Books vs. No books

gregory

Zombina said:
I like to thumb through books and see what advice the author has to give about tarot in general and/or interpretations, different spreads, etc.

I find that it's good to have a basic idea of what the cards mean, and then go by what you see in the card. From what I have read, many suggest that if you look at the card and come up with a meaning before reading its definition, and the two end up being completely different, that you should go with what your instinct was to begin with. Book or online definitions are simple guidelines to help you understand what the generalized meaning behind the cards are, and it's helpful as a beginner to learn them, but I believe that along with a general idea of the card's meaning, you should examine it on your own, and try to figure out how the card makes you feel and what you see in it.

I recently purchased Tarot Plain and Simple by Anthony Louis. I really like how he set up the definitions in the book. He shows a picture of the card, gives a quick phrase or sentence for a definition, gives some key words or phrases that represent the card, lists some advice or a situation that relates to the card, and finally, he adds a list of people that can represent the card. As a beginner myself, this helps me to memorize the basic definitions, and get an understanding of situations in where the card can apply and how it does so.
But some people (like me) don't memorise "meanings" at all. Don't even USE them.... We are the glorps ! and when the meanings sort of sneak in sideways they can feel very intrusive and actually impede what we had seen in the first place....
 

Eco74

Another aspect of this is that it's not the same thing to "read books" as it is to "memorise meanings".

I've read plenty of books and would find it very difficult to recall quotes or even define where certain quotes are taken from even when I've read a book more than once.
To me, what I've read gets taken into my head, incorporates with my mind, but not in a literal way.

I think it might be because I've read too many books to be able to take them entierly seriously. But I have learned from them, not just about the world, about different ways of looking at things and about the facts that some books present - or books sometimes present if you'd rather see it from that perspective.

On the whole though, for me, reading books has been (and continues to be) a bit of an adventure. Not to find out "the true meaning of things" but to see how things can be viewed, turned and angled differently.
 

Grizabella

Eco74 said:
Another aspect of this is that it's not the same thing to "read books" as it is to "memorise meanings".

I've read plenty of books and would find it very difficult to recall quotes or even define where certain quotes are taken from even when I've read a book more than once.
To me, what I've read gets taken into my head, incorporates with my mind, but not in a literal way.

I think it might be because I've read too many books to be able to take them entierly seriously. But I have learned from them, not just about the world, about different ways of looking at things and about the facts that some books present - or books sometimes present if you'd rather see it from that perspective.

On the whole though, for me, reading books has been (and continues to be) a bit of an adventure. Not to find out "the true meaning of things" but to see how things can be viewed, turned and angled differently.

Extremely well said! The best yet, in my opinion, for explaining what books are really useful for and what their place should be. :) You said it very concisely and clearly.
 

Master_Margarita

For those who have studied formal logic:

Studying the books is necessary, but not sufficient.

I find it very helpful to study the companion books of different decks and see how different artists interpret the "meaning" of a particular card. I suppose this is a comparative deck study or something highfalutin' like that. Compare, for example, one card as it is represented in the Victorian Romantic, Buddha Tarot, and Osho Zen. You can learn a lot that way.

I've yet to find a book that is particularly helpful, however, in explaining the process of taking the "basic" card meanings and applying them to positions within the spread, and explaining how the other cards in the spread affect the reading. Robert Place does this a little bit in the back of his companion books. Umbrae's posts explain the process as well as anything. Firemaiden's recent exchange thread shows this in action; so do thorhammer's readings. Sorry if I've slighted anyone; those are just recent examples I can think of off the top of my head.

:heart: M_M~
 

Splungeman

Y'know...for some reason, almost every single sitter I've had (so far) has asked me about specific symbols in the cards and where they come from. Maybe it's just around these parts folks are particular about such things. :)
 

Scion

:)

I'm from Texas myself... I think it might be Texan tenacity. :D Folks down there always want to know what's what and how it got that way. And if they're nervous about "occult" stuff, it maybe they're reassuring themselves that nothing nefarious is at work. In those cases it's especially useful to have the facts at your fingertips.

Again, this is where doing a little research can go a long way. Often when a sitter asks about a symbol, I feel like they're trying to ask another question and a symbol is just a concrete focus for something less tangible. A sitter pointing at the winged lion in the Waite-Smith two of cups is letting me know where I should pay attention. And if I've done my homework, I know certain things about the gnostic (thence Mithraic/Zoroastrian) origins of the symbol and what it could mean in the spread. It doesn't mean it runcates my intuition;in the best of all possible worlds it works with my intuition like two halves of an oyster producing a pearl.

Of course it's possible that I could just look at a red winged lion's head and stab in the dark and hit something meaningful. But for the record: that stab is not intuition, because I'm looking at an image, which is sensory input, looking for meaning in it, which engages my reason, which by definition prohibits intuition.

Splunge, this is where I think following your own sense of what interests you can be enormously helpful. Too many peole approach "study" as if its something hideous and grinding: the foul harvest of a crappy educational experience. As with anything, easing into it, and following your instincts will uncover useful, meaningful information for each time you read.

Every time I see a winged lion, I don't need to dredge up what I know about Aeon, but there are times when it's been startlingly useful to be able to have a conversation about the layers of a symbol with a querent, because of the spark created when two minds intersect at a symbol. Those have been some of my richest and most uncanny readings.

Gregory said earlier that the books that have taught her most aren't necesarily Tarot books, but the process of study is something that enriches everything... not study of Tarot, but study, full stop. I don't think anyone in good conscience could equate regurgitating canned keywords with a reading, any more than making up things wholesale without any knowledge of the cards. As Master_margarita points out, the difficulty is infusing these two capacities in a meaningful way. We all do it differently. Gregory said it best: "Intuition is bloody hard work." Whatever helps each of us train that "muscle" is precious and prized.

It's like learning how to tell a joke or create suspense in a story or how to kiss well. And I think that's Umbrae's point: you learn by doing. Which then begs the question: doing what? :D There are as many answers to that as there are readers...

Scion
 

Eco74

There's a theory stating that sometimes we get the kinds of readings we need in order to progress in our learning.

Some have gotten mainly relationship-related readings when they've been in need of some guidance on the subject, and others getting business-related readings when they've been considering buisiness oportunities.

Maybe it's one of those universal hints being gently tossed in your direction. ;)
 

Umbrae

Ya know I’ve said this before (it always gets lost so I’ll do reruns, besides – the writers are on strike (LOL))…if Tarot is the whatever we say it is, oh so magical or the toast from the cosmic toaster just popped and steaming…

So we’re sitting there reading for Joe Public from Mizsippy in his seed hat and he looks down, takes a big swaller from ‘is glass of Stump-Phrog Ale, and sez, “Lookie there, a wing-ed lion, wat’s that there wing-ed lion there for?”

Well see, if you gots two brain cells you can rub together and create thought, you’d head off to the library and find out about the winged lion. And learn. They may learn NOT by reading a book on Tarot, but a book on Mithraism or Zoroasterism. Or something completely differnt.

They may learn from completely surprising methods! They may make connections never made by studying ‘Tarot books’!

Curiosity leads to learning.

On the other hand, if you learn by reading all them there books first, without the spark of curiosity…it’s not the same (TO ME).

I like to itch first, then scratch.

Now one may read tarot for years before they begin itchin’…but sooner or later they’ll itch.

And that’s why I say – start with the Tarot. Play with it, read with it – enjoy the journey – and pay attention to the path it leads you on.
 

Scion

Itch then scratch...

Scratch then itch...

Umbrae you may have summed this entire discussion up in 6 words. :thumbsup:
 

gregory

Me for itch first then scratch.

And also for a bit of antihistamine at time (this is called preventive reading...)