The Gravenchase Lenormand

[blue_fusion]

Numbers would be easier and quicker to read than Roman Numerals...IMHO.
But the numerals would be more traditional with the Marseille influence.
But i still say Numbers would be my choice for ease of reading quickly.

Noted!

I'm also rethinking the Marseille aspect, and maybe shifting if towarss something more "vaguely medieval". We shall see.

 

[MoonGypsy]

Noted!

I'm also rethinking the Marseille aspect, and maybe shifting if towarss something more "vaguely medieval". We shall see.

You have my attention, dear Ly! i will be watching with great interest...

 

[Aster Breo]

I agree with what others have said so far.

I LOVE the art. It reminds me immediately of grave rubbings. I'd love to see it go in a more medieval direction, too.

As others have said, though, the symbols need to be easily identifiable, either by reducing the background texturing or by adding color highlighting. I have the Lenormand de Marseilles deck, which uses the technique of only coloring the symbol while leaving the background art black and white, and I really like it. It makes the symbols stand out perfectly, while still preserving the entire work of art on each card.

As for the numerals: I don't rely on the numbers at all when I read Lenormand, so I don't really care if they're numbers, numerals, or completely absent. But I can see how it could confuse tarot readers.

I'm looking forward to seeing how you develop this deck! Beautiful work!

 

[blue_fusion]

Blue Fusion, your art work is indeed fabulous! But MoonGypsy gave you some fantastic and absolutely correct advice. The Lennies, when laid out in an entire spread, need to have the card symbol immediately pop out from the background, or it is very difficult to look at and read smoothly and fluently!

I have some busier decks, and can only use them for three card dailies...when they are grouped together, as a whole, I am completely lost in visual stimuli!

I would also say that though the Roman numerals suit your style beautifully, many of us have a hard time making the leap from tarot to Lenormand, which is completely different as a reading system...the Roman numerals are very reminiscent of tarot, and may hold the reader's mind in the tarot zone...I don't know, just a personal observation.

But in the end, as MoonGypsy so accurately noted - it is your creation, your art, and while it is good to get suggestions, you have to weigh that against your personal "art boundaries" - you don't want to lose your initial drive and creative idea in a wash of opinions (all of which are likely to differ, in any case!)

You have a great idea there - and amazingly talented art to match I wish you all the pleasure and luck of creating your deck!

Thanks. I don't mind the input, in fact it helps me keep my art grounded - though of course, at the end of the day, I'll be the one making the decisions on what to include - but at least it's a decision broadened by inputs from others.

Both of you are correct: the leap from tarot to Lenormand is a bit - well, not really difficult, but I guess: oblique. It doesn't help that I have this nagging tendency to be disturbed by bare areas in my art - my response is to fill them in with details. But I think I can manage with this one.

I did attempt another Lennie last year, which I posted in this section. The problem with that had more to do with me having difficulties with the art style/look I chose for the project (though I'd want to return to that project some day). At least with the Gravenchase, my ideas for the look of the deck are more concrete - I just have to work on aligning it with the quirks of the Lenormand system.

Sorry for rambling! Anyway, thanks again for the inputs! They're helping me a lot in terms pf adjusting to the Lenormand style and system.

 

[blue_fusion]

I tried isolating the clover figure in the clover card I uploaded yesterday, and applying some of the suggestions here. It might take a couple of tries to fine-tune the amount of "noise" and texture in the background of the main figure (the process I developed for this style is a bit "indirect" so it takes a couple of steps to see how close the changes I made on the file would be to what I intended - it's a bit difficult to explain! LOL).

Having done this, the vaguely medieval theme is kinda growing on me, I just have to get used to using a "less is more" outlook for this project.

Also: bordered or borderless?

Thanks again for the inputs!

-Ly

 

[Aster Breo]

I think this is much better! :-D Although, honestly, I'd encourage you to pull back even more on the background texture and/or leave more white space around the Clover (or whichever symbol), so it stands out more.

That's most important when reading a Grand Tableau, where all 36 cards are laid out to create a "snapshot" of the querant's next 3-12 months. It's really important to be able to see the symbols at a glance. If you imagine 36 of these cards laid out in a rectangle, side to side, you can sort of see how all the background texture -- especially all together -- would make it difficult to see the symbols themselves quickly and easily.

I, personally, like the borders. But I think I'd like the border to be thicker, so it will help to break up the background texture.

Could you consider offering both bordered and borderless versions?

 

[Padma]

I love the look - no borders and yes, perhaps keep background in but mute it even more?

As we have all noted, background destroys the necessary fixation and focus needed for the symbols, when it comes to the Grand Tableau spread.

Would love to see your medieval take, as well! You are very good at your graven art, Blue_Fusion!

 

[blue_fusion]

I think this is much better! :-D Although, honestly, I'd encourage you to pull back even more on the background texture and/or leave more white space around the Clover (or whichever symbol), so it stands out more.

That's most important when reading a Grand Tableau, where all 36 cards are laid out to create a "snapshot" of the querant's next 3-12 months. It's really important to be able to see the symbols at a glance. If you imagine 36 of these cards laid out in a rectangle, side to side, you can sort of see how all the background texture -- especially all together -- would make it difficult to see the symbols themselves quickly and easily.

I, personally, like the borders. But I think I'd like the border to be thicker, so it will help to break up the background texture.

Could you consider offering both bordered and borderless versions?

Thanks for the input! Yes, it's still a work in progress. I just wanted to post my initial attempts at making changes to the image. I will actually redraw the clover as I want something with an even more medieval feel while still being recognizable as a clover.

I fully get what you're saying about the cards being indistinct from each other when laid out in a Grand Tableau. I'll try out your thicker borders idea and see if this helps. I'll also try to lessen the textures even more. Right now I'm trying to develop a texture template file for the rest of the cards so that it will still have that rustic medieval look while at the same time have easily recognizable symbols.

I plan on making the deck available via the Game Crafter, so I'll be able to offer bordered and borderless versions too.

 

[blue_fusion]

I love the look - no borders and yes, perhaps keep background in but mute it even more?

As we have all noted, background destroys the necessary fixation and focus needed for the symbols, when it comes to the Grand Tableau spread.

Would love to see your medieval take, as well! You are very good at your graven art, Blue_Fusion!

Thanks! I'll try to reduce the textures even more. And also make the outlines of the figures more distinct and recognizable.

 

[Aster Breo]

Looking at this some more, I think you might not need to reduce the background texture too much if you leave more white space between the symbol and the background. Kinda like a white outline around the symbol.

I think that would set the symbol off nicely, while retaining the textured feel.