Planet Series: JUPITER in relationship to MERCURY

Well my natal Jupiter and Mercury are extremely close ...... both in Virgo, House 10 ...... Mercury at 08-12 and Jupiter at 11-57, just over 3 degrees between them!!! So this obviously puts Mercury slightly behind which I take to be:

dadsnook2000 said:

** PROPHET PHASE; Mercury is 315 to 359 degrees ahead of Jupiter.
Here we have the social visionary, one who talks of the future, attempts to get others to prepare for change. This person may be "trendy" as a way to show others how to change, or how he/she is changing. There could be a form of duality here, saying one thing, doing another thing. "This is what you should do, this is what I'll do". But, change is on this person's mind. The question is, "What will change, who will change, how will change occur"? I think this phase represents a true visionary, but not necessarily an accurate forecaster.

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And being in House 10 ..... would take this to be looking for change in a responsible way .... especially since both in Virgo ...... analytical, practical ..... possibly too much but definitely attending to detail, listing everything

What I find interesting is that Virgo rules my 11th House ....... how we relate to society, friends, acquaintances, those we learn from and teach ...... so feel that this would indicate a willingness to help those close to us *change* and find a way of implementing such.

Trying to tie in the progressed chart which would be where I am *at* today, Jupiter is still in Virgo at 20-04 whilst Mercury has moved ahead to Libra at 28-33 which I would take to be Mercury ahead of Jupiter by 58 degrees, thereby moving into:

dadsnook2000 said:

** WORKER PHASE; Mercury is 45 to 90 degrees ahead of Jupiter.
Those with this phase relationship tend to struggle in their efforts to find a new or more effective form of expression. This can range from overcoming a speech impediment, to learning how to speak with others in your social circle so that they will listen to you, to finding ways to reach out and touch others. As a career, this could relate to marketing, sales, any public contact where personal outreach and contact is important.

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and with Jupiter in House 9 and Mercury in House 11 would take this to mean trying to push through with the self-growth and study whilst looking for balance, most especially with close circle ..... interesting too that I have today started giving reiki to others with surprising results ...... and ....... have over the last couple of days even received phone calls and requests for advice from not only those close to me, but someone who I haven't seen or spoken to in nearly a year!!!

Perhaps I'm trying to go too in-depth too quickly though, especially since I can't work out what the major aspects (blue and red lines) are at the moment on the astro progressed graph (I think there's a sextile with my progressed Scorpio moon).

For huredriel

A nicely thought out summary of your natal and progressed phase relationship. I'm so pleased to see so many on the list moving forward in their understanding and methods of synthesizing astrological meanings. Truly, this is good stuff.

If I may add a note here for everyone: Remember what this is all about. We are seeking to accomplish two primary things in this Planet Series.

First, we are learning about how to apply planetary meanings to real world expression. In doing this we have trod relatively untrod ground by looking at relationships between planets where no aspectual relationship may exist. In doing this we are finding explicit meaning, helpful meaning, understandable meaning. We are seeing the chart as a complexity of simple relationships which can be taken one at a time. And as we do this, some of us quickly catching on to the fact that if someone asks about love, we can look at Sun-Moon and Mars-Venus and find useful answers -- we don't have to look at everything just to answer something. Isn't that great?!

Second, we are learning that there are several shortcuts that enable us in many cases to grasp the essential issues that make up each of us. So far, we have explored four of the six shortcuts: Sun-Moon, Saturn-Moon, Mars-Venus and Jupiter-Mercury. These tell us about our basic personality and mode of operating in this life, our conditioning due to family and early childhood plus our manner of breaking free of wrong conditioning, our passion and poise relating to our sexuality and creative expressions, and our ability and manner of communicating within our various social structures. Along with this we have seen that we can summarize each of these key shortcuts into a simple phrase or single sentance. Combining these sentances gives us a type of portrait of the person -- seeing this portrait, we can then go onward and add all kinds of detail, but only the detail that is relevant.

With these tools we can help others, we can help ourselves, we can practice astrology and practice it well. We need no astrobabble. We can apply real living experiences thru our sharing, we learn, we grow. I can't tell you all how much I have learned thru this sharing process. Thank you, everyone. Dave

PS. The Planet Series has a long way to go yet.

For GoddessArtemis

You said, "My Mercury is in Aries at 03°24'09, and my Jupiter is in Capricorn at 04°53'19. How do you do the math?"

Following the zodiac sequence, we start at Capricorn, then Aquarius, Pisces, and finally Aries.
** From 4-53-19 Cap., there is 25-06-41 degrees remaining in Capricorn.
** We have a full 30 degrees in Aquarius and in Pisces, 60 degrees in all.
** We have 3-24-09 degrees to reach Mercury.
So, we just add them all up.
...25-06-41
...30
...30
...03-24-09
...---------
...88-30-50 is the difference
This is within an orb of the 90 degree square, which is why we can treat is as either a combination of two phases or just as the Activist phase. Dave

I thought to mention, my girlfriend once told me I should be a politician. I said no way. I tend to rant on things, but to lower myself to politician status is unthinkable.

dadsnook2000 said:

Actually your Mercury has not caught up with Jupiter -- being behind Jupiter and not ahead -- so you are in the CHANGER Phase. You obviously are not exhibiting those qualities so we have to ask "Why?" and we have to understand your comments also.

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You know at first I thought I was in Changer but it didn't resonate with me so I wrongly assumed Worker. I have to remember to start from the point of the slower planet to the quicker one.

You have a tight grouping of Sun, Moon, Mercury at the MC angle. While the Moon being 0 to 45 degrees ahead of the Sun is supposedly the PERFORMER Phase we have to note that a conjunction of the Sun and Moon puts the Moon in the dark. How are emotions to be expressed relative to the personality, the ego, the will? These people are often very quiet and shy when young. This despite all of this stuff being at the MC. Mercury is also right in the middle of this, trying to understand what to think, what to say, what to feel. There is no perspective relative to the other personal and social planets. What persective there is consists of the square to Pluto -- harshness, feeling as if a bit player in a power struggle -- and an inconjunct to Mars -- if only you knew (then) what to say or do (give me a clue, please) -- a general opposition to Neptune -- a problem, what problem, what solution?
We can look at all of this another way, also. The Sun, Moon, Mercury is at one end of the 4th-10th house axis, Neptune at the other end. It is quite possible that one parent, when you were younger, had to play the role of being both parents and the signals got mixed up or short cut due to a lack of time for sharing in the early homelife. The other parent was present but also missing in some way. All of this is one way to interpret these patterns, there are other kinder and alternate expressions as well. But, when you talk of a child feeling that she is "placed into an uncaring learning situation, and sees no need to communicate, and still carries some degree of that conditioning", then we should explore the early home life. You don't need to do so in this public setting, you can just become aware of it as part of your astrological training and learn from it.

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All you have said is spot on and it is making me think of details I underestimated or totally forgot.
It is good that I remember how all these early experiences have continued in different circumstances. I will be thinking about this for a good long time.
I looked at my progressed chart and found my Mercury is presently 19 degrees Cancer and my Jupiter is 4 degrees Leo, so Mercury has not caught up to Jupiter still.

dadsnook2000 said:

** PROPHET PHASE; Mercury is 315 to 359 degrees ahead of Jupiter.
Here we have the social visionary, one who talks of the future, attempts to get others to prepare for change. This person may be "trendy" as a way to show others how to change, or how he/she is changing. There could be a form of duality here, saying one thing, doing another thing. "This is what you should do, this is what I'll do". But, change is on this person's mind. The question is, "What will change, who will change, how will change occur"? I think this phase represents a true visionary, but not necessarily an accurate forecaster.

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I agree with "change is on the person's mind" very much. I am not a visionary but am interested in becoming a different person than the one I am today. Taking an even closer view of my past behaviors and events seems like a good place to look. In any case it seems I'm being taken there(my past) in one form or another for closer inspection.
Thank you for correcting me once again Dave.
Squeakmo9

For stardancer

A politician? No way, Saturn isn't on an angle. Although your Mercury is, and the Sun is nearby in the first house. Perhaps a press manager or spokesperson. But, a public servant (or public thief may be more appropriate these days) is not for most Libra's. Dave

dadsnook2000 said:

A politician? No way, Saturn isn't on an angle. Although your Mercury is, and the Sun is nearby in the first house. Perhaps a press manager or spokesperson. But, a public servant (or public thief may be more appropriate these days) is not for most Libra's. Dave

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Amen, lol.

Does politicking show up in charts as Saturn? I guess I always see them as anything but a servant. Didn't Nixon have a Sun/Neptune opposition, the 4th to the 10th? And A Mercury/Mars/Jupiter conjunction on the 4th cusp? His Mercury is way ahead of Jupiter.

** PROPHET PHASE; Mercury is 315 to 359 degrees ahead of Jupiter.
Here we have the social visionary, one who talks of the future, attempts to get others to prepare for change. This person may be "trendy" as a way to show others how to change, or how he/she is changing. There could be a form of duality here, saying one thing, doing another thing. "This is what you should do, this is what I'll do". But, change is on this person's mind. The question is, "What will change, who will change, how will change occur"? I think this phase represents a true visionary, but not necessarily an accurate forecaster.



I guess I've been occupied elsewhere. My Mercury is conjunct the first house 21 degrees ahead of a twelfth house Jupiter. Maybe Robin Hood is more my style.

dadsnook2000 said:

You said, "My Mercury is in Aries at 03°24'09, and my Jupiter is in Capricorn at 04°53'19. How do you do the math?"

Following the zodiac sequence, we start at Capricorn, then Aquarius, Pisces, and finally Aries.
** From 4-53-19 Cap., there is 25-06-41 degrees remaining in Capricorn.
** We have a full 30 degrees in Aquarius and in Pisces, 60 degrees in all.
** We have 3-24-09 degrees to reach Mercury.
So, we just add them all up.
...25-06-41
...30
...30
...03-24-09
...---------
...88-30-50 is the difference
This is within an orb of the 90 degree square, which is why we can treat is as either a combination of two phases or just as the Activist phase. Dave

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Dave,

You know what strange thing I just noticed? The person I'm romantically interested in has the following combo of planets:

Jupiter in Aries, at 14°47'37
Mercury in Capricorn, at 02°25'29

versus mine:

Jupiter in Capricorn, at 04°53'19
Mercury in Aries, at 03°24'09

We have opposite planets!! How odd that I never noticed this until now...

Okay, I'm going to take a crack at doing the math, but just eyeballing it and knowing I have to go almost full circle around the zodiac sequence to figure this one out, I'll say she may fall into the "Believer" phase, which makes me wonder if that's true at all...we'll see (once I do the math--which I dislike doing!).

As for my planets...I'd say I'm probably more in the Activist phase; the Worker phase seems not to apply to me, as I often have a lot to say and will make sure it's heard--not too loudly, but assertively!

Thanks for the math equation--I'm so bad at it, but I'll figure it out yet!

GA

Calculations

After awhile you can do these calculations very quickly. For instance, I often take one planet -- it can be the one ahead or the one behind the other -- and its position by degree and just leapfrog from that degree to the same one in the next sign and the next sign, etc., and then just add or subtract visually the remainder. Simple to do, hard to explain clearly, I guess. For complex stuff, I use a type of calculator that may not be available on the market any longer. Its called a "sexigesimal" calculator. It can work with degrees-minutes-seconds or hours-minutes-seconds and it converts to/from decimals. If doing accurate charts by hand, I can calculate time conversions, longitudinal equivalents, equation of time, RAMC, and all that stuff in half a minute or so.

Its too bad these are no longer on the market. You can do the same thing with the new scientific calculators but all of those special buttons, functions and terms are both confusing and intimidating. My calculator is a Canon B-T but friends have tried to contact Canon and received a reply that they have no idea what she is talking about. I had purchased mine back in 1978, so I can see how they have lost track of a specialty item like this. Dave