Noblet Le Fov- "the walker" -- idiot Buddha?

[mac22]

Ok I've been ruminating on Le Fov.... Is he merely a hobo, homeless, outcast? A madman? A wise fool? Is he on a piligramage or just returned? Has he just completed his cycle thru the Atouts or just begun? Is he Christ's "Everyman?" An outcast excommunicated sinner or just an unrepentant old Pagan?

Then we have the LWB that calls him an "idiot Buddha" and calls the animal with him a cat.... which is just about to scratch his penis or is THAT the penis that ends up in the Juggler's hand [ouch]! Is this where the Le Batelevr gets his energy...fecundity from Le Fov's penis? Is Le Fov now a eunuch because he has no need of fecundity? Has he Spiritualized all his energies?

If it is a cat then why do other decks show a dog?

In his bundle.... His soul, the elements on the Le Batelevr's table [..and thus the seeds to the suits, hence the entire deck], or merely his dirty laundry??

And what about the plants? Are those blue & gold?... and thus healing - understanding awareness & transformation?

Your thoughts??




Mac22

 

[jmd]

For some reason, your post calls to mind a much earlier thread titled 'The Fool and his Spoon'.

If he had just returned from a pilgrimage, I would personally expect that some item of symbolic significance be included in the depiction - yet I see none (not that all pilgrimages had the equivalent of the obvious emblem that those walking to Santiago de Compostella had).

Personally, I also tend to not see any of the trumps as themselves having or undertaking a "cycle through the trumps". Rather, I prefer to consider each trump as equivalent to a village on a vast map.

We can certainly consider ourselves travelling from village to village, but any of the trumps, I am increasingly hesitant about. Of course, this does not prevent us from considering each trump or atout 'meeting' any and all of the others... or even becoming any of the others.

Also, (geez - I seem to be in a dis-agreeable mood - and yet do not 'disagree' as such!), the 'wand' of the Bateleur, though it can be seen as penis, need not be so - especially in light of the image detail that suggests that part of the woodblock is likely damaged - though it could be argued that this only foreshortened the held member!

I like the idea of the 'idiot Buddha' - or 'mad Buddha' - and can also think of important similar concepts that aptly fits - the 'madness' seems both very divine as well as very earthly... to me at least.

 

[stella01904]

Ok I've been ruminating on Le Fov.... Is he merely a hobo, homeless, outcast? A madman? A wise fool? Is he on a piligramage or just returned? Has he just completed his cycle thru the Atouts or just begun? Is he Christ's "Everyman?" An outcast excommunicated sinner or just an unrepentant old Pagan?

I'd say all of those, lol. I think Jodo called him a "sacred tramp."

Then we have the LWB that calls him an "idiot Buddha"

That's almost a Zen koan in itself...

and calls the animal with him a cat.... which is just about to scratch his penis or is THAT the penis that ends up in the Juggler's hand [ouch]! Is this where the Le Batelevr gets his energy...fecundity from Le Fov's penis? Is Le Fov now a eunuch because he has no need of fecundity? Has he Spiritualized all his energies?

If it is a cat then why do other decks show a dog?

Maybe because the cardmakers were male and really creeped out by the idea of a cat clawing at THAT dangling obect?

In his bundle.... His soul, the elements on the Le Batelevr's table [..and thus the seeds to the suits, hence the entire deck], or merely his dirty laundry??

In a reading I like to think of it as taking something from the card he's leaving behind and bringing whatever it is to the card he's approaching.

Other than that, it's up for grabs.

 

[mac22]

For some reason, your post calls to mind a much earlier thread titled 'The Fool and his Spoon'.

If he had just returned from a pilgrimage, I would personally expect that some item of symbolic significance be included in the depiction - yet I see none (not that all pilgrimages had the equivalent of the obvious emblem that those walking to Santiago de Compostella had).

I totally agree -- but then Le Fov may not BE Christian. He might be an old Pagan.

While it's true he has no spoon ....but he does have his bauble on his walking staff...

Personally, I also tend to not see any of the trumps as themselves having or undertaking a "cycle through the trumps". Rather, I prefer to consider each trump as equivalent to a village on a vast map.

I like that map idea.

We can certainly consider ourselves travelling from village to village, but any of the trumps, I am increasingly hesitant about. Of course, this does not prevent us from considering each trump or atout 'meeting' any and all of the others... or even becoming any of the others.

So Atouts can morph into others?

Also, (geez - I seem to be in a dis-agreeable mood - and yet do not 'disagree' as such!), the 'wand' of the Bateleur, though it can be seen as penis, need not be so - especially in light of the image detail that suggests that part of the woodblock is likely damaged - though it could be argued that this only foreshortened the held member!

So you see it as a mere wand?

I like the idea of the 'idiot Buddha' - or 'mad Buddha' - and can also think of important similar concepts that aptly fits - the 'madness' seems both very divine as well as very earthly... to me at least.

I'm familiar with the 'idiot Buddha' concept just never applied that concept to Le Fov.

Mac22

 

[mac22]

I'd say all of those, lol. I think Jodo called him a "sacred tramp."
That's almost a Zen koan in itself...

It could be.

Maybe because the cardmakers were male and really creeped out by the idea of a cat clawing at THAT dangling obect?

That's possible.

In a reading I like to think of it as taking something from the card he's leaving behind and bringing whatever it is to the card he's approaching.

Interesting idea. Hmm so a magpie, ordinary thief or back to 'fool'?

Other than that, it's up for grabs.

As I'm finding out.

Mac22

 

[Abrac]

The exposed genitalia, while being a bit amusing, is also an important symbolic element; it represents his vulnerability. It also represents his shamelessness. Whoever he is, and whatever he is doing, he is clearly outside of conventional society.

 

[stella01904]

Interesting idea. Hmm so a magpie, ordinary thief or back to 'fool'?

All alone, I think of him as neutral. No agenda, just a big catalyst.
He just goes. Maybe "emptiness" with an upper- or lowercase "e", take your pick. IMHO, it's limiting to lock him into one or the other.

 

[mac22]

The exposed genitalia, while being a bit amusing, is also an important symbolic element; it represents his vulnerability. It also represents his shamelessness. Whoever he is, and whatever he is doing, he is clearly outside of conventional society.

Oh that is clearly evident, his demeanor, his vagabond lifestyle.. his ragged, unkempt clothing. Even in 2007 the gangster rapper wannabes wouldn't let their drawers drop that low...

Mac22

 

[mac22]

All alone, I think of him as neutral. No agenda, just a big catalyst.
He just goes. Maybe "emptiness" with an upper- or lowercase "e", take your pick. IMHO, it's limiting to lock him into one or the other.

Oh I agree completely. He by his nature is outside & beyond the other Atouts even though he is an influence on any or all of them.

mac22

 

[mac22]

More meditation -- I suppose he can be Heyokah. By "mirroring" all of our doubts, fears, hatreds, weaknesses, etc. Heyokah forces us to examine what we really are. "This is who we were - this where we've been - this is who we are......"

Your thoughts?

Mac22