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Join Date: 27 Sep 2007
Location: Northern Germany
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Originally Posted by Shade
With market research - can you tell I work in advertising? :-)
I deleted that suggestion from my earlier post because I thought that it was obvious. Can you tell that I worked in market research?

Originally Posted by Shade
The Empress card in the LS Celtic tarot. People HATED this card. Largely I think this is because the Morrigan is a favorite for many fans of all things Celtic and they tend to prefer a more dark beauty-amazon type for her.

The Empress in the Robin Wood was often criticized by people who didn't like seeing the Empress as an older woman.
You know what? I hate the LS Celtic Empress, too. I don't hate her body, though, I hate her face and pose. It's exactly what I talked about before: she doesn't look as if she's happy, at ease, and comfortable in her body. Instead, she looks like a caricature of a fat woman who is out of breath and possibly about to have a stroke from jumping around too much and losing the ground below her feet. In short: She's just not empress-y. I believe that's why she is disliked by others, too.

The Robin Wood Empress lacks sensuality for me. Again, I mostly dislike her head. The headdress makes her look like a repressed housewife of former times, like someone's granny, not like an Empress/Goddess/earth mother/whatever your favorite shorthand term for her is. She's just a bit too "good," too "virtuous." (I'm aware of the idea of the threefold goddess, and that this includes the crone part, but the Empress really screams "mother" to me, not maiden or crone. After all, she's all about fertility/creativity/overflowing richness of "nature"...)

Originally Posted by Shade
The Lovers in the Contemplative - people have usually described the card as disturbing - owing to a degree that the woman in the card looks too small compared to the man. Now we know that since this is a Lovers card we are seeing two adults but she just wasn't doing it for a lot of folks.
I agree with the criticism here. She really seems awfully small compared to him. I'd be interested in hearing more about the reasons why the artist/producer decided this was the best illustration for this card. Maybe I'd understand it better then.

Originally Posted by Shade
Conversely I know a lot of people liked the World in the World Spirit deck and she is certainly a chunky girl. I think the card is well-loved enough
Exactly my point. And, to repeat it again, I think she's so well-loved (not by everyone, but by "enough" people) because she isn't embarrassed, she's not made to look slightly ridiculous, but she's completely unselfconscious, and totally comfortable and happy to dance exactly how she is. It's much more about the face/pose than about anything else. I also believe that her blue skin color makes it easier to view her as some kind of idea(l), an allegory, a symbol, instead as a portrait of a "real" woman. She makes me wish I was her, whereas the examples given above only make me feel pity for her to be caught in such an embarrassing moment for all the world to see (you know how it is with these oh-so-unflattering snap-shots...).

And, to tie this back to market research, the above-mentioned examples aren't market research. The images I'm talking about (and others might agree with me about) simply don't exist, yet. Useful market research would mean creating several equally "sensual and powerful" (to overly reduce the matterfor brevity's sake) images of, say, Empresses, by the same artist, in the same context of a whole deck and its accompanying worldview/philosophy/approach, and then let people pick their favorite version. Put up previews here on AT and let people comment. But most of all, find the right artist. There must be people out there who are able to draw/paint a big woman who looks sensual, powerful, and attractive to many. Heck, run a contest to find them. I'm sure there are possibilities that are within the scope of the publishing business...
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