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isthmus nekoi's Avatar
isthmus nekoi  isthmus nekoi is offline
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study group ~ *s c o r p i o*


Alright! Time for the first sign in our study group! If you've just stepped in, please refer to this thread for more info:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?threadid=8487
Top   #1
isthmus nekoi's Avatar
isthmus nekoi  isthmus nekoi is offline
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introduction


SCORPIO (approx Oct 24 - Nov 22) ~
ruling planets: mars, pluto
associated house: 8th
symbol: scorpion (but also the eagle and phoenix)
glyph: an m which ends in a barb
element: water
quality: fixed
birthstone: opal
metal: iron

Scorpio keywords:
intensity, passion, extremes, all-or-nothing, destruction, regeneration, sexuality, death, secrets, hidden, forbidden, psychology, occult, obsession, control, power, cunning, ruthlessness, perserverance, resourcefulness, magnetism, defiance, subversion, loyalty

MARS~
gylph: a circle connected to a diagonal line ending in a barb
year: approx 1.88 yrs

Mars keywords:
war, ego, risk, passion, will, energy, conflict, courage, competition, aggression, heat,

PLUTO~
glyph: there are 2 common glyphs for Pluto. The first is the circle which floats (transcends) above the semi circle which rests upon a cross. The other looks like a capital P with a horizontal line extending to the right from the base of the P.
year: 247.7 yrs

Pluto keywords:
destruction, regeneration, transformation, secrecy, elimination, power, obsession, all-or-nothing, degradation, treachery, subversion, concentration (practically interchangable w/Scorpio keywords)

8th HOUSE~
type: succedent water

8th keywords:
sex, death, money/resources, occult, psychology

------------

Hopefully this intro post provides a good jumping off point. I know Minderwiz mentioned getting more in depth about the sign quality (associated w/house type) so we'll move in that direction. After everyone feels they have a secure base of understanding, I'm going to pull in mythological, agricultural and tarot connections and get some real Scorpian in depth discussion going.

------------

We are also in luck. Mountain Astrologer has their Scorpio issue online for free. Check it out here: http://www.mountainastrologer.com/sc...99titlepg.html
Top   #2
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AquarianGoddess  AquarianGoddess is offline
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The Mountain Astrologer issue of "All Things Scorpio" is a MUST READ FOR ALL SCORP'S and everyone who knows a Scorp (Sun, Moon or Ascendant).

AG

Isthmus...you did a very good job!
Top   #3
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Wow, Isthmus, this is so freaking cool!

i am always here in astrology reading ppl's conjunction in nth degree in house with trine to something and i hear blah, blah, jibbity jabber in my head becuz i don't know anything about any of it! every time i try to learn it i always get to the same place, usually about what you covered already and then i give up! LOL

but i am determined this time! well, i was determined every time--lol--but maybe this time it will take.

as for the all or nothing aspect with scorpios, since i do have my chart done here, by someone else of course, i was not shocked to see that it is split exactly in half with all activity in only 6 of the 12 houses and the bulk of it being in the 8th house.

holy moly, i'm already talking like i've learned something!

love and blessings,
New River
Top   #4
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ummm could you explain a few things for this slow person please?

quality; fixed ( does this have to do with it's relationship to the equinoxes and solstices?)

birthstone; opal (hey! i'm a libra (scorpio rising) and i've always been told this is my stone because i was born in oct. what about nov. scorpios? or have i been wrong all along)

8th house type; succedent water (water i get, but what is succedent? )
Top   #5
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Minderwiz  Minderwiz is offline
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Perhaps I can leap in to answer Zorya's queries or at least two of them and hazard a go at the third.

The qualities do indeed relate to the equinoxes and solstices and the cycle of nature.

These four, Spring and Autumn equinox and Summer and Winter Solstice are the Cardinal points of the zodiac. They are often therefore said to have 'Cardinal' as their quality. Basically this is seen as generating and releasing new energy, getting things going, initiating new activities, pushing for action. Cardinal signs are at the start of something (A season) and they get things moving.

The next quality is the one relevant to Scorpio - Fixed - the other three fixed signs are Taursus (Earth, Leo (Fire) and Aquarius (Air). During these signs the season reaches its most potent form. Fixed signs are associated with staying power, and consolidation, These signs are often identified as having the ability to see through what the Cardinal signs started. Autumn is started by Libra but its Scorpio that consolidates Autumn. Likewise People born with a predominance of cardinal signs may be good at getting things going but not have the staying power to see them through. Taureans, Leos, Scorpios and Aquarians have that staying power. The downside is that a preponderance of fixed signs may indicate stubborness or an inability to change in the face of the evidence - Taureans are symbolised by the Bull, a notoriously stubborn animal. Scorpions too are fixed in terms of intention - If it moves, sting it. If it doesn't move, sting it anyway coz it could be a trap.

The final quality is Mutable - We'll meet this next month with Sagittarius but basically this is when one season begins to change ready for the new season to take over. Mutable sign people are adaptable.

The other query I can answer is 'Succeedent' The Houses of a natal chart show the area of life that a planet and sign manifest in. They are numbered starting with the Ascendant and going round in an anti-clockwise manner (or if you're in the US, Counterclockwise). If you think of a compass the first House lies at due East. Now this is an angle, as is South, West and North - so the corresponding Houses, First, Fourth, Seventh and Tenth are called Angular Houses and correspond but are not identical to the Cardinal points and signs.

The House that comes after the Angular House (Second, Fifth, Eighth and Eleventh) are called Succeedent Houses. If you imagine the Sun rising in Scorpio in the East then Scorpio is on the Ascendant. If that were say 1 degree Scorpio, then that degree would move upwards and from East to West as the day progressed. Taking its place on the Ascendant, would be successively 2, 3, 4, 5........30 degrees Scorpio. These degrees succeed to the Ascendant in the old meaning of 'following'. Under the Equal House system when 1 degree Sagittarius rises we move on to the second House, which succeeds the first House - i.e. it is a Succeedent House. The Same happens at all the other angles. So at the Fourth House (Due North) 1 degree Aquarius will eventually be succeeded by 1 degree Pisces.

The moment of birth is a snapshot - so if you were born with 1 degree Scorpio rising then we look at the queue of Houses that follow it. The Second House begins at 1 degree Sag. and is a Succeedent House, The Fifth House starting at 1 degree Pisces is Succeedent, The Eighth House starting at 1 degree Gemini is Succeedent and the Eleventh, starting at 1 degree Virgo is Succeedent.

These houses are usually seen as having stored potency because they will succeed to prominance at an angle. You will notice from the example that in this case Gemini is the eighth House. Houses and Signs are not the same, unless you have 0 degrees Aries rising. However Astrologers do often refer to Aries as the natural sign of the first and therefore Scorpio as the natural sign of the eighth. There is correspondence but not identity here.

I'm not sure about the birthstone example. Perhaps someone else can help but I might hazard a guess that as Scorpio starts in October that explains the link.

OK there is a lot there so If anyone needs clarfication please ask away - its not easy stuff.

Minderwiz

PS Happy birthday Scorpios
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isthmus nekoi's Avatar
isthmus nekoi  isthmus nekoi is offline
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isthmus nekoi 

Minderwiz, thanks a bunch for fielding the questions.

To address the opal issue; I'm not sure why this is the birthstone, there was no explanation given from the source... although the metal makes sense - mars/iron.

More on succedent houses*:
These houses represent areas of life where we feel the need to control and be secure - which matches w/the fixed quality of Scorpio. 2, 5, 8, 11 are all succedent houses and they all relate to posessions/security whether it's attaining material wealth/self worth (2), outwardly mastering enjoyment/self expression (5), gaining group values/beliefs (11) or controling 8th house matters (see keywords). Being a water house, 8th represents the need to control and consolidate on an emotional level.

---------------

Since no one's really sure what to do I propose that we start moving to application unless anyone is unclear about the kind of energy associated w/Scorpio. I can write about the concrete areas covered by the 8th house and Pluto. If someone could do Mars that would be great. Also, if someone can check out the history of rulership b/w Mars/Pluto that would be helpful. While I'd love to research this through and through, I do have to go to school ^_~

When that's been covered, I'd like to explore other systems w/you guys... but I was thinking this thread may get rather unwieldly. Maybe if it gets confusing we can have a marking system in the subject field like 1) for basic issues ie: how fast does Pluto orbit? 2) for application ie: Mars rules anything to do w/cutting; surgery, soldiers etc 3) for historical issues ie: when did they find Pluto?
As for 4) we'll have to see how this pans out. I can see it easily becoming disorganized as there is plenty of opportunity to go off on interesting tangents. If need be we can create a new thread for this one, or come up w/some organized system.

--------

*info from Stephen Arroyo's "Chart Interpretation Handbook" digested and regurgitated.
Top   #7
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I am an earth science teacher and the opal is a special form of quartz and contains varying amounts of water. That is probably why it is scorpio's birthstone.
Top   #8
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Scorpios are very possessive , and will hold a grudge for a long time. They can also take things a bit too seriously ( the all or nothing thing)
Top   #9
Minderwiz's Avatar
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Minderwiz 

Stephen Arroyo is quite useful and his, Identity Security, material security, Social and intellectual Securityand Soul Security for succeedent houses is a good guide and I do use it myself.

Arroyo like Liz Greene tends to overdo the Pluto = Scorpio = Eighth equalities, for me - I think there are subtleties which perhaps get lost with too close an equation.

I Think thoug Isthmus' idea of starting with Pluto eighth and following with Mars is a good way forward as there are many astrologers who just don't accept Pluto as the ruler of Scorpio - they are a minority but a significant one - so we could tease out a fair amount by looking at that area.

So off you go on Pluto and the eighth

Minderwiz
Top   #10




 


 


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