 1910 and the war - help!!!

Looking at Holly's wonderful site, I can't find an exact match to the deck that the 'original' rider waite is reproduced from - Can anyone shed any further light on this?

Are any of these questions addressed in Kaplan's 'encyclopedia of Tarot' (Which I'd love but can't afford!!!!!)

Furthermore, where does the Tudor rose back come in ? was it featured in a limited run only (all of Holly's early decks including her 'first edition' have the same non - descript crazy paving pattern in beige on the back).

This is probably like asking why the meaning of Life, the Universe and Everything adds up to the number 42! However, if anyone can shed any extra light on this it would be greatly appreciated.

I want to make sure I've got my facts totally straight before I rewrite my article!

Chris. xx

Hi Chris, I don't know if this addresses your questions exactly, but there's some interesting discussion in this thread:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19475&perpage=10&highlight=pamela&pagenumber=1

-- Lee

Lee, that's really fabulous and yes, it's finally answered my questions ! particularly with relation to why there are so many variants and in some cases, perpetuated mistakes ( like the wonky eyes on the Sun card).

You're priceless!

Chris. xx

Hi Chris,
On Holly's Rider-Waite Site did you check the section SHIP OF FOOLS? If you click on the card showing the 1909 Rose & Lilies Fool she discusses the relationship between the 1909 Rose & Lilies deck with the 1993 Original Rider-Waite deck.
Regards,
Bob

Just had a look Bob,
That finally answers my questions. I can do my article rewrite in confidence now!

Chris. xx

It's a shame even Holly doesn't know where the 'Original' Rider Waite deck came from though !

I actually prefer using the 'Original' Rider Waite in spite of its inferior origins because I like the antique look, and it matches my bag.

The 'Original' Rider Waite the one with the blue tudor rose design was my first Rider Waite. Although I was never very keen on the limited colouring and the thick black lines that seem to overtake the artwork it was my study deck for quite a while.

I did read a review somewhere from a lady who had bought the 'Original' Rider Waite as a replacement for a very old Rider Waite she had been using and she said that she was very disappointed in the colouring of this version and that it looked badly printed. This Original is also more expensive than the standard Rider Waite.

I've never got round to having the more normal coloured standard Rider Waite and instead opted to go for the Universal Waite.

With Arthur's words/1911 pictures

Holly contributed scans of her 1909-1911 reproduction for illustrations of free texts with Arthur Waite's words.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/pkt/

I hope this helps you.

I've heard that she is away on vacation, but she has kindly responded to emails in the past...so perhaps she can also answer further questions if you do follow-up research.

Best wishes,

Cerulean

Re: With Arthur's words/1911 pictures

I've heard that she is away on vacation, but she has kindly responded to emails in the past...so perhaps she can also answer further questions if you do follow-up research.

Best wishes,

Cerulean [/B][/QUOTE]

_______________________________________________

Thanks C.

I probably will drop Holly a line at some stage, not only to clarify some of my questions but also because I've really become fascinated with the whole question of the deck's print history - something far more complicated than I had first imagined.

Chris. xx