Past Lives

schaea

Hi everyone,

Now, I know a similar question has been asked here before, but I found that it didn't satisfy my question. I recently got a question from an online querrant (via email) asking for insight into their past lives. Their exact question was this, "What were some of my past lives like and how did they affect my current life?"

My first question is, can this question be answered by tarot, and if so, how?

And if not, is there some other way that it can be answered. I've ventured into MY past lives through certain meditations, but would it work for someone else. Would I have to visualize being that person, as if I were her (if you made sense of that last sentence, you must be a lot more awake that I am :) ).

Ok, that's it, and I thank you all for your help in advance.

Regards,
Andrew.
 

Kiama

Although I find that Tarot readers only talk about your past lives in a reading to waste time and therefore your money, I do feel that if a querent actually asks for a past life reading it can be useful for finding out what you still need to learn.

What you could do is throw some cards representing what the querent learned in a past life (Sorry, I don't know if you can actually tell a querent what their past life was just by looking a the cards. My boyfriend's mother went to a Tarot reader, who spent ages telling her about a past life as firstly, and African princess, then an Eqyptian priest, a slave, etc. Why is it, when you go for a past life reading, you were never a normal labourer, or a house wife, or a seamstress or something? What is it with African princesses? I now know about three people who were African princes or princesses once!) Rambling. Sorry. But I do think you can find out what you learned in a past life, and what that has taught you in this life, and then what you need to learn in this life in order to progress...

There is a good reading for this in the 2001 Tarot Calender, published by Llewellyn...

Hope this helps some.

Kiama
 

tiger lily

I have one problem with past lives: time. You know, in every new age book we?re told that time is actually an illusion and that in reality, there is no time - or all times are now... and we create past, present and future in our mind.

So, suppose after my death I find myself on the other side where I realize that there is actually no time. That means that from this meta-plane I can have access to every era on this physical plane, right? So, my last incarnation could be in 2455 and now I?m here in 2001, my next incarnation could be in the Bronze age.

Now I wonder why in all those regression sessions you seem to progress by the timline in your history book? First you are someone in Old Egypt, the Rome, then the Middle Ages....

And, if there is no time at all, no before and after, how does your soul "develop"? How can you first be not enlightened and then "reach" (which involves movement, hence time) enlightenment?

Sorry, this has nothing to do with your question... but it?s bugging me for some time now.
 

Melvis

Wow! Excellent comments, tigerlily! :)

I agree with the idea that too many people focus solely on a linear idea of time...that one point in time can ONLY follow another point and thus we are slaves to this progression of moments.

...<>...

I think some people have a cribbage board view of their soul's journey through the cosmos. You can only move your pegs in one direction. Occasionally you'll pass by what went before, or maybe even go over the same route again, but once you've passed it, it's gone. I'd like to think of our lives more like chinese checkers. You can go forward, sideways, backward, any direction you want. You can even get stuck going around in circles (which some of us do! ;) )

So when a querent asks about past lives it might be more helpful to rephrase the question so it refers to their "soul's journey", or something like that; a concept that's less tied to time than to where this person's 'essense' has been (and is going).

Peace,

Melvis








MeeWah
01 Sep 2001

Tigerlily: There was a discussion on this many moons ago; I wish it was still available!!
In our finite & linear reality, I can see the timeline as a necessary & a convenient device for points of reference. There is a natural progression to things, or things occur in some order. Theoretically (for lack of a better term) & for purposes of understanding the implications of multiple incarnations or Karma, it does not seem to make sense to go thither & yon nor jump back & forth through time & space as it creates confusion. In order to understand the development or maturation of an individual, it helps to look at it as from Point A to Point B, & so on.
BTW: In Spirit, there is also no space, which would explain how readings at a distance can be done.
In terms of seeing a person's "history", perhaps it is like a wheel, with the center of the wheel the nucleus/soul & the various spokes radiating from the center, the lives. After each lifetime, the entity returns to its source or point of origin from whence it may venture forth again.
10-The Wheel of Fortune does not merely pertain to a stage or a particular phase of one's life. It is The Wheel of Life & also refers to the Wheel of Karma; cause & effect, action & reaction.
Melvis: That is a very interesting analogy, that of the Chinese Checkers.
It reminds me of a dream from years ago. My then hubby & I were standing next to each other on round white "stepping stones" that bore numbers. Sometimes we had to step around each other to get to a place. Sometimes we were near each other or in view of each other; other times we lost sight of each other.








Melvis
01 Sep 2001

Meewah, I think I'll hop my little blue chinese checker marble over to your Wheel of Karma...it makes more sense than my scatterbrained checkerboard! I guess that's me, jumping all over the place...

You know, that could be a new Spread, just as you've described it -- one that is patterned after a Wheel that illustrates a person's past lives as radiating out from the person's central core. Is there one like this already, or am I just making this up as I go along, guided by Meewah's excellent commentary?

Peace,

Melvis








Rhiannon
02 Sep 2001

Just as an interesting sidelight to the conversation...

If anyone gets a chance to watch the re-runs of the TNT show Witchblade you should definitely watch the season finale. It has a very interesting view point on TIME and whether or not it is linear. Spawned several interesting existential conversations for me.

Enjoy!
Rhiannon :)








truthsayer
02 Sep 2001

a good spread i can recommend that includes past life info is the "spirits of the circle spread". i found this spread in the druid animal oracle that includes a position that is called the "spirit of the journey". it's concerned about how we are influenced by the accumulated experience of our previous lives. i've only done the spread w/ the DAO but i don't see why it can't be used in tarot also. i found it to be an excellent spread that seemed to guide me to places other spreads haven't. i'll try to give you an explanation of how the cards are set up.

2...7...4
.....1....
5....6...3

1= reps self(like a significator)above and below are the influencing forces on self.
2= spirit of the ancestors.how the genes of our ancestors influence us.
3= spirit of the tribe. how the culture in which we were raised affects us.
4=spirit of time. how the time we were born and the times we are living in affect us.
5=spirit of place. influences of where we were born and where we spend our lives.

the 4 cards above(excluding the self card) are particular to our present incarnation.

6=spirit of the journey. how accumulated experience of our previous lives influence us.
7=Awen-the gift/blessing, grace of the gods over which we have little control.

the SotC spread is used to gain insights into the influences into our lives and how to best use the gifts/challenges that each of the 6 forces provide.








Melvis
02 Sep 2001

That sounds like a great spread, truthsayer. (You always seem to come up with new ones that I can't wait to try!) I like how it illuminates the different aspects of the culture you were born into with the 'tribe' and 'place' positions.

<>

I'm rushing right home to try it out! ;D

Peace,

Melvis








MeeWah
02 Sep 2001

Melvis: Thanks for the kind words, but I like your checkerboard concept in terms of movement! The Wheel could be the pattern or map of a soul's journeys; a sort of a spiritual CD. Or maybe that pertains to a historical record as well, like the Akashic Records.
Being able to move backwards & forwards, sideways & diagonally (in time & space or whatever) seems conceivable. It may be a simple matter of aligning thought with will &/or rearranging the molecular structure. The 3-dimensional realm includes time & space, both of which cause limitations in movement. Ease of movement seems to involve inter-dimensions or alternate realities where those qualities are not determining factors. Or if they exist, they do not hinder.
After all, if at least 3 levels of consciousnesses or alternate realities
are known to reside in the individual human physical body, & that body's person can move between those levels, then surely there can be movement on a larger or a different scale, or between one life & another.
I was 19 when I dreamt of a huge tapestry that looked like an Oriental rug. It had what looked like a regular pattern. Upon closer inspection, I realized it was composed of a myriad of intricate designs, & each design was different.
In dreams one sometimes has that all-encompassing understanding, & it was so in this dream. Although from several feet away the tapestry looked like a carpet, & an old one at that, I understood it to be a representation of me. A part of me remembered I was "only 19". I was aware the tapestry was too big to see the whole of it--I could only see it piecemeal style, as in examining a small portion of it at a time. Each design depicted a life. There was an impression of a life in Persia (an ancient name for Iran); the others weren't so obvious or I forgot upon awakening.
Since that dream, I had at least one or two other dreams that referred to Persia; also a real-life experience with that reference.
Perhaps the finite view we "adopt" in this realm prevents us from seeing the "big picture" which would tell us what the past lives were/are. It may also be a type of fail-safe mechanism, to shield us from too much knowledge, as depending on the knowledge, it could hinder the progress.
Rhiannon: AHA!! Are you a "Witchblade" fan, too?
Prior to the season finale, there was an episode a few weeks before that which dealt with the concept of time. I passed out & awoke during the latter part of it, but it was fascinating! I am currently veryvery slowly working my way through the episodes. There was a marathon airing of all its episodes last Sunday, & hubby graciously agreed to tape them all for me. The quality is a bit uneven, having crammed/taped them on extended play; however, I am still thrilled--I have not seen them all due to this habit of conking out early.








Rhiannon
02 Sep 2001

MeeWah: You're right! I realized that today when I said to myself "I'm a dolt! I posted the wrong episode!" LOL The one I REALLY meant was the one entitled "the periculum" in it Sara Pezzini has to face her past incarnations to become a true wielder.

God I'm such a Sci Fi geek! But I really LOVE this show! It deals with so many cool philosophical issues, the lead character is a grrl who kicks @ss, it has swords, really cool special effects and an awesome soundtrack! (Although I must admit that Eric Etebari who plays Nottingham has alot to do with my watching the show as well ;) )

truthsayer: I love new spreads. :D Count me in on trying this one. Thanks for posting it!

Rhiannon :)








MeeWah
02 Sep 2001

Andrew: Sorry, I meant to respond sooner on your question.
Do not know that this will be of any help to you, but I've gotten past life impressions from the Celtic Cross spread. I do not actively seek such information; as far as I know, have no control over it, but have found the card under Positions 1 & 2, which I refer to as Position 4 (Unconscious awareness; past foundations) seems to work in this area, at times. There are sometimes supportive cards elsewhere in the spread, but I cannot point to any specific positions as there is an initial impression when viewing the spread, & a combination of impressions from the querent & the spread. I do not ask for the querent to tell me the nature of his concern or question but rely on the cards to tell me what they will so the results can be interesting.
Way back on the old forums, a member posted such a spread. I may have it, & will look for it tomorrow.
I would be very careful in actively seeking past life information, particularly how it relates to someone else. As with any knowledge, the purpose of the material is significant, as the information itself can be either helpful or not, depending on the individual or the querent. Knowledge is a two-edged sword & is accompanied by responsibility.








Kimon
03 Sep 2001

Quote:tigerlily (01 Sep, 2001 23:59):
I have one problem with past lives: time. You know, in every new age book we?re told that time is actually an illusion and that in reality, there is no time - or all times are now... and we create past, present and future in our mind.

So, suppose after my death I find myself on the other side where I realize that there is actually no time. That means that from this meta-plane I can have access to every era on this physical plane, right? So, my last incarnation could be in 2455 and now I?m here in 2001, my next incarnation could be in the Bronze age.

Now I wonder why in all those regression sessions you seem to progress by the timline in your history book? First you are someone in Old Egypt, the Rome, then the Middle Ages....

And, if there is no time at all, no before and after, how does your soul "develop"? How can you first be not enlightened and then "reach" (which involves movement, hence time) enlightenment?

Sorry, this has nothing to do with your question... but it?s bugging me for some time now.


Hello Tigerlily,
a very interesting book is Ouspensky?s "Tertium Organum", which talks about dimensions and time.
Basically time is connected and generated by movement, as you say.
But, and that?s important, movement is not affected by or related to time.
Time is just a symptom of movement reflected by our senses, movement is the reality of matter. No matter (so no movement) no time. But only in this sequence, not the other way round.
That means interiour development of the not-material soul doesnt happen in or with time.
Space and time are connected, being time the effect of space. The soul is spaceless to our senses, so there is no effect of its movements or developments that could be felt by us as time.
Greetings,
Kimon








Kimon
03 Sep 2001

Hello,
to the topic of this thread: I do some readings about the (only one, the last) past life, the present one and the coming one.
There is no time that I can see, I just can see the sequence of things that happened. Also I cannot see whether the querent was a poor peasant or a marvellous egyptian priest. I can only see the development of this life, but from a character, inside point of view, call it soul maybe; its just the way the person took and its effects. No dates, no countries, no profession, no gender even seems to be important on that level.
Anyway this is not the purpose of these readings, also not the future life, because the purpose of these readings and the central point is the present life, that can be seen in a larger context and evolution.
Greetings,
Kimon








Jimilyn
03 Sep 2001

Oh, my! My poor head is spinning! :D

This is definitely a topic past my first grade teacher mentality. :p

LOL!

Jimilyn








truthsayer
03 Sep 2001

i agree that the only point in looking at past lives is not to get individual ideas of who you were--at last count, i think there were at least 1000 former cleopatras or julius caesar's world wide--but to look at the big picture of how you are growing spiritually and where's the next area of interest on this tour of duty. it's nice to have a clue where your past journey is taking you in this moment. it doesn't matter about moments that may or may not have occured centuries ago. our culture is so convoluted w/ so much info about differents societies, histories, and ideas, i believe that this makes it nearly impossible for an accurate past life reading b/c our minds want to make us happy by coming up w/ something or not coming up w/ anything. i've had past life readings done and i have very little faith that what i came up w/ really happened. i know i do have an excellent imagination and memory so statistically that skews me as a test subject.

i'll never forget this time i went w/ a friend to see a psychic. the lady came out w/ my friend when they finished. she took one look at me and started babbling how she wanted tell me the very imp info she had to give me about a prior incarnation as a fairy in Mu. but of course, her fee was X$ before she could tell me. at least i could smell moo when confronted w/ it. ;D i have curiosity but not X$ worth. the magic of tv makes it much more difficult to know a con.








GeminiLady
04 Sep 2001

Just as a little side bar here, I tried out the past life spread from the Power Tarot book on a good friend.

Well, she asked for her "soul's strongest life" and there seemed to be a lot of religious/psychic things going on. The best part was that in her spot for the occupation-the lovers card came up...

After all the religious stuff that surrounded the rest of the reading, I tend to focus on the angel on that card as giving a blessing and a indication that maybe she had ability to preform a marriage ceremony(possibly some type of a priestess)....either that or she was a hooker...HAHAHA...

just thought I'd share that, it was pretty funny at the time--and btw I don't really think she was a hooker, but it was too good to resist...

Love and Light,
Gem








Major Tom
04 Sep 2001

Quote:tigerlily (01 Sep, 2001 23:59):
I have one problem with past lives: time. You know, in every new age book we?re told that time is actually an illusion and that in reality, there is no time - or all times are now... and we create past, present and future in our mind.

So, suppose after my death I find myself on the other side where I realize that there is actually no time. That means that from this meta-plane I can have access to every era on this physical plane, right? So, my last incarnation could be in 2455 and now I?m here in 2001, my next incarnation could be in the Bronze age.

Now I wonder why in all those regression sessions you seem to progress by the timline in your history book? First you are someone in Old Egypt, the Rome, then the Middle Ages....

And, if there is no time at all, no before and after, how does your soul "develop"? How can you first be not enlightened and then "reach" (which involves movement, hence time) enlightenment?

Sorry, this has nothing to do with your question... but it?s bugging me for some time now.

Space and time are illusions - in this you are right. If you stand outside the illusion you will see that all your incarnations exist at once. MeeWah is right that it's easier to think of them in sequence. I forget who wrote the Seth books but these described the situation very well. }>








truthsayer
04 Sep 2001

jane roberts wrote the seth materials.








Demon Goddess
05 Sep 2001

Wow, interesting conversation.

I'd not thought about it before and nobody as yet has asked me about past lives. But now that I think about it, how do I read something I don't believe in?

I figure we're born, we die, that's it.

I'd have a hard time with a past life reading... Do people often ask for that sort of thing? Should I bother learning how to do one?








purplelady
05 Sep 2001

Kimon (04 Sep, 2001 09:25):
Quote:tigerlily (01 Sep, 2001 23:59):
I have one problem with past lives: time. You know, in every new age book we?re told that time is actually an illusion and that in reality, there is no time - or all times are now... and we create past, present and future in our mind.

Basically time is connected and generated by movement, as you say.
But, and that?s important, movement is not affected by or related to time.
Time is just a symptom of movement reflected by our senses, movement is the reality of matter. No matter (so no movement) no time. But only in this sequence, not the other way round.
Greetings,
Kimon

Then that would explain why time ceases to exist at and beyond the speed of light. Our physical universe And time cannot exist at that speed ? (I watched p.b.s.'s "Nova" the other day! Called something like "the time machine" Where various scientists and astronomers give their views on whether time travel is possible. We really know SO little on this and there is so much yet to learn! :) .








Melvis
05 Sep 2001

Kimon: I've never heard that perspective on time and space before...fascinating concept! I think that book by Ouspensky will be the next one on my wish list.

Meewah: It sounds to me like you have some really epic dreams! ;) Your tapestry dream reminds me vaguely of a book I read a long time ago called Weaveworld by Clive Barker. I don't remember much about the book, but I do recall something about a carpet where more was going on in its design than meets the eye. :)

Also, I tried out Truthsayer's Spirits of the Circle spread with the new Shining Tribe Tarot by Rachel Pollack and it almost made me cry it was so uplifting. (Of course, I must remember that when I read for myself I have a fool for a client, so I was probably seeing what I wanted to see! ;P ) I think it might be a good reading for those like Demon Goddess who have trouble with the Past Lives idea itself. This spread emphasizes the *effect* that past lives have on your current life but it doesn't go into details on when or where those past lives took place. For me, it seemed like I was able to learn from the past while focusing on the (present) future.

Peace,

Melvis








Rhiannon
05 Sep 2001

Demon Goddess,

I did a past life spread for myself once and someone offered (very nicely) to interpret it for me. After they did so I asked if it was possible that the cards refered to a past SITUATION as opposed to a past LIFE. The cards were so true to things that had happened to me in the past in THIS life.

He said "you've already answered your own question". He explained that until you conquer the things that are holding you back you are bound to repeat them (I'm paraphrasing here, so I'm sorry if that's not completely accurate to what he said ;) ).

If you don't believe in past lives you could look at these spread as past situations and the lessons that we should learn from them instead. That would work too. Either way you want to stop history from repeating itself, especially in the case of something bad happening over and over. Good luck!

Also, Major Tom: I love that concept. That is what that episode of Witchblade was talking about. Time being like a roll of film. I believe she said "If the film is wound just so then the cells touch. Each cell by itself is a whole world. But sometimes they overlap, and when you stretch the film out you get the ILLUSION of continuity". It was something like that. Very cool! Loved that analogy. Made it much easier to understand. K, enuff sci fi geek stuff 4 now.

Rhiannon :)








Major Tom
05 Sep 2001

Quote:Demon Goddess (06 Sep, 2001 03:45):
Wow, interesting conversation.

I'd not thought about it before and nobody as yet has asked me about past lives. But now that I think about it, how do I read something I don't believe in?

I figure we're born, we die, that's it.

I'd have a hard time with a past life reading... Do people often ask for that sort of thing? Should I bother learning how to do one?

Some people do - some people don't. Don't bother learning unless you want to. }>








Demon Goddess
05 Sep 2001

Thanks Rhiannon, that makes great sense.








tiger lily
07 Sep 2001

Wow, this thread has grown since I left...

Kimon, I don?t see how movement can happen independently from time - movement is a change of location; location is determined by your position in space; space and time are a continuum, so if there?s space, there?s time.

Let?s say there?s a glass standing on the table; and a second glass in your hand. You can?t put this glass at the same spot as the first one - you can put it next to it or above it, but it can?t have it at the same place; you have first to remove the other glass.

But if time ceased to exist - that is, all times existing at once - you?d suddenly be presented with the paradox that both glasses would occupy the same space simultaneously. Which can?t be. So, the moment that time ceases to exists, space would cease to exist, too. We?d have a singularity, like before the Big Bang.

I don?t think that the material world, complete with time and space, is an illusion. I think it is as real as all the other planes.
I think (and it?s late here, so be patient with my poor, tired brain ;-) ) that since we have time only here, in this world, that only here things like development, learning and creation are possible.

I think that when we die and "pass over", there isn?t much we can actually *do* over there. Everything is possible, but only as potential; to manifest this potential, to actualize it, we must come here, into this world of creation.

So I don?t think that we are "already enlightened"; we have the potential, but to make it real, we have to reach enlightenment here. Which means we?ll be around for a very long time ;-)








jade
08 Sep 2001

not if you don't believe in it. you can only teach what you know to be true.

jade








Zoe
09 Sep 2001

been out of town and missed much on the forum; wanted to SHARE, I took a workshop on past lives using the tarot (not spreads) with the NY Tarot School. It was awsome! I will try to get qualified to do readings in a post workshop. However, I cheated and did a reading in Maine for a desparate woman and I felt real good about the outcome. The facilitator is just a guide, the querent does all the work in this venue. I watched her SEE and guided her along. It was a most splendid opportunity to practice and we did it at the Ocean in the Sunshine. If anyone is interested, check out the school and I am up for some practice








The Past Lives thread was originally posted on 31 Aug 2001 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.
 

MeeWah

Tigerlily: There was a discussion on this many moons ago; I wish it was still available!!
In our finite & linear reality, I can see the timeline as a necessary & a convenient device for points of reference. There is a natural progression to things, or things occur in some order. Theoretically (for lack of a better term) & for purposes of understanding the implications of multiple incarnations or Karma, it does not seem to make sense to go thither & yon nor jump back & forth through time & space as it creates confusion. In order to understand the development or maturation of an individual, it helps to look at it as from Point A to Point B, & so on.
BTW: In Spirit, there is also no space, which would explain how readings at a distance can be done.
In terms of seeing a person's "history", perhaps it is like a wheel, with the center of the wheel the nucleus/soul & the various spokes radiating from the center, the lives. After each lifetime, the entity returns to its source or point of origin from whence it may venture forth again.
10-The Wheel of Fortune does not merely pertain to a stage or a particular phase of one's life. It is The Wheel of Life & also refers to the Wheel of Karma; cause & effect, action & reaction.
Melvis: That is a very interesting analogy, that of the Chinese Checkers.
It reminds me of a dream from years ago. My then hubby & I were standing next to each other on round white "stepping stones" that bore numbers. Sometimes we had to step around each other to get to a place. Sometimes we were near each other or in view of each other; other times we lost sight of each other.
 

Melvis

Meewah, I think I'll hop my little blue chinese checker marble over to your Wheel of Karma...it makes more sense than my scatterbrained checkerboard! I guess that's me, jumping all over the place...

You know, that could be a new Spread, just as you've described it -- one that is patterned after a Wheel that illustrates a person's past lives as radiating out from the person's central core. Is there one like this already, or am I just making this up as I go along, guided by Meewah's excellent commentary?

Peace,

Melvis
 

Rhiannon

Just as an interesting sidelight to the conversation...

If anyone gets a chance to watch the re-runs of the TNT show Witchblade you should definitely watch the season finale. It has a very interesting view point on TIME and whether or not it is linear. Spawned several interesting existential conversations for me.

Enjoy!
Rhiannon :)
 

truthsayer

a good spread i can recommend that includes past life info is the "spirits of the circle spread". i found this spread in the druid animal oracle that includes a position that is called the "spirit of the journey". it's concerned about how we are influenced by the accumulated experience of our previous lives. i've only done the spread w/ the DAO but i don't see why it can't be used in tarot also. i found it to be an excellent spread that seemed to guide me to places other spreads haven't. i'll try to give you an explanation of how the cards are set up.

2...7...4
.....1....
5....6...3

1= reps self(like a significator)above and below are the influencing forces on self.
2= spirit of the ancestors.how the genes of our ancestors influence us.
3= spirit of the tribe. how the culture in which we were raised affects us.
4=spirit of time. how the time we were born and the times we are living in affect us.
5=spirit of place. influences of where we were born and where we spend our lives.

the 4 cards above(excluding the self card) are particular to our present incarnation.

6=spirit of the journey. how accumulated experience of our previous lives influence us.
7=Awen-the gift/blessing, grace of the gods over which we have little control.

the SotC spread is used to gain insights into the influences into our lives and how to best use the gifts/challenges that each of the 6 forces provide.
 

Melvis

That sounds like a great spread, truthsayer. (You always seem to come up with new ones that I can't wait to try!) I like how it illuminates the different aspects of the culture you were born into with the 'tribe' and 'place' positions.

<>

I'm rushing right home to try it out! ;D

Peace,

Melvis








MeeWah
02 Sep 2001

Melvis: Thanks for the kind words, but I like your checkerboard concept in terms of movement! The Wheel could be the pattern or map of a soul's journeys; a sort of a spiritual CD. Or maybe that pertains to a historical record as well, like the Akashic Records.
Being able to move backwards & forwards, sideways & diagonally (in time & space or whatever) seems conceivable. It may be a simple matter of aligning thought with will &/or rearranging the molecular structure. The 3-dimensional realm includes time & space, both of which cause limitations in movement. Ease of movement seems to involve inter-dimensions or alternate realities where those qualities are not determining factors. Or if they exist, they do not hinder.
After all, if at least 3 levels of consciousnesses or alternate realities
are known to reside in the individual human physical body, & that body's person can move between those levels, then surely there can be movement on a larger or a different scale, or between one life & another.
I was 19 when I dreamt of a huge tapestry that looked like an Oriental rug. It had what looked like a regular pattern. Upon closer inspection, I realized it was composed of a myriad of intricate designs, & each design was different.
In dreams one sometimes has that all-encompassing understanding, & it was so in this dream. Although from several feet away the tapestry looked like a carpet, & an old one at that, I understood it to be a representation of me. A part of me remembered I was "only 19". I was aware the tapestry was too big to see the whole of it--I could only see it piecemeal style, as in examining a small portion of it at a time. Each design depicted a life. There was an impression of a life in Persia (an ancient name for Iran); the others weren't so obvious or I forgot upon awakening.
Since that dream, I had at least one or two other dreams that referred to Persia; also a real-life experience with that reference.
Perhaps the finite view we "adopt" in this realm prevents us from seeing the "big picture" which would tell us what the past lives were/are. It may also be a type of fail-safe mechanism, to shield us from too much knowledge, as depending on the knowledge, it could hinder the progress.
Rhiannon: AHA!! Are you a "Witchblade" fan, too?
Prior to the season finale, there was an episode a few weeks before that which dealt with the concept of time. I passed out & awoke during the latter part of it, but it was fascinating! I am currently veryvery slowly working my way through the episodes. There was a marathon airing of all its episodes last Sunday, & hubby graciously agreed to tape them all for me. The quality is a bit uneven, having crammed/taped them on extended play; however, I am still thrilled--I have not seen them all due to this habit of conking out early.








Rhiannon
02 Sep 2001

MeeWah: You're right! I realized that today when I said to myself "I'm a dolt! I posted the wrong episode!" LOL The one I REALLY meant was the one entitled "the periculum" in it Sara Pezzini has to face her past incarnations to become a true wielder.

God I'm such a Sci Fi geek! But I really LOVE this show! It deals with so many cool philosophical issues, the lead character is a grrl who kicks @ss, it has swords, really cool special effects and an awesome soundtrack! (Although I must admit that Eric Etebari who plays Nottingham has alot to do with my watching the show as well ;) )

truthsayer: I love new spreads. :D Count me in on trying this one. Thanks for posting it!

Rhiannon :)








MeeWah
02 Sep 2001

Andrew: Sorry, I meant to respond sooner on your question.
Do not know that this will be of any help to you, but I've gotten past life impressions from the Celtic Cross spread. I do not actively seek such information; as far as I know, have no control over it, but have found the card under Positions 1 & 2, which I refer to as Position 4 (Unconscious awareness; past foundations) seems to work in this area, at times. There are sometimes supportive cards elsewhere in the spread, but I cannot point to any specific positions as there is an initial impression when viewing the spread, & a combination of impressions from the querent & the spread. I do not ask for the querent to tell me the nature of his concern or question but rely on the cards to tell me what they will so the results can be interesting.
Way back on the old forums, a member posted such a spread. I may have it, & will look for it tomorrow.
I would be very careful in actively seeking past life information, particularly how it relates to someone else. As with any knowledge, the purpose of the material is significant, as the information itself can be either helpful or not, depending on the individual or the querent. Knowledge is a two-edged sword & is accompanied by responsibility.








Kimon
03 Sep 2001

Quote:tigerlily (01 Sep, 2001 23:59):
I have one problem with past lives: time. You know, in every new age book we?re told that time is actually an illusion and that in reality, there is no time - or all times are now... and we create past, present and future in our mind.

So, suppose after my death I find myself on the other side where I realize that there is actually no time. That means that from this meta-plane I can have access to every era on this physical plane, right? So, my last incarnation could be in 2455 and now I?m here in 2001, my next incarnation could be in the Bronze age.

Now I wonder why in all those regression sessions you seem to progress by the timline in your history book? First you are someone in Old Egypt, the Rome, then the Middle Ages....

And, if there is no time at all, no before and after, how does your soul "develop"? How can you first be not enlightened and then "reach" (which involves movement, hence time) enlightenment?

Sorry, this has nothing to do with your question... but it?s bugging me for some time now.


Hello Tigerlily,
a very interesting book is Ouspensky?s "Tertium Organum", which talks about dimensions and time.
Basically time is connected and generated by movement, as you say.
But, and that?s important, movement is not affected by or related to time.
Time is just a symptom of movement reflected by our senses, movement is the reality of matter. No matter (so no movement) no time. But only in this sequence, not the other way round.
That means interiour development of the not-material soul doesnt happen in or with time.
Space and time are connected, being time the effect of space. The soul is spaceless to our senses, so there is no effect of its movements or developments that could be felt by us as time.
Greetings,
Kimon








Kimon
03 Sep 2001

Hello,
to the topic of this thread: I do some readings about the (only one, the last) past life, the present one and the coming one.
There is no time that I can see, I just can see the sequence of things that happened. Also I cannot see whether the querent was a poor peasant or a marvellous egyptian priest. I can only see the development of this life, but from a character, inside point of view, call it soul maybe; its just the way the person took and its effects. No dates, no countries, no profession, no gender even seems to be important on that level.
Anyway this is not the purpose of these readings, also not the future life, because the purpose of these readings and the central point is the present life, that can be seen in a larger context and evolution.
Greetings,
Kimon








Jimilyn
03 Sep 2001

Oh, my! My poor head is spinning! :D

This is definitely a topic past my first grade teacher mentality. :p

LOL!

Jimilyn








truthsayer
03 Sep 2001

i agree that the only point in looking at past lives is not to get individual ideas of who you were--at last count, i think there were at least 1000 former cleopatras or julius caesar's world wide--but to look at the big picture of how you are growing spiritually and where's the next area of interest on this tour of duty. it's nice to have a clue where your past journey is taking you in this moment. it doesn't matter about moments that may or may not have occured centuries ago. our culture is so convoluted w/ so much info about differents societies, histories, and ideas, i believe that this makes it nearly impossible for an accurate past life reading b/c our minds want to make us happy by coming up w/ something or not coming up w/ anything. i've had past life readings done and i have very little faith that what i came up w/ really happened. i know i do have an excellent imagination and memory so statistically that skews me as a test subject.

i'll never forget this time i went w/ a friend to see a psychic. the lady came out w/ my friend when they finished. she took one look at me and started babbling how she wanted tell me the very imp info she had to give me about a prior incarnation as a fairy in Mu. but of course, her fee was X$ before she could tell me. at least i could smell moo when confronted w/ it. ;D i have curiosity but not X$ worth. the magic of tv makes it much more difficult to know a con.








GeminiLady
04 Sep 2001

Just as a little side bar here, I tried out the past life spread from the Power Tarot book on a good friend.

Well, she asked for her "soul's strongest life" and there seemed to be a lot of religious/psychic things going on. The best part was that in her spot for the occupation-the lovers card came up...

After all the religious stuff that surrounded the rest of the reading, I tend to focus on the angel on that card as giving a blessing and a indication that maybe she had ability to preform a marriage ceremony(possibly some type of a priestess)....either that or she was a hooker...HAHAHA...

just thought I'd share that, it was pretty funny at the time--and btw I don't really think she was a hooker, but it was too good to resist...

Love and Light,
Gem








Major Tom
04 Sep 2001

Quote:tigerlily (01 Sep, 2001 23:59):
I have one problem with past lives: time. You know, in every new age book we?re told that time is actually an illusion and that in reality, there is no time - or all times are now... and we create past, present and future in our mind.

So, suppose after my death I find myself on the other side where I realize that there is actually no time. That means that from this meta-plane I can have access to every era on this physical plane, right? So, my last incarnation could be in 2455 and now I?m here in 2001, my next incarnation could be in the Bronze age.

Now I wonder why in all those regression sessions you seem to progress by the timline in your history book? First you are someone in Old Egypt, the Rome, then the Middle Ages....

And, if there is no time at all, no before and after, how does your soul "develop"? How can you first be not enlightened and then "reach" (which involves movement, hence time) enlightenment?

Sorry, this has nothing to do with your question... but it?s bugging me for some time now.

Space and time are illusions - in this you are right. If you stand outside the illusion you will see that all your incarnations exist at once. MeeWah is right that it's easier to think of them in sequence. I forget who wrote the Seth books but these described the situation very well. }>








truthsayer
04 Sep 2001

jane roberts wrote the seth materials.








Demon Goddess
05 Sep 2001

Wow, interesting conversation.

I'd not thought about it before and nobody as yet has asked me about past lives. But now that I think about it, how do I read something I don't believe in?

I figure we're born, we die, that's it.

I'd have a hard time with a past life reading... Do people often ask for that sort of thing? Should I bother learning how to do one?








purplelady
05 Sep 2001

Kimon (04 Sep, 2001 09:25):
Quote:tigerlily (01 Sep, 2001 23:59):
I have one problem with past lives: time. You know, in every new age book we?re told that time is actually an illusion and that in reality, there is no time - or all times are now... and we create past, present and future in our mind.

Basically time is connected and generated by movement, as you say.
But, and that?s important, movement is not affected by or related to time.
Time is just a symptom of movement reflected by our senses, movement is the reality of matter. No matter (so no movement) no time. But only in this sequence, not the other way round.
Greetings,
Kimon

Then that would explain why time ceases to exist at and beyond the speed of light. Our physical universe And time cannot exist at that speed ? (I watched p.b.s.'s "Nova" the other day! Called something like "the time machine" Where various scientists and astronomers give their views on whether time travel is possible. We really know SO little on this and there is so much yet to learn! :) .








Melvis
05 Sep 2001

Kimon: I've never heard that perspective on time and space before...fascinating concept! I think that book by Ouspensky will be the next one on my wish list.

Meewah: It sounds to me like you have some really epic dreams! ;) Your tapestry dream reminds me vaguely of a book I read a long time ago called Weaveworld by Clive Barker. I don't remember much about the book, but I do recall something about a carpet where more was going on in its design than meets the eye. :)

Also, I tried out Truthsayer's Spirits of the Circle spread with the new Shining Tribe Tarot by Rachel Pollack and it almost made me cry it was so uplifting. (Of course, I must remember that when I read for myself I have a fool for a client, so I was probably seeing what I wanted to see! ;P ) I think it might be a good reading for those like Demon Goddess who have trouble with the Past Lives idea itself. This spread emphasizes the *effect* that past lives have on your current life but it doesn't go into details on when or where those past lives took place. For me, it seemed like I was able to learn from the past while focusing on the (present) future.

Peace,

Melvis








Rhiannon
05 Sep 2001

Demon Goddess,

I did a past life spread for myself once and someone offered (very nicely) to interpret it for me. After they did so I asked if it was possible that the cards refered to a past SITUATION as opposed to a past LIFE. The cards were so true to things that had happened to me in the past in THIS life.

He said "you've already answered your own question". He explained that until you conquer the things that are holding you back you are bound to repeat them (I'm paraphrasing here, so I'm sorry if that's not completely accurate to what he said ;) ).

If you don't believe in past lives you could look at these spread as past situations and the lessons that we should learn from them instead. That would work too. Either way you want to stop history from repeating itself, especially in the case of something bad happening over and over. Good luck!

Also, Major Tom: I love that concept. That is what that episode of Witchblade was talking about. Time being like a roll of film. I believe she said "If the film is wound just so then the cells touch. Each cell by itself is a whole world. But sometimes they overlap, and when you stretch the film out you get the ILLUSION of continuity". It was something like that. Very cool! Loved that analogy. Made it much easier to understand. K, enuff sci fi geek stuff 4 now.

Rhiannon :)








Major Tom
05 Sep 2001

Quote:Demon Goddess (06 Sep, 2001 03:45):
Wow, interesting conversation.

I'd not thought about it before and nobody as yet has asked me about past lives. But now that I think about it, how do I read something I don't believe in?

I figure we're born, we die, that's it.

I'd have a hard time with a past life reading... Do people often ask for that sort of thing? Should I bother learning how to do one?

Some people do - some people don't. Don't bother learning unless you want to. }>








Demon Goddess
05 Sep 2001

Thanks Rhiannon, that makes great sense.








tiger lily
07 Sep 2001

Wow, this thread has grown since I left...

Kimon, I don?t see how movement can happen independently from time - movement is a change of location; location is determined by your position in space; space and time are a continuum, so if there?s space, there?s time.

Let?s say there?s a glass standing on the table; and a second glass in your hand. You can?t put this glass at the same spot as the first one - you can put it next to it or above it, but it can?t have it at the same place; you have first to remove the other glass.

But if time ceased to exist - that is, all times existing at once - you?d suddenly be presented with the paradox that both glasses would occupy the same space simultaneously. Which can?t be. So, the moment that time ceases to exists, space would cease to exist, too. We?d have a singularity, like before the Big Bang.

I don?t think that the material world, complete with time and space, is an illusion. I think it is as real as all the other planes.
I think (and it?s late here, so be patient with my poor, tired brain ;-) ) that since we have time only here, in this world, that only here things like development, learning and creation are possible.

I think that when we die and "pass over", there isn?t much we can actually *do* over there. Everything is possible, but only as potential; to manifest this potential, to actualize it, we must come here, into this world of creation.

So I don?t think that we are "already enlightened"; we have the potential, but to make it real, we have to reach enlightenment here. Which means we?ll be around for a very long time ;-)








jade
08 Sep 2001

not if you don't believe in it. you can only teach what you know to be true.

jade








Zoe
09 Sep 2001

been out of town and missed much on the forum; wanted to SHARE, I took a workshop on past lives using the tarot (not spreads) with the NY Tarot School. It was awsome! I will try to get qualified to do readings in a post workshop. However, I cheated and did a reading in Maine for a desparate woman and I felt real good about the outcome. The facilitator is just a guide, the querent does all the work in this venue. I watched her SEE and guided her along. It was a most splendid opportunity to practice and we did it at the Ocean in the Sunshine. If anyone is interested, check out the school and I am up for some practice








The Past Lives thread was originally posted on 31 Aug 2001 in the Talking Tarot board, and is now archived in the Forum Library. Read the threads in Talking Tarot, or read more archived threads.
 

MeeWah

Melvis: Thanks for the kind words, but I like your checkerboard concept in terms of movement! The Wheel could be the pattern or map of a soul's journeys; a sort of a spiritual CD. Or maybe that pertains to a historical record as well, like the Akashic Records.
Being able to move backwards & forwards, sideways & diagonally (in time & space or whatever) seems conceivable. It may be a simple matter of aligning thought with will &/or rearranging the molecular structure. The 3-dimensional realm includes time & space, both of which cause limitations in movement. Ease of movement seems to involve inter-dimensions or alternate realities where those qualities are not determining factors. Or if they exist, they do not hinder.
After all, if at least 3 levels of consciousnesses or alternate realities
are known to reside in the individual human physical body, & that body's person can move between those levels, then surely there can be movement on a larger or a different scale, or between one life & another.
I was 19 when I dreamt of a huge tapestry that looked like an Oriental rug. It had what looked like a regular pattern. Upon closer inspection, I realized it was composed of a myriad of intricate designs, & each design was different.
In dreams one sometimes has that all-encompassing understanding, & it was so in this dream. Although from several feet away the tapestry looked like a carpet, & an old one at that, I understood it to be a representation of me. A part of me remembered I was "only 19". I was aware the tapestry was too big to see the whole of it--I could only see it piecemeal style, as in examining a small portion of it at a time. Each design depicted a life. There was an impression of a life in Persia (an ancient name for Iran); the others weren't so obvious or I forgot upon awakening.
Since that dream, I had at least one or two other dreams that referred to Persia; also a real-life experience with that reference.
Perhaps the finite view we "adopt" in this realm prevents us from seeing the "big picture" which would tell us what the past lives were/are. It may also be a type of fail-safe mechanism, to shield us from too much knowledge, as depending on the knowledge, it could hinder the progress.
Rhiannon: AHA!! Are you a "Witchblade" fan, too?
Prior to the season finale, there was an episode a few weeks before that which dealt with the concept of time. I passed out & awoke during the latter part of it, but it was fascinating! I am currently veryvery slowly working my way through the episodes. There was a marathon airing of all its episodes last Sunday, & hubby graciously agreed to tape them all for me. The quality is a bit uneven, having crammed/taped them on extended play; however, I am still thrilled--I have not seen them all due to this habit of conking out early.