EmpressArwen
I assumed since she mention convention and We are the Champions.
a hex, and this hurting world
GotH
You are right EmpressArwen. I've been distracted today and not really focusing on one thing at a time. I also had something in my head about trying to remind myself there are other countries with other issues going on.
fractalgranny
had a great conversation with two friends, one of them a wiccan priest, and we're figuring things out here. i've posted an apology, and i thinking i'll do some journaling about the whole experience. i've also started following a few people on twitter who have very different opinions than i do for inspiration on how i can bless them well. metta, of course, always works 
and @DDwarks, no i am not a saint. but sometimes this saintly chip appears on my shoulder, and i need to keep telling it to bugger off
and @padma thanks! love MC yogi - have that CD!
and @DDwarks, no i am not a saint. but sometimes this saintly chip appears on my shoulder, and i need to keep telling it to bugger off
and @padma thanks! love MC yogi - have that CD!
Debra
On the other hand...using your skills to make the world better is admirable, so although you have reservations about it, my head and heart say, "Good for you, right on."
suk
Fractalgranny,
Please don't feel guilty for what you did, because this is something that's been on my mind too. I wondered if it would still be 'immoral' if one used magic to prevent certain awful things from happening. I haven't acted on that thought so far, but it does make me curious. It's exciting in a strange way to know that other people are thinking the same thing.
The world makes less and less sense to me as I grow older. I don't think it's true that every generation had to deal with the problems we have, because a lot of the previous generations' mistakes have culminated to create today's problems. They are much more serious, and much more scary, especially since the political attitudes have remained the same, or become more regressive. The hurt and fear are both real and very, very deep.
The way I rationalise it (and there are some days I can't) is that the worst things have to transpire to 'wake people up' and make them see what's really important. I think of it in terms of the Tower card. There's no way that we can escape our collective karma, and the consequences of what we've done, and continue to do. All we can aspire to have control over is what we do now, and in the future.
In a lot of ways, as many of the replies have pointed out, this means going within and trying to gain an understanding of ourselves. It's good that the state of the world bothers you so much. You'll use that feeling to make conscious decisions in your life, so that you don't live a blind, selfish, egocentric existence (hopefully).
I don't think we should try to minimise the individual experience; in fact, it's odd that we do, because we elevate the individual narrative in almost every other realm except the spiritual. Magic teaches us that we are more than we think, that our influence goes beyond what we can perceive. That's what metta is based on too, the belief that individual emotion is more powerful than we imagine.
I have a feeling that Trump is only the beginning, that we have a long, difficult road ahead of us as a species.
ETA On a related note, here is a quote by Joseph Campbell:
ETA2 I came across another piece in the book I was reading, Phil Hine's Condensed Chaos:
Please don't feel guilty for what you did, because this is something that's been on my mind too. I wondered if it would still be 'immoral' if one used magic to prevent certain awful things from happening. I haven't acted on that thought so far, but it does make me curious. It's exciting in a strange way to know that other people are thinking the same thing.
The world makes less and less sense to me as I grow older. I don't think it's true that every generation had to deal with the problems we have, because a lot of the previous generations' mistakes have culminated to create today's problems. They are much more serious, and much more scary, especially since the political attitudes have remained the same, or become more regressive. The hurt and fear are both real and very, very deep.
The way I rationalise it (and there are some days I can't) is that the worst things have to transpire to 'wake people up' and make them see what's really important. I think of it in terms of the Tower card. There's no way that we can escape our collective karma, and the consequences of what we've done, and continue to do. All we can aspire to have control over is what we do now, and in the future.
In a lot of ways, as many of the replies have pointed out, this means going within and trying to gain an understanding of ourselves. It's good that the state of the world bothers you so much. You'll use that feeling to make conscious decisions in your life, so that you don't live a blind, selfish, egocentric existence (hopefully).
I don't think we should try to minimise the individual experience; in fact, it's odd that we do, because we elevate the individual narrative in almost every other realm except the spiritual. Magic teaches us that we are more than we think, that our influence goes beyond what we can perceive. That's what metta is based on too, the belief that individual emotion is more powerful than we imagine.
I have a feeling that Trump is only the beginning, that we have a long, difficult road ahead of us as a species.
ETA On a related note, here is a quote by Joseph Campbell:
Lots to think about in there.
ETA2 I came across another piece in the book I was reading, Phil Hine's Condensed Chaos:
re-pete-a
Just my two cents worth here...
We will all fall off the path...often...we're not saints...and your God knows it...
There's a biblical saying that I'll quote ...if you don't mind...Don't think I'm religious...It's just a quote ...
" Revenge is mine, sayeth the Lord...(I personally use LAW in place of Lord, but I am quoting the Book here)
There's a very ,very good reason for that...Leave it to the LAW to sort out and don't soil your hands ....There is more going on at many levels than just the bit in front of your eyes.
If you willingly travel that path it will consume you and draw you in ...dragging out any form of spirituality and drowning it in mental whirlpools of hatred...
Anything that is done along those lines or any other lines will return to it's maker or original source...
the same Laws apply to anything....they will always return.
They say the same about charity or gifts of love...
They will all return ...10 fold...
TO paint another picture...
Cherokee in origins...
There are two wolves within us all...
one white one , one black one...
Always, always fighting...
A young brave asked the elder which one wins eventually...?
The Elder replies...
THE ONE YOU FEED THE MOST...
be careful which one steals your attentions...
Apprentices usually always make mistakes...that's why there's a master craftsman overseeing the show...
We will all fall off the path...often...we're not saints...and your God knows it...
There's a biblical saying that I'll quote ...if you don't mind...Don't think I'm religious...It's just a quote ...
" Revenge is mine, sayeth the Lord...(I personally use LAW in place of Lord, but I am quoting the Book here)
There's a very ,very good reason for that...Leave it to the LAW to sort out and don't soil your hands ....There is more going on at many levels than just the bit in front of your eyes.
If you willingly travel that path it will consume you and draw you in ...dragging out any form of spirituality and drowning it in mental whirlpools of hatred...
Anything that is done along those lines or any other lines will return to it's maker or original source...
the same Laws apply to anything....they will always return.
They say the same about charity or gifts of love...
They will all return ...10 fold...
TO paint another picture...
Cherokee in origins...
There are two wolves within us all...
one white one , one black one...
Always, always fighting...
A young brave asked the elder which one wins eventually...?
The Elder replies...
THE ONE YOU FEED THE MOST...
be careful which one steals your attentions...
Apprentices usually always make mistakes...that's why there's a master craftsman overseeing the show...
fractalgranny
well, this has been a very interesting journey so far. thank you for going on it with me! so far it appears to me, on contemplation, that my greatest transgression was against the concept of free will, and the person who is affected the most is me. i am also very grateful that my learning "in the bones" (as opposed to understanding intellectually) that a curse, no matter how well--intentioned, is NEVER a good idea, has been under these relatively harmless circumstances. i also realized that what influenced me to make this bad decision was quite complex and strong. i was tired from a long hike, i have strong and complex positive feelings about the group queen (whose song was played), and very strong negative feelings about the politician in question. the latter are a mix of personal history, family history, spiritual and political convictions, etc etc etc.
@suk, the campbell quote .... lol, i JUST wrote an article about a similar topic (research on the differences and similarities between mystical and delusional experiences). how apt!
and
... yeah ... in my experience (working in a huge and therefore political organization) both are true. actually, i'm of the opinion that any big problem can only be solved if it is treated on multiple fronts.
and interesting that you would say "guilty." this is actually a great example of feeling guilty in a healthy way. guilt in the sense that i am aware that i have done something wrong and know that i need to make it right. i don't have that yukky gult feeling. thatnks for helping me realize this!
@re-pete-a no problem with biblical quotes. i've probably mentioned it, i am a christian-buddhist-pagan, so i'm happy with hearing bible references. what i'm hearing from your quote is that it is not my job to take revenge or anything of that sort.
and yes, because i'm not a saint, i will remain an apprentice always. and i love the wolf story - use it all the time!
thanks all!
@suk, the campbell quote .... lol, i JUST wrote an article about a similar topic (research on the differences and similarities between mystical and delusional experiences). how apt!
and
... yeah ... in my experience (working in a huge and therefore political organization) both are true. actually, i'm of the opinion that any big problem can only be solved if it is treated on multiple fronts.
and interesting that you would say "guilty." this is actually a great example of feeling guilty in a healthy way. guilt in the sense that i am aware that i have done something wrong and know that i need to make it right. i don't have that yukky gult feeling. thatnks for helping me realize this!
@re-pete-a no problem with biblical quotes. i've probably mentioned it, i am a christian-buddhist-pagan, so i'm happy with hearing bible references. what i'm hearing from your quote is that it is not my job to take revenge or anything of that sort.
and yes, because i'm not a saint, i will remain an apprentice always. and i love the wolf story - use it all the time!
thanks all!
suk
It's funny how stuff like that works!
I kind of meant it in a way that's like, what you did was quite understandable, so don't be too hard on yourself. I think it's very human to try to categorise things and actions into good and bad; you can't actually ever know what effect your actions have. That's not to say you're excused for eternity or you did a 'good' thing -- I'm just trying to say that there's more to it than that black and white kind of thinking.
I believe that in any spiritual practice, the focus should be on yourself, and how you can improve yourself and become better. That's why hexes are 'wrong', not because it's 'bad to curse others', but because it shifts the focus to what's outside of you. And it's not so much that that's wrong, it's just really unproductive and irrelevant.
Thanks again for starting this great thread.
fractalgranny
and that's what i meant - i don't feel i'm being hard on myself. i just want to set things right.
my take is probably a bit different - i want to focus both on myself and on others. richard rohr's "action and contemplation" https://cac.org/about-cac/missionvision/ is a good example of that in christian circles, or engaged buddhism http://www.huffingtonpost.com/matt-...l-network-of-engaged-buddhists_b_1728546.html or, as i mentioned, starhawk is a good example of that in the pagan world http://starhawk.org/about/biography/
i just did a little spread on this, the question being "what could can come out of it, and how can i start bringing it home?", using this beautiful new deck i got, the timeless tarot. i'm not sure yet what to make of it, so far, this is what i have -
---
3 dark-looking cards: the moon, five of pents, king of cups
something dreamlike in the subconscious that has something to do with giving to people who are forgotten by the “christian” majority (the faint words on the wall under which the children beg read "triumphant christianity" - can't help but see the word "trump" in there).
i can start by acting like a successful admiral. the admiral could have a connection with the moon – there are boats on the water in both cards.
the timeline looks like early evening, night, late afternoon. there’s about 20, 22 hours between the first and last card. for some reason that feels significant. it may not refer directly to days but to some sort of almost completed time cycle.
a phrase that comes to me: "listening to his intuition, the battle-savvy king of cups provides for the marginalized and forgotten."
.... there is something there but i can't quite catch it ... i think i'll sleep on it
thanks for continuing to engage in this topic!
Tanga
My comment presently - is in some traditions plastering a spell around publicly - diminishes it's power. And ahh - if I were waiting to see whether Trump would soon be my President I might be sorely tempted to devise some kind of spellwork myself. Lol.
Though I mostly slap my wrist against such ideas, and dwell more on the "self-development" and "good of all" stuff.
The anti EU vote on my side - seems to have given racists permission to speak louder about their beliefs around here. Hmn.
And it remains to be seen how the new cabinet will function now.
