Saying what you see

Grizabella

This came up in another thread but I think it's an interesting topic so I thought I'd post a thread about it here.

When I first started reading the cards and had gotten comfortable with it in my head, I then found that when I tried putting words to them for a reading, I just couldn't seem to find the words. For me, finding words to put to anything else was never hard. I'm sure people have wished it were. :p

I've seen others say that they've had the same problem so I'm wondering if it's just a normal part of learning to read for others. It's occurred to me that maybe it's a problem with learning to let the messages from the Universe flow as opposed to voicing our own "stuff".

What do others think?
 

Oddity

I think maybe it has something to do with how the brain works - I think there is a special mind-space you get into when (for example) reading cards - at least, if you read with "feeling" and not quoting text from a book...

The two hemispheres of the brain work differently, or so they say.
The left is supposedly better at logic, abstract concepts (words), linear thinking... the right is better at visual thinking and other stuff that I can't remember right now because I'm tired.
I work a lot with visual art, drawing, painting and such. I've noticed something funny... I can't talk about what I'm drawing while I'm drawing... If I'm about to explain something and start drawing to illustrate a point, then I just trail off and lose track of what I was talking about. It's very hard to draw and talk at the same time, at least if you try to do at least one of them well :)
 

Oddity

So, my point was that if you read in a way that makes you use mainly your right-side brain, then you will probably find it hard to talk at the same time :)
 

Chara

That's still a problem for me :) But I've only been reading for seven or eight years.

But like you, finding words has never been a difficulty for me...the problem is usually the other way around. ;) But when it comes to doing readings, a lot of times I get in my own way trying to "find the right way to say it".

I have another friend who reads tarot who goes, "Just stop thinking! What are the cards TELLING you?" and that's the problem...the cards don't say anything! My interpretation of the card is (usually...not always) more of an understanding, and a collection of feelings and impressions, and it's hard to put them into the words they come with, much less what they're supposed to mean!

Although, I did have a funny experience describing it with my brother once...This isn't the exact quote, but you get the idea:

Chara: You know, like...the orange is left on the windowsill and then the rainbow wind is cold on your elbow and it blows painfully in your fingers and a dog barks?
Chara's Brother: Oh, you mean that someone's ignoring something and they need to pay attention to it?
Chara: ...Yes. Exactly.

XDD Unfortunately, not everyone gets me like my brother does.


Moving past it for me has always involved shutting up and...okay, my friend was right, I do have to stop thinking. :) Especially if I get to the point where I know, "You're ignoring something and you need to refocus your attention on it." is what I need to say...I then stop and go, "Okay, so how do I say THAT?"

Eventually I stop obsessing and say what I'm supposed to say. I like reading for others face to face, because it sort of stops my behavior a little bit. Online, or reading for yourself, you can stop and stall and obsess, but when someone's sitting in front of me, waiting...I have to get over it, for them.


:D I'm interested in reading what other people have experienced with this! I didn't actually realize this was something that happened to other people.
 

Marcia959

Chara! EXACTLY! This is one of the zillion reasons I tell people that NO ONE wants to know what I really think...it's this synesthesia thing that I've learned to translate, sometimes painfully, for myself. I do the same thing at work, too.

How do you explain to someone that you don't see your cat in the spring? How do you explain that you can see crumbled glass flying toward you in slow motion and you can hear yourself scream as if it's coming from another person? What we do isn't easy. but I think it's really important, especially because it is not part of the acknowledged mainstream of western society.
 

Sinduction

I feel the same way! It makes perfect sense in my head but when I open my mouth to share that bit of wisdom....... *crickets*

I close my eyes, take a deep breath and say to myself, "Dumb it down." Which, to me, means break it down to it's absolute lowest, simplest form. Sometimes I get there and sometimes I don't. :D
 

Cat*

When I read face-to-face for others, I just start talking about my impressions, assoiations, whatever pops into my mind (that I notice). I usually don't know what's going to come out before I've heard myself say it (and surprise myself rather often). I find it helps with the fear of saying something stupid to just start talking, even if you say "well, I have no idea what this spread is saying, but let's see...hmmm..." and then pick some detail, anything that catches your attention, even if it's a so-called "book meaning," and go from there. I also often say the same thing more than once, but in different words. It's as if I need to slowly spiral into the bull's eye of the real message by rephrasing and rephrasing again.

But I do that outside of readings, too. Actually, whenever I need to find out what I think or why I'm feeling so weird or how to deal with a problem. I just start talking about it to someone patient (who really only needs to sit there and occasionally nod), and somewhere in all these words there usually is the answer. (It does work almost as good when I just write everything down, but it takes much longer.)

When I write down readings, I do the same as above, only in my head. I often scribble down notes about the cards and later sort them out into a (somewhat) coherent text for the querent. Over time I've started to directly type out the reading to minimize my filtering out of the information (not to mention that it also saves time).

When I read for myself, I usually just do the wild scribbling, often with lots of connecting arrows between the cards and asterisks with additional thoughts. I like the chaos but it makes it really hard to find some information to re-read (and sometimes I can't read my own handwriting :bugeyed:)... By the way, this is the only kind of tarot journal I keep, chaotic scribblings of my offline readings. Plus the digital copies of the readings I do up here, but I almost never look at them after I've done them.

I think Oddity has a point here, too. Sometimes, I look at a spread and immediately see the whole picture. Then it can be really difficult to break it down and put it all into words.
 

Grizabella

Yes, I think---at least for me---that that's the exact problem. So much comes at me at once and I didn't have anything else in my experience that I could refer to to help me know how to sort it out into a reading. I can't even really find the words to express the experience as I sit here thinking about it because I guess I'm so used to using my logical mind to put things into words, which is a much slower process. When I read the cards, it's all there suddenly in the image side of my mind with no need for words and then I have to try to find a way to put words to it.

Does that make any sense at all?
 

Le Fanu

Fascinating thread...

I have an additional problem which Id like to share.

My mother tongue is English, but Ive spent most of my adult life in Portuguese-speaking countries and am fluent in Portuguese. I have been interested in tarot now for over 25 years. However, all my tarot studying has been in English. I have never read anything to do with tarot in Portuguese as most of what I want to read about tarot is in English or translated; plus I read for pleasure, and I read more effortlessly in English. And, most importantly, when I look at the images, the whole unconscious stuff, just thinking about the images, processing them, what the symbols provoke, is in my mother tongue. Funny, but I never think of the cards or their images in Portuguese. Just the way my brain is. It has become set into this way of processing information.

Only recently have I begun reading for friends, and 99% of the time I have to do readings in Portuguese. There is nothing in Portuguese which I cannot express, but somehow, I find it incredibly difficult doing readings in another language, when I have processed everything in English. I really feel like Im translating (something I never feel Im doing in my day to day life) and the stuff doesn´t come out well.

The long and short of it is that the images have gone into my "English" subconscious and struggle to some out in another language. Plus it is connected to what you call the "image side of the brain". There is a lot in that...
 

rosebud_a320

What an interesting thread. I find as soon as I attempt to vocalise a thought, it evaporates. Converting a feeling or thought into language must be how you feel Le Fanu going from English to Portuguese.

The phrase 'Lost in Translation' seems apt.