Quantum James said:
Well... its as Kat says knights are fire and princes air.
In which case I'd say that the Thoth knights are like RWS kings, and thoth princes are like RWS knights. I think.
Quantum James said:
And as far as correlating with RWS court, they simply just DO NOT. This has been my major realization - I cannot transpose the meanings or attitudes at all. The Thoth/GD structure is its own - its not as simple as swapping them. Once this stuck in my head I decided to scrap trying that and look at the court with fresh eyes.
Ah, okay. A complete different animal, then. This is reminding me of what I'm doing with the TdM courts - not really ditching the GD elemental attribs (well, the RWS where Kings = fire, etc), but looking at them in a completely different way, more based on their posture, expression, etc. The Vieville is much different from the classic TdM, btw.
Quantum James said:
Admittedly, its totally counterintuitive by comparison to the European feudal court structure represented in RWS.
The most confusing part being that Knight-king (as the Liber T LWB calls them) is the mature yang energy, with king-like consort qualities in relation to the queen AND the get up and go energy of a RWS knight. While the Prince has the unstable youthful energy of RWS knight AND the rulership qualities of a king - as the king in training.
Are you looking at that mature yang energy as choleric/fire? because then the princes being air/ sanguine would give them a totally different feel. BUt then again, the GD evidently didn't use the 'true' Renaissance meanings for the elements (and modern-day paganism takes them even further away from the traditional meanings)... considering that air is sanguine (jolly, happy-go-lucky, social butterfly) versus the usual 'mental anguish' of the swords suit really takes you somewhere else entirely. For me, Coupes/Sanguine/Air!
Quantum James said:
I have started thinking of them as King part 1 and part 2 - what this does do however is undermine the hierarchical structure of the RWS court making the whole thing very flat - and very matriarchal actually.
Anyway, I am still trying to fully integrate the idea into my head - I suspect when the transformation is complete my brain structure will be *permanently* altered!
[EDIT]: Oh my I had an epiphany as I read my own post! The RWS court structure models a courts structure as single 'family' unit. The Thoth structure is more temporal or TIME based. The Prince is the King in phase 1 of his development and he grows up and becomes Knight-king in phase 2. Same for the princess, who grows up to become the queen!
Oh, amazing! I see what you are saying, and of course, I'd read about the Prince displacing the Knight et al before when I read the BoT, but it never struck me this way. Great! Thanks!
Quantum James said:
The Prince grows up gets on his horse and goes to another kingdom to go marry a princess who has grown up and become the new queen... They have two children; a prince and princess - the throne eventually passes to the princess and prince leaves to go marry another princess elsewhere...
Its described in the Greer/Little book to that effect but its only now as I posted that it all made sense.
Kilted Kat said:
This is what I have been up to: an emergency deck for my car!
Wow, that's really sweet! I bought the mini jodo/camoin, and it's a perfect little emergency car deck, too. Great work!
Onyx said:
Checkign in on my IDS.
I have finished the class I am teaching and it was a lot of fun and far more challenging than I thought it would be. I got a chance to introduce a couple of new people to our wonderful world of Tarot.
One thing that has amazed me as I return to my focus on non-scenic pips is the vast variety of different decks. I thought when I started I was going to be limited to either 1JJ Swiss or a TdM style. But there are a lot of different decks. My latest interest is the Crystal Tarot. I had heard about it but never gave it a shot until I heard it was non-scenic pips I took a look and then snagged me a deck.
I like how as I work through getting away from the dependence on the pictures I am happy to find that I have lots of beautiful options to explore the new world I am discoverying.
Onyx.
I love the art in the Crystal deck, but seeing Swords as ?water? I think rather put me off the deck.
The world of non-scenic pips is quite deep - take a look at the Tarot of Eden, the Ukiyoe, the Tarot du Roy Nissanka... all pip decks, with very different takes on the cards.
rwcarter said:
Well, as I knew it would, my IDS with the Ancient Egyptian has come to something of a crossroads. I'm not declaring it over cause there's still lots to do with it, but my Transparent Tarot has arrived and that's going to be my new fixation for awhile. After reading the book, I don't think there's going to be a lot to study with this deck. Instead I think it's going to be a deck that screams out to be used. And I will be doing just that.
But when I feel a need to do some studying, I will be doing so with the AET. So, my IDS isn't over and it isn't even on hold. I guess it's becoming an ODS (Occasional Deck Study). But I'll still be watching this thread to see the progress people are making and the hurdles they're crossing. And I'll still be welcoming people and encouraging them along.
The IDS has been a wonderful experience for me. It's changed the way I approach decks and even how I read. I hope everyone's IDS has such a positive impact on them.
Rodney
Great to hear that you had such a successful time with the AET - bravo! I'm very curious about the Transparent tarot... maybe someday i'll get to see one in action. I just discovered a new must-have deck recently, and I'm trying to figure out how I'll ever be able to afford it. More later.
On another front, I find that my IDS is morphing from just the Vieville to the Vieville + various TdMs. I'm using the TdMs to compare with the Vieville in my daily draws (or should I say 'thrice-weekly draws'), and that is giving me greater insight into the Vieville.
