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Indigo Rose
31-08-2007, 09:01
I have been researching the coming Saturn move into Virgo, set for September 2. I am an armchair Astrology student, so my conclusions may be way off or at best vaguely connected. I'm sure the seasoned Pros here can assist in correcting my understanding, or presenting another point of view.

With that said, this is what I've concluded to date:

*Health, disease, and food-supply issues will be front row issues through this Saturn in Virgo run. Already in the news in the past 2 days....Cholera outbreak in Iraq, and Salmonella tainted Spinach in the US. I worry that the pandemic flu, which health officials have been threatening was due to strike...may just make it's debut in this period.

*Last time Saturn was in Virgo we had some major economic and governmental shifts; I feel we can expect a repeat of these shifts. Interest rates climbing...economic losses...job losses...and the government becoming more conversative. ***added*** By conservative, I mean restrictive. I think freedoms will continue to erode, as we give way to more governmental controls...not just in the States, but in the World.

*Middle-East....I feel we will see some major power struggles intensify with Iran/Pakistan...and Israel...associated with Saturn. I feel this is one to watch for sure...big changes and concerns in this time.

*On a positive note, I feel there will be an increased ability to organize and get down to business. The work will be challenging; especially for us Mutuable folks(Pisces, Virgo, Gemini, and Sagittarius)...but will help to stabilize and make a more solid foundation when it's done.

Well that's it for now.

Input, ideas, corrections, and thoughts are needed and wanted...please share and enlighten.

Thank you. :)

:heart: IR

Indigo Rose
31-08-2007, 11:01
*Health, disease, and food-supply issues will be front row issues through this Saturn in Virgo run. Already in the news in the past 2 days....Cholera outbreak in Iraq, and Salmonella tainted Spinach in the US. I worry that the pandemic flu, which health officials have been threatening was due to strike...may just make it's debut in this period.


I was checking the news and was shocked to see that 9 people have become ill from beef sold in Washington, Oregon, and Idaho. This is the third food/disease issue to come forth in 2 days. :( It's hard to dismiss the possible link to the changing skies.

dadsnook2000
31-08-2007, 12:50
We've had food-safety problems of some note for the past year; bad spinach, tainted hamburger, lettuce that proved dangerous to eat, fish that was really unsafe to eat. Remember also that Saturn in Leo meant bad backs, heart problems, poor eye sight. In the late 70's when all of this happened last, I can remember then the tightening financial markets, increasing interest rates, a government that was downsizing the military. It all repeats.

The common sense side of things relates to the fact that these cyclic developments (Saturn into Virgo on Sept. 2nd) don't mean that the Leo things stop tomorrow and that the Virgo things start on Saturday. Signs do not have fixed, precise and rigid boundaries. It's a process, an evolving change and shift of emphasis. If you wish to argue this point then carefully consider that back in the late '70s the defined cusp of Virgo was about 40 minutes of a degree away from where it is now when you compare it to the sky's and stars above.

The point of all of this is that Virgo's health and food linkage started to have an emphasis months ago. Leo's back problems will continue for awhile as evidenced by the lack of political spine showed by politicians who can't make a decision or develop a consistent plan about the health of the nation. It seems to me that we are witnessing a "process" in which we have to do a bit of blending near the cusps of signs -- just like we fudge the value of an aspect such as a square or trine. Just some thoughts. Dave

willowfox
31-08-2007, 15:36
First, you need the chart of the nation that you wish to study, then you look to that chart to see what aspects Saturn makes and what sign position Saturn is in.
If you just take Saturn entering Virgo with no chart, then all you are doing is what the newspapers do, Sun sign astrology. Astrology has to be done very accurately to get correct results.

Food scares and health scares are always happening somewhere in the world, and always will, remember the bird flu business, after all these years it still pops up in the news now and again. Wars are another thing that are constantly happening somewhere on this planet. As is strife, starvation and all kinds of ugly goings on, when there is no other news available, then the news agencies use this stuff as fillers. So you can't put all the blame on Saturn.

Indigo Rose
01-09-2007, 06:36
don't mean that the Leo things stop tomorrow and that the Virgo things start on Saturday. Signs do not have fixed, precise and rigid boundaries. It's a process, an evolving change and shift of emphasis. ....
Dave



Food scares and health scares are always happening somewhere in the world, and always will, remember the bird flu business, after all these years it still pops up in the news now and again. Wars are another thing that are constantly happening somewhere on this planet. As is strife, starvation and all kinds of ugly goings on, when there is no other news available, then the news agencies use this stuff as fillers. So you can't put all the blame on Saturn.

Thanks Willowfox and Dave for your input. Yes, I see that is very true that the energies in Astrology don't just begin and end in a snap. There is a process of change and they flow/merge. I also agree with you, Willowfox that there are always tragedies in the world, with willing news agencies who will post this for our consumption.

I guess I was just looking at the energies of Saturn and Virgo, and based on some research I had done saw a link to Health/food/disease concerns. It seems very odd that so much news in such a short time was focused on these matters. Even today the news reports an outbreak of Congo Fever where 60 have died. There have been food scares recently....but perhaps this is part of that transitioning process Dave was mentioning. It's happening over time.

I will apply myself to learning and not attempt newspaper horoscopes. I want to have a deep and accurate understanding of Astrology.
However, as I said I am a true novice and just learning; so that is reflected in my leaps. That seems to be my learning style....reason from the broad and then narrowing in to a deeper focus. :)

Thanks again for your input.

:heart: indigo rose

willowfox
01-09-2007, 13:49
However, as I said I am a true novice and just learning; so that is reflected in my leaps. That seems to be my learning style....reason from the broad and then narrowing in to a deeper focus. :)



I know when I was learning, I wanted to know it all in a day but like anything, one step leads to another and then another. A good thing cannot be rushed and astrology is a very complicated subject to learn and has to be done methodically. It is not difficult but neither is it easy, so keep working at it and oneday you will see the light.

Indigo Rose
01-09-2007, 15:10
I know when I was learning, I wanted to know it all in a day but like anything, one step leads to another and then another. A good thing cannot be rushed and astrology is a very complicated subject to learn and has to be done methodically. It is not difficult but neither is it easy, so keep working at it and oneday you will see the light.


I bought a notebook tonight just for my Astrology studies, so I am getting serious and planning to stop just surfing the topic. Thanks for the encouragement. :)

:heart: IR

memries
02-09-2007, 00:24
Indigo Rose.. how do you do that and where do you start ? Needless to say I am in Junior Kindergarten.

Indigo Rose
02-09-2007, 06:08
Indigo Rose.. how do you do that and where do you start ? Needless to say I am in Junior Kindergarten.


:laugh: I have been a dabbler since I was 17. My old Gemini skims the surface...and my Pisces and Aries team up to make grandiose leaps...meanwhile back at the ranch my old Virgo and Saturn placements smack my hand to try and get me to dig in deeper and really learn. It's an exhausting process, which to now has landed me in the swiss cheese of Astrologcial knowledge. :( However, I am committed to trying. I mean heck with the Saturn in Virgo, perhaps this will give the added Astro influence to buckle down.

With all that said, I think Astrology is a big world of knowledge. It's ancient...tried and true...yet discarded for a time and forced into darkness. It remerged and hit the mainstream, making it accessible to almost anyone. However, as with any discipline that goes "mainstream" we want the fast-food version to get us through. That leaves us with a poor subsitute and just makes us feel like we've been fed, but really starves us and makes unhealthy. Maybe that isn't a good analogy, but it's what comes to mind.

As I'm digging into it deeper, I can see why I've been a dabbler. It's very complex and requires discipline to learn; especially to learn it well. I do desire to learn, so I'm going to keep trying. It feels like a worthy study.

I guess I would say to you, Memries, and anyone interested in it....go ahead and start where you are at now. Take it from the beginning. It's like anything else...math, science, languages, Tarot...or any worthy study....we have to have a foundation to build on. We cant reach the top, unless we've built our way there one block at a time. :)

:heart:

dadsnook2000
02-09-2007, 07:18
Having gone through all of the complexities of learning all of the various types of charting, technologies and methodologies, I agree that it is exhausting. Now that I've done that, I am going to disagree with anyone's belief that it is very complex. It doesn't have to be. It can actually be quite simple.

In the Planet Series of threads, which are indexed at the start of the Astrology Forum, I've shown some of ways in which Astrology can be easy.

** Using phase relationships for five or six combinations of planets, one can quickly scan a chart and give a sentence or two for each combination. Taken as a paragraph, this can describe a person quite well. All of this can be done without using signs or houses, just planet-to-planet phases of which their are eight and their meanings can be applied to any combination of planets.

** Once you have a set of statements about the chart, you can go back and then fill in details, if needed, using planets in signs, planets in houses, derivative houses, rulerships, etc. Each of the details will fit in with the overall statements made from the phase relationships.

** Simple rules can be applied to most charts:
1) Angular planets are strongest. The Asc. angle deals with experiences. The IC angle deals with family and values, plus the end and the start of things. The Desc. angle deals with how you project yourself to others and how you want them to relate to you. The MC angle relates to goals, how your status within the world (small and large) is projected.
2) All aspects need to be interpreted in terms of the nature of the two planets involved. Sun and Saturn are difficult, Moon and Venus are easy. The aspect modifies how the planets express themselves. Conjunctions, oppositions and squares (plus 45 and 135 degree angles) challenge us. Trines and sextiles find ways of working energies out.
3) "Houses" are generally much stronger in expression than are "Signs."
4) Orbs of influence grow and diminish as the degree of exactness increases and decreases. In a natal chart, greater orbs for aspects can be allowed. In progressed charts, orbs are need to be very tight; perhaps a half or quarter degree at most. This whole area is "gray" in nature and requires good judgment.

** There are several "main" schools of astrology that one can use.
1) Natal charts, progressed charts and transits are the primary approach taken by most early-studies students.
2) Mid-points are often used by more experienced astrologers as either a substitute for #1 or as an adjunct to #1. Solar arc usage is typically substituted for secondary progressions.
3) While most "western" astrologers use the Tropical zodiac, ancient astrology was based on the Sidereal zodiac. The Greeks and others historically messed things up when they went to the seasonal zodiac. Many historians and professional astrologers recognize that the many complexities found in today's practice of astrology are "compensations" for the flaws within some areas of usage with the Tropical zodiac. Tropical practice is fine for general usage but seems to fall apart for predictive and timing purposes.
4) Planetary cycles are highly important. Where a pair of planets conjuncted in your chart before your birth can give you a depth of understanding about how the play out in your life. Watching where a planet turns retrograde, then turns direct, then passes where it turned retrograde, and when (previously) it had passed the point where it later turned direct -- these are all important if they are at a sensitive point in your natal chart. Observing these cyclic points is more important than houses and signs in a chart, IMO. Keeping a diary of what happens when Saturn, Jupiter, Mars moves through sections of your chart will teach you a lot about astrology.

Astrology is infinite in its applications. Birth charts aren't always needed. It is possible to delineate a person's chart without using signs, houses, degrees or aspects. Just providing the sequence of planets and the Asc and MC is enough. Knowing all of these things suggests that rules and methods are less important than being flexible and open to what you see and observe. "See" means you note it but nothing much registers. "Observe" means you see it and you think about it in terms of matching it to a real life situation.

Just some more thoughts. Dave

Indigo Rose
02-09-2007, 15:01
Just some more thoughts. Dave

(((Dave))) Thank you for the GOLD MINE!! This is going into my Astro journal. I will also go through the Astro lessons here on AT.

This is an encouraging start.
Thank you, again. :D

:heart: