Cavalier de Deniers - how may it be read?

Given the recent inclusion of this card in a threshing thread in the Let's Marseille area, I thought it was a perfect opportunity to also include it here...

Some of my comments are already in that thread.

For one, this Cavalier does not appear, to my eyes, to often depict a knight, but rather a horse rider - not necessarily the same thing!

As 'chevalier', this certainly has the ambiguity of either Knight or Horse-man.

I agree, jmd.

This figure doesn't strike me as a "knight" at all.

With the baton in hand and the denier out front, I see this figure as something like a "caddy" would be in golf.... a person who carries the trappings of the knight.

I feel as though both figure and horse are plodding along. the horse looks more like a work horse...heavier than those of the other Cavaliers.

I sense that wherever this figure is going is going to take a long time and one had best be patient.

The coin seems real because the figure seems to be "following it" with his/her eyes, yet the denier also seems to be unreal because it is floating in space....virtual money, funny money, not real yet....maybe like buying on credit.

Slow but steady wins the race. This person will eventually succeed...keep your eye on the money, but one must be willing to wait.

terri

The horse looks far too small for the Knight in this card, like he is riding a farm horse or perhaps a merry-go-round horse:

Cavalier's Horse?

The fact that the horse as well as rider do not look like they are ready for action is to remind us of the other qualities that a Knight has to have. There seems to be slow progress made by the Knight, perhaps his task is not one that involves haste but patience. We tend to think of a Knight as being a man-at-arms, but not all Knights are at the ready for combat, they also hold a position of trust.

So, I think this could be read as loyalty, patience, taking stock, slow actions and trust.

jmd said:

As 'chevalier', this certainly has the ambiguity of either Knight or Horse-man.

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To my ears, a "chevalier" must be considered a "knight" - and a member of the nobility; whereas a "cavalier" could be merely a miltary horseman. However, I can't find anything to prove this there is this distinction! and I notice, jmd, that you and Diana have discussed this point earlier in this ancient thread and seem to have disagreed * Marseille - Chevalier de Deniers (Knight of Coins)

True - a "knight" is also a "military horseman", however, the word "knight" carries within it a medieval backdrop, of swooning maidens with pointed cone hats, and jousting matches.

Although etymologically, yes cavalier and chevalier come from the same latin word, they were borrowed at different times, and hence have different historical contexts.

There are many examples in French, where the same latin word has been borrowed and frenchified, and then the original latin reborrowed later, so you end up with the same latin word in two different stages of phonetic decay. An oft-cited example is "paysan" (peasant) and "païën" (pagan) - both come from "paganus" (country dweller) -- païen would be an earlier borrowing, and therefore much more mutated phonetically. (In the evolution they also came to have different meanings).

According to: this website, the word "cavalier" represents a Renaissance era borrowing from Italian, whereas "Chevalier" is the "native" word. Translating and quoting:

" The invasion of italian words in the 16th century is closely tied to the Renaissance and the admiration which cultural leaders had for the Renaissance in Italy. Italy's important role in economy and culture is comparable to that of the USA and of English in our times. Camp, cavalier, campagne, and cadence are immigrants [into French], compared to the native [French] words champ, chevalier, champagne and chance"

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I agree with the thoughts of others that this Cavalier does not look like a horseman, and I wonder why he is carrying the baton whilst the denier hovers in the air before him. His eyes are on the ball, to coin a phrase..

This Cavalier, like the rest of the Deniers, seem to me to be different in some ways.

I think he would do anything for his master the Roy: keep his eyes on the game and the ball, wield a big stick if necessary. The horse is incidental to this guy, who would find a way of doing what he needs to do, no matter what.

Moongold said:

I agree with the thoughts of others that this Cavalier does not look like a horseman, and I wonder why he is carrying the baton whilst the denier hovers in the air before him. His eyes are on the ball, to coin a phrase..

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Maybe the rider is playing a polo version of baseball and is at bat.

Seriously, though, in _Cahiers du tarot_, Bocher speculates that, because the rider carries a club in his hand, the rider is a chevalier rather than a cavalier.

As for the Denier in the air, Bocher, based on the imagery of the 1760 Conver deck, speculates that that it's a sun.

"It's surely a sun as one can verify by counting the little flowers of the denier. There are twelve of them, like the months, lilke the signs of the zodiac, like the hours of the half-day. In the centre [of the denier] is the Earth, represented by its four elements." [i.e., there are four balls that comprise the centre. But I note that there's also a small ball in the very centre - the fifth element, Quintessence?]

Rusty Neon said:

Maybe the rider is playing a polo version of baseball and is at bat.

Seriously, though, in _Cahiers du tarot_, Bocher speculates that, because the rider carries a club in his hand, the rider is a chevalier rather than a cavalier.

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drat... I should have hoped it would be the other way round.

Moongold said:

I agree with the thoughts of others that this Cavalier does not look like a horseman, and I wonder why he is carrying the baton whilst the denier hovers in the air before him. His eyes are on the ball, to coin a phrase..

This Cavalier, like the rest of the Deniers, seem to me to be different in some ways.

Click to expand...

I think, rather, that he looks like a horseman, not a knight. (I think that is what was said above, Moongold). Objectively he is a horseman since he is on a horse - or rather, a pony . Nothing knightly about him at all, he looks more like a merchant. I don't see him serving a Roy, or at least not on a day-to-day basis. He could be one of those merchants or charge-owners in the Middle Ages who were used to carry out state duties whilst they were journeying because of their extensive business travelling and large networks (e.g. Chaucer the poet, who travelled a lot as a customs charge-owner, and whom the Crown often used on spying and despatching duties in France and Italy).

Why does everyone say his eyes are on the denier in the sky? To my eyes he is ignoring it and his fixing the road. The denier is to his left but his face is turned slightly towards us, with the eyes slightly to the left, therefore in the axis of the road. Even if he were to glance left, such a glance could only take in a side look of the denier in the sky (try it yourself with an object at your left shoulder). This says to me he is not at all fixated on his denier, it is so much part of his world, he doesn't need to - it illuminates the countryside. Why is it in the sky? Coins don't normally float in the sky. I suggest it is because he has achieved the "spiritualisation of matter" - that difficult integration - in his workaday unfussy fashion. He has learnt the spiritual lessons of the deniers.

In a reading this might suggest to me the progression (in a job, or in business, in life) of someone who has fully integrated the spiritual dimension of work; an ethical investment; the pursuit of a dream using one's hard-earned cash. Like Moonbow I see a notion of trust - so it might be about trusting one's capacities, or trusting someone else (in business or other work). He is someone I meditate on when I need to get humdrum things out of the way in order to free myself for more creative or spiritual pursuits. His skill lies in taking care of the ordinary so that he - or others - may then give time to explore the world (the outer and inner world, the world of the arts, or of sport, etc.).

I also added in Silvia's reading (in my comments to jmd) that to me the notion of "horseman" suggests engaging closely with an animal, and therefore with one's own instinctive nature. Of all the suits, coins are closest to nature - and to what makes us. I see this Cavalier as a call to be more aware of one's instinctual nature, of using it in the pursuit of one's goals; of being aware of the trappings of over-civilisation and over-materialisation. For this Cavalier has come full circle in the deniers, and sees the needless accumulation of always more material possessions and comfort for what they are: illusions and emptiness. See - of all the Honneurs, he is the one that owns the least - his good but plain clothes, his pony, his club.

from the Guru Meditation Club:

"réussite financière, des projets matériels se concrétisent"

Peu sensible aux émotions et aux sentiments amoureux,
ce cavalier garde la tête sur les épaules. Il atteint ses buts
grâce à sa patience et à sa grande prudence.

*

"financial success, of the material projects are concretized"

Not very sensitive to the emotions and the feelings in love,
this rider keeps the head on the shoulders. It achieves its
goals thanks to its patience and to its great prudence.

Helvetica said:

I think, rather, that he looks like a horseman, not a knight. (I think that is what was said above, Moongold). Objectively he is a horseman since he is on a horse - or rather, a pony . Nothing knightly about him at all, he looks more like a merchant.

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Yes! That is what I intended, but it certainly is not what I said. My apologies.